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wolfgal · 31-12-2017, 14:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exile

You may have decided you need to go it alone, but I disagree that it should be on account of no man respecting you unless you had your own boat. It's no different from any other crew member, in that the respect & camaraderie follows from a healthy attitude, willingness to learn, eagerness to contribute, and patience/endurance with it comes to the inevitable challenges that are sometimes not too pleasant. The young couple in the vid seem like good examples. Of course, there are some male boat owners who inexplicably turn into 'Cap'n Blighs' once underway, but I've run across at least one female boat owner who was like that too. Maybe it's more prevalent with men, but then there are a lot more male boat owners/captains. Either way, being an a*** is definitely gender-neutral!

I've had lots of different male & female crew, and even some of my close guy friends turned out to be pretty insufferable once onboard. Little to do with sailing skill/experience, and everything to do with personality & attitude. Not really sure gender plays that much of a role, or if the relationship is intimate, platonic, or otherwise. It may not necessarily be our fault if we wind up with someone who turns out to be intolerable or disappointing, but it's definitely our responsibility to choose wisely. Even more so on the confines of a boat of course. I'd hazard a guess that most full-time sailing couples - ones who do long passages anyway - share responsibilities equally and that each one is fully capable of operating the boat independently of the other, regardless of which one may actually own the boat.

You may also find inspiring a woman sailor/vlogger who has refurbished & sails her own boat, and calls herself 'White Spot Pirates' on youTube. I know I do.

Hey Exile,

Yes, i know her videos. Her boat is Karl, right? We don't get her name in the vids, but she has merit!

You have a good point, and I do agree with you... though i am not sure we are really talking about the same thing. you speak of relationships with crew on your boat. i'm talking about being in a long-term relationship on a boat.

but that's ok... I know how captain/crew relationships can work because every captain I've ever crewed for has asked me back. And i've experienced how intimacy tends to permeate the bonds that come through the cooperation and the building of trust (required in sailing). For example, some years ago, one guy actually proposed that i stay and that he leave his wife... (i told him no)

other than one bad experience where the guy got excited beyond his wits and didn't respect me, all of my crewing experiences (and i've helped fixed stuff more than I've sailed because i'm mechanical and love tools) have been great. i know that there are very beautiful souls out there on boats, people i can get along with very, very well, etc.

so, it is not that i do not have faith in that sense... it is more this: it has to do with the fact that each boat owner has his/her definition of sailing and his/her life plan. this very fact lends him/her more weight in the decision-making process, more respect.

as far as definitions go: some boat owners are liveaboards who never leave the dock or the bay; others compete, others cruise, others sail around the world, others want to do coastal sailing, others are attracted to solitude, others to community (at the yacht club or along the way....), others prefer to fix stuff...
My point being: owning the boat allows one to decide how the boat will be used.

and when one owns his/her boat, he/she usually has a rough plan. perhaps the plan is to cross the atlantic, do the panama canal, head down the coast of South America for while before returning to the med, and all this, in, say four years. others plan to island hop and help communities build or rebuild. others plan to do the rivers or the grand loop first, then something else, then something else... from this time to that time. these plans usually fall into wished-for time frames (because we all know about how plans go on a boat).
yet, once again, the boat owner usually has an idea of all this early on in buying the boat: the proof being that the boat and its setup usually reflects his/her ambitions (when i see a boat with a wind vane, i'm not thinking coastal spurts or med sailing).

and it doesn't stop here... there is the after-plan, say to move ashore when the bones get too old, to leave the boat to the kids or grand-kids, whatever...

imagine the conversations a woman has with herself as she speaks with her boat-owner-man and hears about his plans (where, when, how, and for how long). imagine she is a woman who has dreams of a certain type of sailing and who plans to live aboard until whenever... she has to ask herself: does my plan align with his? can we make adjustments so it can work? does the time he wants to spend out there match mine? is this possible at all?

and say she adapts to him and him to her and adjustments are made, and they are happy. there is always the possibility that something unfortunate happens and she winds up without her man, and thus, without the boat, without her home. he could fall off, have a heart-attack, get ill, get old...

i know that things can be done to leave a boat to one's partner, but there are other unfortunate things, a break-up, for instance. he could get whisked away by another woman who is more intelligent, more enchanting, or who simply satisfies his desire/need for variety.

or it could be that she is whisked away by another who is more intelligent, more enchanting, or who simply satisfies her desire/need for variety (or good cooking).

if she does not own the boat, she cannot stay on the boat. if she cannot stay on the boat, she cannot remain in her home.

