Docking long keel/heavy displacement yachts.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Fore and Aft

Coopec 43 one of my clients with a full length keel 36 footer had one of these electric outboards mounted on the transom. It worked really well kicking the transom in the direction needed.
Some full keel boats are just hard to manage in tight spaces. Recently on a full keel 32 footer we zig zagged down the marina until finally the bow swung towards open water. That owner had the yacht for 10 years and new all the tricks. But still she was hard to handle. The new owner had a mooring so the handling issue didn't matter.
Cheers

This is a good idea, and it's how I dock my boat since I removed my diesel.

My boat is smaller than yours but has the long keel and small rudder.

I use a small Mercury 5 HP 4 stroke gas outboard with 25" shaft as my main engine.

I can turn it through about 200 degrees so I can move the boat at a 90 degree angle if necessary when docking.

The outboard weighs about 58 lbs. so it's easy to remove if you want once away from the marina.

[coopec43]

The bow thruster I was thinking of are quite cheap

Watersnake T18-S Transom Mount Electric Motor
$169.99 $119.00 Club Price

https://www.bcf.com.au/boating/boats...lectric-motors

[rslifkin]

Something like that will certainly help as long as it's got enough thrust and you can figure out a good way to mount it.

[donradcliffe]

Originally Posted by coopec43

The bow thruster I was thinking of are quite cheap

Watersnake T18-S Transom Mount Electric Motor
$169.99 $119.00 Club Price

https://www.bcf.com.au/boating/boats...lectric-motors

According to the ad, that's an 18 lb thrust motor. Try pushing on your bow with 18 lb and see how it responds.

[Hudson Force]

Originally Posted by coopec43

The bow thruster I was thinking of are quite cheap

Watersnake T18-S Transom Mount Electric Motor
$169.99 $119.00 Club Price

https://www.bcf.com.au/boating/boats...lectric-motors

I'm not imagining how a bow thruster like this could work on a vessel over about 25 feet. For something near 40 feet there would need to be a supported framework to extend the device to the water, some extension of the controls, an added crew member to operate it as well as some good communication with the helmsman....'best without the yelling.

Long keel boats can be managed well with the learned skill. Many at the helm can reverse fin keel boats with the rudder far from the fin as well and as easily as steering a power boat forward. Before resorting to a bow thruster, and especially one not designed for your vessel, it would be best to learn how to maneuver a long keel boat.

This reminds me of people raised on fin keels or dagger board dinghies saying that a long or full keel boat won't come about. ...'they just never learned how to do it!

[Woody]

Forget the bow thruster. As previous posters recommended, practice and learn how to maneuver your boat expertly. Learn what is possible and what isn't. Don't be afraid to warp her in and use lines. Learn how to operate at dead slow speeds, how far your boat will carry (momentum), and learn to use the wind to your advantage. The best way to learn is to practice standing turns, which involve reversing and turning in as tight a radius as possible.


https://www.usna.edu/Sailing/_files/...ackandfill.pdf

[Cheechako]

Over the years I got comfortable with docking and exiting long keel boats, and frankly I am more comfortable with them than a fin keel. You get to know what the boat's reactions are and use them to your advantage. But, of course, there are some situations which are quite dicey, but most boats have those in some manner anyway.
One important thing is keep headway, then use reverse to stop and gun it doing so as necessary! Too many people are too slow and too cautious. Use prop walk to your advantage. It's like having an extra tool!
In tough situations, (current, wind, etc) think it through well first and have a plan B ahead also. In strong wind and current have a plan for which dock line to secure first!

[deblen]

Suggest you learn to "back & fill"-preferably away from the public eye and other boats. A boat steers only by the stern(without bowthruster)
To be confidant in docking,you must learn to maneuver it like a forklift.
Practice,...

Cheers/Len


The folks in this video have not perfected it yet,but helmsman has the right idea. That guy on deck,& the dock walkers are absolutely useless until the helmsman puts the boat against the dock. There is not a useful thing that they can do,except wave & yell,further confusing a helmsman.
Best to learn to lay your boat alongside as if you are singlehanded.
The crew then steps safely ashore with a single midship line & makes fast.
You are now tied up,boat can't move or pivot.Take your time securing other lines.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oD_WgCveuro

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W25tirNVuDE&t=175s

Be aggressive,in short bursts, with what power you have.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJVX0ZP_pig

[Don C L]

I can only speak from experience with a Downeast 38, which has a bow sprit which makes it even more interesting. As has been said, with practice you'll get the hang of it. In my case very little of the thrust went into propulsion forward, most of it went to blast the angled rudder to kick the stern one way or the other. Go VERY slowly. If you have to use reverse to slow down, you may be going too fast. And it helps a lot to have an upwind slip! I too can't imagine that electric motor working too well.

