Help me find a fix for this keel bulge

[AndxSurf]

I am looking to buy this boat from a local marina in MI. It is a C&C 40.
One issue that I am trying to prepare for is this bulge on the keel. It is roughly 3-4" and looks like its been there for a while. How can I fix it? What do you think is the cause of it? From my recent research I am guessing a keel bolt leak.

[coopec43]

I wouldn't touch that boat with a 40ft barge pole.

[AndxSurf]

Originally Posted by coopec43

I wouldn't touch that boat with a 40ft barge pole.

Ouch. Can you explain why?

[Nauticus]

I'd have to be honest when I say I'd walk if it was free. Aside from that gaping bulge, you have a multitude of cracks that at the very least need fairing. The 2 really crappy sealant repair lines are another reason to run. For what I suspect you'll pay in repairs for this you could almost fund your first year cruising in a much more seaworthy vessel.

Fair winds [emoji569][emoji1]
..... And run Forrest run.

[C420sailor]

Never ever ever buy a boat with keel problems. What doesn’t look too bad can prove to be a five figure repair.

[roverhi]

Assume it's a lead keel. The bulge is the fairing material to smooth the rough casting of the keel. Why it bulged out like that is anybody's guess. Fix is probably fairly simple, grind down to bright metal, apply epoxy with a wire brush to get good adhesion, fair the puka you've created then paint the bottom.

Fair the crack between the glass hull and ballast with a non rigid material like Life Caulk or 4200 and sand smooth.

[AndxSurf]

Hmm. I am really liking this boat. I am guessing so far the consensus is not to buy it?

[PerfectPirate]

Andy, I have owned and sailed four different C&C's for the last 37 years, working in boatyards full of C&C's, and I have never seen a keel or keel stub looking like this. Sure, I 'm used to seeing the "C&C Smile", or cosmetic cracking along the hull-keel joint, but this is a new level of damage. The cracking at the top of the keel stub implies to me that there has been a hard grounding, probably with a sideways impact vector. I would really want to know if those cracks penetrate past the gelcoat and into the structural glass. Can you ask questions of any locals who would know the boat's history?


The dribbles down the side of the keel seem to support this line of reasoning. It looks as though the actual seal of the hull-keel joint has been broken and bilge water from inside the boat has been working its way out. This leads me to think that the bulge you are seeing means that water has penetrated the bedding of the forward keel bolt, then gone through repeated freeze/thaw cycles until it has forced the side of the keel out, probably leaving the keel bolt loose in its socket.

My second boat was a C&C 25 Mk 1. After a number of years of ownership I noticed some small bulges in the side of the keel, lower down and well away from the keel bolts. When I finally bit the bullet and ground them out, I found pockets of rust from impurities that had apparently been introduced into the metal at the time of casting. After grinding them out and filling the divots, there were no further problems. It is the only time which I have seen such a thing on a C&C and those bulges did not look anywhere near as bad, or as big, as the one in your pictures.

Can she be repaired by a good shop? Undoubtedly, but at the very least they would have to drop the keel, and I would be sure to get a professional appraisal of the work required and an estimate of the cost. Only then will you be able to judge whether she is worth the investment. There is a joy in bringing a good old boat back to life, but you need to enter the process with your eyes wide open and your enthusiasm balanced by realistic appraisals.

[Manateeman]

If you google C&C 40 keel issues you will find a huge amount of advice as the subject was specifically discussed on a number of web forums.
Please do some research first as this is a complex and expensive job.
If you decide to go forth, I’ll try to answer questions but telling you how to and how not to do this repair would take me a book to write.
Mark and the manatee crew

[PerfectPirate]

Originally Posted by Manateeman

If you google C&C 40 keel issues you will find a huge amount of advice as the subject was specifically discussed on a number of web forums.

Mark, I did google "C&C 40 Keel Issues" and got back 7 pages of links. However, while many of the links discussed issues with keels dropping off of racing boats and problems with modern keel design and structure, none of those links actually reported keel problems with C&C 40's. In fact, many of the links were to sailing magazine reviews which universally praised the C&C 40. There was one link where a C&C owner reported a problem with a rotting mast step support beam, but that was not in a 40. On the last page, there was a link to an excellent article about design/construction flaws in the keel stub of the post-1983 C&C 33 Mk II, which included a mention that similar issues could afflict the C&C 35 Mk III and the newer 41. I have also heard that a similar issue might afflict the 27 Mk V, but these were all designs from the period after George Cuthbertson had left C&C. I could find no mention of keel issues with older C&C's, nor have I ever heard of a keel failure on an older C&C. If you can provide some directed links, I would appreciate having more information.

[double u]

Originally Posted by roverhi

Assume it's a lead keel. The bulge is the fairing material to smooth the rough casting of the keel. Why it bulged out like that is anybody's guess. Fix is probably fairly simple, grind down to bright metal, apply epoxy with a wire brush to get good adhesion, fair the puka you've created then paint the bottom.

Fair the crack between the glass hull and ballast with a non rigid material like Life Caulk or 4200 and sand smooth.

...you are the seller, right?

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by AndxSurf

I am looking to buy this boat from a local marina in MI. It is a C&C 40.
One issue that I am trying to prepare for is this bulge on the keel. It is roughly 3-4" and looks like its been there for a while. How can I fix it? What do you think is the cause of it? From my recent research I am guessing a keel bolt leak.

Did you come across this thread in your research? Google "bulge & crack on lead keel"?

[NYSail]

Did you look inside in the bilge above this area...... would tell a lot I would think.

[LakeSuperior]

I will relate to you my experience and you can draw your own conclusions.

I have a like bulge (about the same size and shape) on my keel and the position not near any of the keel bolts. I have attributed it to gas pocket in the lead that subsequently filled with water. The winter freeze/thaw cycle then deformed the lead.

I believe that it is benign as it has not changed for about 15 years of continued freeze/thaw. I have ignored it's presence since it was first detected.

Will try to remember to post a photo later today.

[boatpoker]

That boat has a fully balsa cored hull. These boats are nearing end of days due to core moisture. You have a really good chance of finding serious balsa decay. It's been 15yrs since I've seen one of those with dry, sound core.

Moisture Meter Mythology and Flir thermal imager

Wet Balsa Core in Boats