so it always boils down to: it is the boat owner who is truly at home in his/her boat. the boat owner can include others in his/her plans, adapt the plans, and may or may not choose to outfit the boat to meet those plans (and im' not talking about comfort; i'm talking about a wind vane). the boat owner may include another in the decision-making process, yes, but regardless the outcome, the other respects the boat owners' choice.

do you understand what i am trying to convey?

can i tell a story? three days ago i answered an advert for a boat for sale. i happen to know a whole lot about these particular boats and can easily talk hours about them. my interest in buying this boat was very serious.

well, the boat owner, after having discovered me a bit: a female who wants this boat, knows a while lot about them, who wants to sail... (and he surely saw my picture on what'sappp)... well, after all this (and it is clear from the start that i fly out there to see the boat), the guy says that he definitely wants me to fly out to see the boat and will take me for a sail yet isn't sure he wants to sell his boat after all.

Happy New Year to everyone reading this (instead of partying). I've got 15 minutes to go but really just want to brush my teeth and go to bed. Spending New Year's alone isn't sad: i'm happy to spend this time reflecting on life and talk with folks on boats!

May 2018 be kind and gentle and healthy and meaningful!

Chichi

CarinaPDX · 31-12-2017, 15:06

I have been following this thread since the beginning, and while there have been some wonderful posts, I find it a bit depressing that the Battle of the Sexes seems to be raging as much as ever.

A (slight) digression: some time ago there was a study, where two statistically identical classes of children were given to two similar teachers. One teacher was told that their class was made up of the best students in that grade, the other was told they were the worst students (neither being the truth). At the end of the year the first class was in fact far ahead of the second. It is a classic example of people living up, or down, to expectations. Another word might be "prejudice"; both teachers accepted a judgement before being able to form their own opinions, and that judgement became self-fulfilling. The lesson applies far beyond the classroom. When I read that single men are (fill in the blank), single women are (fill in the blank), or (my favorite) single men on small boats can never work out, I see that prejudice. And starting a relationship that way is likely to be self-fulfilling.

So here's a thought for a New Year's resolution: when meeting someone new, expect good things - and you will be more likely to find them. And give them time: people only blossom when they are comfortable with those around them.

I am no Polyanna. But I have spent a lifetime watching the Baby Boomers chasing after the greener grass instead of tending to the lawn in front of them. If you want people to be kind and accepting of you then try being that way yourself.

Happy New Year!

Pelagic · 01-01-2018, 03:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarinaPDX;2546294.

A (slight) digression: some time ago there was a study, where two statistically identical classes of children were given to two similar teachers. One teacher was told that their class was made up of the best students in that grade, the other was told they were the worst students (neither being the truth). At the end of the year the first class was in fact far ahead of the second. It is a classic example of people living up, or down, to expectations.

The irony of that experiment was that it was a foregone conclusion that one teacher would "push, challenge and create a level of competitiveness within the "best" students group, whereas the other teacher would nurture and reassure the "worst" class.
They both were just doing their job!

"Social Justice" is an oxymoron, ......because we automatically 'prejudge' in order to try and even out the playing field.
That is the Catch-22

Interesting experience.
I happen to be staying at the most wonderful resort hotel-spa in Hoi An Vietnam for a family reunion.

The property is good, but it is the Staff that are truly remarkable..... In the last 5 days I have experienced nothing but genuine hospitality and thier delight in asking "what more can they do"

On a level I have never experienced before at much more expensive places.

Last night at the NY Gala, I found out from the Kiwi GM that he started out in Vietnam, many years ago, volunteering at a local Orphanage.

That most of the Staff come from that orphanage after they finished thier studies and are incredibly proud of what they view as their own family hotel.

After midnight, I watched him shake hands and look deep into the eyes of every staff member, poured them all a drink and we all toasted their incredible hospitality.

After that, the staff joined in the dancing, the drinking and partied with my young nieces till 4.
Then after an hour they were all back at work. (Ah the resilience of Youth!)

Our whole family feel this was very special and the best New Years ever.
Although some came from as far as New York, we are talking about doing it again next year.

My story just reinforces Carina's point that if we simply nurture and give those around us a feeling of purpose and value, the world is a much better place.

Happy New Year!

wolfgal · 01-01-2018, 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelagic

The irony of that experiment was that it was a foregone conclusion that one teacher would "push, challenge and create a level of competitiveness within the "best" students group, whereas the other teacher would nurture and reassure the "worst" class.
They both were just doing their job!

"Social Justice" is an oxymoron, ......because we automatically 'prejudge' in order to try and even out the playing field.
That is the Catch-22

Interesting experience.
I happen to be staying at the most wonderful resort hotel-spa in Hoi An Vietnam for a family reunion.

