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**a64pilot** · 30-06-2019, 14:13

I don’t have anything against electric cooking, we have a toaster for instance, cause toasting with the oven is well, not easy or smart I don’t think, but I think I have noticed something, and that’s we try to always try to be in warm weather, which means when away from the Marina with usually everything opened up, exception is of course when it’s raining.
So we don’t have any issue with moisture etc from burning fossil fuels.
Now if we were closed up and or was cold, then that’s different.
We did part of one Winter in Brunswick Ga, it was miserable with all the condensation etc. never plan on that again.
I can’t imagine what real Winter weather would be like.

So I’m postulating that many of the electric cooking proponents are often closed up due to weather?

Otherwise I can make sense of it, as all the expensive houses you have to have granite, a Viking gas stove and a Sub Zero refrigerator.

cj88 · 30-06-2019, 14:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Otherwise I can make sense of it, as all the expensive houses you have to have granite, a Viking gas stove and a Sub Zero refrigerator.

People don't always choose what's best, just what they think is best or what they know.

As pointed out by others, induction is to gas what gas is to old school electric cooktops. It's so quick and controllable and I know a few chefs that have begun using it. It's pretty cheap to get a single portable induction cooktop and try it and see plus it's easy to use outside as well.

Kenomac · 30-06-2019, 14:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

OK I’ll go one at a time.
First they are all Hard panels, Canadian Solar not underperforming flexible panels.
There is a Kilowatt of them, and I can easily see 50+ amps in the middle of the day, but almost never do, reason is the bank won’t accept that much.
I do have only one controller, an Outback 80.
I do not position my boom to one side, there is no need my panels are not shaded by the boom.

You don’t do full time either, you part time.

You probably do get as much power out of your 450 as I do my 1000, but that’s because your not fully charged, you think you are, but unless the last few hours of the Solar day your only dribbling in a few amps, your not.
But you likely don’t have to either, good quality flooded lead acid batteries can live for a few year partial SOC cycling, much longer than AGM anyway.

You keep talking about efficiency, but explain that, what exactly do you mean, do you think your panels are more efficient or what?

And what device pray tell is more accurate for determining SOC than a Smart Gauge?

I use a Magnetronic DCC 4000 along with a Mastervolt Easyview 5 monitor system in conjunction with a Mastervolt Master Shunt. Everything has been tested and verified repeatedly using my Fluke 374 clamp meter.

After using the Balmar Smart Gauge for one entire season, I found it to be a total and complete, useless POS and tossed it in the trash can.

My Trojan 450ah bank is 8 years old and still going strong with the exception of one battery requiring replacement three weeks ago. The batteries are in float status daily as verified by four sources including the two Mastervolt chargers and their monitoring system, which is separate from the ones previously noted above.

FYI: I live on the boats 10 months of the year always in anchorages.... I consider that full-time with vacation breaks.

**a64pilot** · 30-06-2019, 14:47

So your amp counting?
I do also of course, and surprisingly to me it’s is accurate and stays so, but I assume that is because pretty much everyday I achieve 100% full SOC based on trailing amps charge at absorption voltage.
But my Smart Gauge has always been accurate, first thing in the morning before Solar is doing anything, I pretty much ignore it at any other time, it will track right along within 1% of calculated SOC with my Magnum BMK, but I’ll admit I used the SOC on the Smart Gauge to calibrate or set the AH size of my bank for the amp counter, so they should agree, without doing a real cap check, how do you know your banks capacity to set into the amp counter?
In fact they track so well together when the first begin to split and the Smart Gauge starts showing a slightly lower SOC in the morning, I know that’s when to equalize, seems to be on average about every three months, after equalization, they track together again.

However the amp counter is linear of course, meaning that in a 600 AH bank if I use 60 AH it will say I’m at 90% SOC, but the Smart Gauge isn’t, it ends up at the same place every morning at the same time but it May read considerably higher in the middle of the night than the amp counter, I don’t know why, maybe batteries don’t discharge linearly? Or maybe it’s just the way the Smart Gauge works? But first thing in the morning it since I replaced its fuses and holders has been accurate, it’s the standard by which I compare the amp counter with.

Oh, and about all we can check with our Flukes is voltage of course and resistance.

Oh, on edit I should say that my amp counter resets to 100% SOC the moment when every amp that was drawn out is returned, which of course is way, way premature, if I counted on it to determine full charge, I’d be chronically undercharging my bank

sailorboy1 · 30-06-2019, 15:25

To me propane works so well and easy I’m not spending money to change.