[Iron E]

Originally Posted by Don C L

I can only speak from experience with a Downeast 38, which has a bow sprit which makes it even more interesting.

I was waiting for someone to bring this up. 9ton full keel, well ...ok, But our 5ft bowsprit (and bobstay) adds a whole nother dynamics to the equation.

Sometimes I feel a little jealous watching the Catalinas and Bennies coming in

[Don C L]

Or, the more civilized way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dceYiJDQoNo

[Montanan]

Truly dislike having boat appendages overhanging the dock as they are very hazardous to person's especially if there is wave / swell causing the boat to rise and fall; similarly, as to extending into the fairway and obstruct navigation in the marina.

IMHO, the slip should accommodate the entire length of the boat, not just along the water line.*

[Ryban]

A lot of good advice given here, and you're not alone in your struggles. It took us a while to figure out how to best dock/undock our Westsail, and early on, every outing was very stressful as a result of some close calls we had in our first few attempts.

Here are my tips:

• If you have a big rudder hung aft of your pop, then short high power bursts with the rudder hard over one way or the other are extremeley effective at decreasing your turning radius without substantially increasing your forward momentum.
• Figure out which way your boat prop-walks in reverse, if you haven't already. A good way to check is to put the engine in reverse while you're tied up to the dock, and see which side of the stern more water/turbulence seems to be coming from. This should be the side of the boat that the wash is hitting your keel, and thus, the side the force will be pushing on your keel.
• Go slow and have a big stick ready.

For getting off our slip, we put the rudder hard over in the direction we want to go, and I walk the boat off the slip giving it it's initial turn. The only thing we have to watch for is our bow sprit hitting the finger pier. Usually half way out we put the boat in reverse briefly to increase our clearance and move things along.

Once we're clear of the finger, we put the rudder hard over the opposite direction, and give a short burst or two of power in forward, which swings the bow over faster. Once aligned with the channel, we just motor out.

Coming back is a little tricky at our slip since we're very close to a shoal, but we end up motoring past our slip, and doing a 360 using short power pulses in forward with the rudder hard over, and this gives us a decent turning radius. And at the end of the turn we're lined up at the right angle to get into our slip. This only works because of the unique shape of our channel, where it's a little wider on one side, and very narrow where our slip is. I don't think we could make a 360 turn this way in a normal marina environment.

When we've docked in normal marinas with equally space parallel docks, we stuck as close as possible to the opposite side coming in, and started our turn about 1.5 boat lengths away, but this will need to be practiced for your boat. That usually put us in the right spot. You can use short bursts in forward with the rudder hard over to help accelerate the turn if it's looking like you're not going to make it.

Practice out in the open by a channel marker. See if you an use combinations of prop walk in reverse, and rudder "thrust" in forward to get the boat to turn on a very tight radius.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Truly dislike having boat appendages overhanging the dock as they are very hazardous to person's especially if there is wave / swell causing the boat to rise and fall; similarly, as to extending into the fairway and obstruct navigation in the marina.

IMHO, the slip should accommodate the entire length of the boat, not just along the water line.*

That's somewhat dependent on the marina layout. Sticking out a couple feet into a narrow fairway can be a pain, but if the fairway is wide enough, it becomes almost insignificant. Same thing with overhang. On some docks any overhang at all is problematic, on others you're overhanging into space on the edges of a wider dock that's also occupied by dock boxes, power pedestals, etc. along the edges where people aren't walking, so a foot of overhang may be fine.

[Fore and Aft]

Coopec 43 that electric outboard I showed you has its own remote to control it. It also comes with a bracket to mount it on the transom. When the owner backed out of the marina berth using the remote he pivoted the outboard in the right direction and gave it a squirt. Sure enough it pushed the transom in the right direction despite the boat wanting to go the opposite way.
The other way is to have the wife in the rubber dinghy and get her to push you around. We do that on my mates 50 foot full keel ketch. He's in a pile berth side on to the tide flow and backs in to the dock.
Kettlewell all our marina berths in Tin Can bay are about a metre shorter than the boat. It can be a real pia.
Cheers