The property is good, but it is the Staff that are truly remarkable..... In the last 5 days I have experienced nothing but genuine hospitality and thier delight in asking "what more can they do"

On a level I have never experienced before at much more expensive places.

Last night at the NY Gala, I found out from the Kiwi GM that he started out in Vietnam, many years ago, volunteering at a local Orphanage.

That most of the Staff come from that orphanage after they finished thier studies and are incredibly proud of what they view as their own family hotel.

After midnight, I watched him shake hands and look deep into the eyes of every staff member, poured them all a drink and we all toasted their incredible hospitality.

After that, the staff joined in the dancing, the drinking and partied with my young nieces till 4.
Then after an hour they were all back at work. (Ah the resilience of Youth!)

Our whole family feel this was very special and the best New Years ever.
Although some came from as far as New York, we are talking about doing it again next year.

My story just reinforces Carina's point that if we simply nurture and give those around us a feeling of purpose and value, the world is a much better place.

Happy New Year!

Beautiful!!! (as in, see you there next year!) Seriously, if only all the good folks on here could smile at one another and dance together and look into one another's eyes and share in these kinds of moments!

Reminds me of a talk given by simon S.... (let me find it real quick). Have you ever seen this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VdO7LuoBzM

So glad you spent such a trust-filled, remarkable, connection-filled New Years!
This may be the food our souls so desperately need...

john61ct · 01-01-2018, 11:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelagic

I happen to be staying at the most wonderful resort hotel-spa in Hoi An Vietnam

Link please! I'll be in the neighborhood this year...

Pelagic · 01-01-2018, 16:56

The GM only shared that info after he found out my Boss has a foundation which has had offices in Vietnam for many years, offering post graduate scholarships in thier international trade development program.

GM said ... they keep that personal history private as they don't want it to be a "tourist attraction" or garner unwanted sympathies, which I totally understand and respect.
Sorry!

Gadagirl · 01-01-2018, 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelagic

The GM only shared that info after he found out my Boss has a foundation which has had offices in Vietnam for many years, offering post graduate scholarships in thier international trade development program.

GM said ... they keep that personal history private as they don't want it to be a "tourist attraction" or garner unwanted sympathies, which I totally understand and respect.
Sorry!

? So they don't want to give out information about/or attract tourist to their resort? It's a private resort only accepting vetted guests? " the most wonderful resort hotel-spa in Hoi An Vietnam" is a secret? Not to be shared?

john61ct · 01-01-2018, 17:43

Oh well, looks like it couldn't hurt to start out at the Swiss-Belhotel Golden Sand Resort & Spa.

But it looks like David Coyle has got a better offer from La Siesta. . .

Larry Florida · 01-01-2018, 19:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gadagirl

? So they don't want to give out information about/or attract tourist to their resort? It's a private resort only accepting vetted guests? " the most wonderful resort hotel-spa in Hoi An Vietnam" is a secret? Not to be shared?

Hoi An is not big enough to keep a secret.

Philippines is cheaper and more laid back

Pelagic · 02-01-2018, 02:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry Florida

Philippines is cheaper and more laid back

This was my first time in Vietnam and Hoi An is definitely a crowded booming tourist destination especially this time of year.

But the achievements of the people, their vegan friendly diet and helpful proactive attitude is a refreshing change from the Philippines which I dearly love but is a 3rd rate tourist destination when it comes to infrastructure and tourist conveniences.

The Philippines has gone from being the Jewel of Asia to the Joke of Asia in the last 50 years. Despite such wonderful people who just blossom when given a working opportunity overseas.

Latest numbers show that 23.6% of Filipinos live BELOW the Poverty line whereas in Vietnam it has gone from about 60% in the 1990s to about 3% now.

The Philippine leaders have failed their people badly, so don't confuse laid back with disinterested.

john61ct · 02-01-2018, 05:08

Some people prefer to visit places where the locals are less ambitious and hardworking.

**weavis** · 02-01-2018, 05:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelagic

The Philippines has gone from being the Jewel of Asia to the Joke of Asia in the last 50 years. Despite such wonderful people who just blossom when given a working opportunity overseas.

The Philippine leaders have failed their people badly, so don't confuse laid back with disinterested.

I went with a colleague who purchased a condo in Cebu recently. I found that if he or I went into a store, the price for the item we wanted would be 10 times what a Filipino would pay for it.
In the end we would look at what we wanted, make a note of it and send his wife to go purchase.
Whilst the Filipino populace is struggling, they are alienating income producing avenues from foreigners by their own actions. Trying to get permits for various things is a nightmare...
But then you are aware of that.

Sad... I once though of relocating my business there but tired of being ripped off every time..