**Dockhead** · 30-06-2019, 16:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I don’t have anything against electric cooking, we have a toaster for instance, cause toasting with the oven is well, not easy or smart I don’t think, but I think I have noticed something, and that’s we try to always try to be in warm weather, which means when away from the Marina with usually everything opened up, exception is of course when it’s raining.
So we don’t have any issue with moisture etc from burning fossil fuels.
Now if we were closed up and or was cold, then that’s different.
We did part of one Winter in Brunswick Ga, it was miserable with all the condensation etc. never plan on that again.
I can’t imagine what real Winter weather would be like.

So I’m postulating that many of the electric cooking proponents are often closed up due to weather?

Otherwise I can['t] make sense of it, as all the expensive houses you have to have granite, a Viking gas stove and a Sub Zero refrigerator.

Expensive houses in Europe are being built mostly with induction these days. I'd be surprised if that's not a trend in the U.S. as well. Viking gas faux commercial stoves are pretty '90's -- and now it's almost 2020.

But I think the people who like electric cooking on boats like it mostly because:

1. It gets rid of one entire system to maintain.
2. It gets rid of one entire different fuel one has to buy and haul.
3. It gets rid of the danger of LPG on board.

More than because it cooks better, although for me cooking better is a significant factor.

I think the condensation and combustion gasses you mention might be an additional significant reason for some people, and HEAT in the cabin; not me as I have very good ventilation in the boat and an exhaust hood over the stove, so not an issue for me personally with gas, but others may suffer from this.

That being said different boats have different ability or lack of ability to deal with the electrical demand, and gas has different advantages, too, particularly the huge power density and low cost per BTU of a bottle of gas. So gas cooking has certainly not lost its relevance on cruising boats -- yet.

As to "real winter weather" -- bit of thread drift, but good cold weather is actually better for the atmosphere inside, than wet warm weather. It's important to have some insulation (my boat has a fully cored hull, and is fully insulated on the inside with no exposed fiberglass), but given that and if you are centrally heating the boat, and you also have decent ventilation (large dorades for example), then you automatically have low humidity and it's quite pleasant. I've spent many winters on my boat -- I like winter sailing, and it's cosy on board in cold weather. Come visit some time and I will show you.

In general, although I grew up in a hot Southern place, I find I dislike hot weather, and dislike it more and more, and have learned to love winter and learned the joys of Northern latitudes. When it's cold, you can always put on a sweater or turn the heat up. When it's hot -- what can you do? Be miserable, especially at night, or turn on the air conditioning and live in plastic air.

GILow · 30-06-2019, 17:48

Personal experience of this one was that induction cooking on my boat looked like it was going to force me to expand my battery bank, not for additional capacity, but to better handle the peak loads.

I can easily meet my 24 hr power budget with my current battery bank and solar, but to prevent voltage sag at 2kW from the inverter I would need a 50% greater battery bank.

So for the moment at least, I am putting up with gas coking (that’s propane to some) and managing the risks as best I can.

But to the OP, depending on your climate, I believe the gas fired BBQ on the aft rail is a terrific solution to many of the problems of cooking on a boat.

transmitterdan · 30-06-2019, 17:51

I wish the induction cook tops could dial down power smoothly instead of pulsing on and off. The one I have draws maximum power when heating and just cycles on and off to maintain temperature. This is frustrating when I have to turn off other loads so as to not overload the inverter or a weak shore pedestal. Is there such a thing as an induction cooktop that draws current in proportion to the needed power or do they all switch on/off like mine does?

**Dockhead** · 30-06-2019, 18:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by transmitterdan

I wish the induction cook tops could dial down power smoothly instead of pulsing on and off. The one I have draws maximum power when heating and just cycles on and off to maintain temperature. This is frustrating when I have to turn off other loads so as to not overload the inverter or a weak shore pedestal. Is there such a thing as an induction cooktop that draws current in proportion to the needed power or do they all switch on/off like mine does?

I think the better ones have different power settings, and you can control them. My NuWave has independent controls for wattage and temperature, and you can dial the wattage to whatever you like and often achieve whatever temperature you need even at low wattage, just taking longer. I can do most things with mine set at 1200 watts, which IIRC is the next to highest wattage setting.

For this issue, you might find an inverter/charger with power boost to be really valuable for dealing with a weak shore pedestal (if not with voltage sag when on battery power).

**a64pilot** · 30-06-2019, 19:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by transmitterdan

I wish the induction cook tops could dial down power smoothly instead of pulsing on and off. The one I have draws maximum power when heating and just cycles on and off to maintain temperature. This is frustrating when I have to turn off other loads so as to not overload the inverter or a weak shore pedestal. Is there such a thing as an induction cooktop that draws current in proportion to the needed power or do they all switch on/off like mine does?

I believe it’s a whole lot more difficult to dial down the power than it is to just cycle it on and off, I believe even most newer light dimmers actually cycle power now instead of reducing current.

But then a regular old fashioned stove top reduces power some how and doesn’t just switch it on and off, cause that was before electronic controls.
So maybe? I wonder how you could find out which ones reduce power as opposed to cycling it on and off?

Kenomac · 01-07-2019, 04:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by gauvins

What's the state of the art wrt cooking? We currently have the ubiquitous propane stove. Drawbacks being finding propane, safety, and adding heat to an already hot galley.

Induction plates and microwave ovens require obscene amounts of electricity (1200W or so). Slow cookers are poorly insulated and transfer considerable energy into ambient heat. Solar ovens look like inadequate solutions for morning coffee and evening meal (we do not heat food for lunch anyway).

We make coffee with a stove-top moka pot, frequently cook pasta, occasionally do pancakes, and grill meat. Being able to do this without propane would be great. Possible?

We’ve been using only the NuWave induction cooktops since 2013 with two onboard along with the NuWave infrared oven. I believe I was one of the first on CF to post my results years ago; it’s good to see that these devices are finally catching on. We also use a new microwave oven along with a Nespresso for coffee. Yes, the Nuwave cooktop ($80 USD) can be regulated every 5 degrees. No, we have not purchased propane or butane in Europe over the past 7 years.

Here we are again today anchored in Greece with 450w of Solbian flex solar and a 99% SOC on the house bank by 2pm, no generator used, even after cooking a hot pasta meal last evening and having a hot lunch made in the microwave for lunch today. Four Nespresso cups of coffee have also been made and consumed.

Cooking with electric these days isn’t as complicated as some make it out to be and can be very energy efficient using the right combination of appliances and onboard systems.

I hope this helps to answer your questions and concerns, please feel free to pm me for further details. It’s really very cheap and easy to hop onboard the all electric cooking bandwagon.

Good luck.

Ken

daletournier · 01-07-2019, 04:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanshin

I agree with that. I have a 4-spot electric stove/oven aboard and it works wonderfully, although it would be nice to save a bit of energy by going to induction.

Even baking bread takes relatively little energy - quite a bit up front to heat the oven but after that it just sips power from the inverter to maintain temperature. Similarly bringing water to boil or frying something isn't as energy-hungry as many believe, the element is only at 100% for a fraction of the time.

I have no propane lines going into the boat, although I do have propane outside for the BBQ. Years ago I lost a friend to a gas explosion in his house and I've avoided gas ever since.

Hi what's your battery and charging setup?

gauvins · 01-07-2019, 04:30

Took a quick look at the NuWave. Noticed the price (inexpensive) and power range (200-2000W in 200W increments).

Looks good.

Now. IIRC, moving Watts using an inverter incurs a loss of efficiency of 15-20%. Any way to migrate this?

More generally, what would be reasonable requirements to run such a NuWave or equivalent? In terms of battery bank and solar panels (we are always at anchor). I understand that the answer depends on usage. Let's say make the morning espresso and cook dinner. My guess would be 500Wh tops.

Kenomac · 01-07-2019, 04:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by gauvins

Took a quick look at the NuWave. Noticed the price (inexpensive) and power range (200-2000W in 200W increments).

Looks good.

Now. IIRC, moving Watts using an inverter incurs a loss of efficiency of 15-20%. Any way to migrate this?

More generally, what would be reasonable requirements to run such a NuWave or equivalent? In terms of battery bank and solar panels (we are always at anchor). I understand that the answer depends on usage. Let's say make the morning espresso and cook dinner. My guess would be 500Wh tops.

We have a Mastervolt 2500w inverter which allows us to use one energy hungry appliance at a time, so we adjust our cooking habits. But as someone else wrote, usually the power hungry monsters only draw max power for a very short period of time... a few minutes, not hours.

If we have guests over and are preparing something more elaborate for supper, we run the 10kw generator for a half hour or so, crank up the two cooktops and oven along with the microwave, watermakers and air conditioner... and do it all at once bypassing the inverter.

If I find another 2500w Mastervolt inverter, I can install it and be able to use two power hungry devices at the same time. On the 62, we have two Mastervolt 2500w inverters, on the 53 we presently have one.