Peeling a Hull

[Nicholson58]

I did a similar job on our 84 Camper Nicholson, not as deep a dive but the entire bottom.

We found the 9" dia 40 grit wheels from Home Depot's rental department fit my right angle drive and worked very well for fairing. You will need a lot of glass & resin. Consider that a proper hull sealer is specialized epoxy (Interprotect 2000E). I think you will be ahead if you go straight to epoxy for the new top layers. You can get bulk marine epoxy from US Composites Epoxy :Â*Epoxy Resins and Hardeners Use 636 THIN. Its made for wet-out of cloth and has a very long working time so you don't need to rush. Its no-blush so you can layer up without scrubbing. Lots of cloth & fillers available here and good tutorials. By my estimate, 1/4 inch at 50% resin-glass you are going to need about 40 gallons. Use the 2:1 to avoid the blush. I use a paint brush to wet the hull and also to smooth the glass into the resin. You can hold the glass/resin layer in place by applying a sheet of polyethylene film in the wet resin. Tape the top. You can then roller over if necessary. Use epoxy & filler for the last resin coats for build so that there is no bare glass end at the surface to wick water in.

BTW, the liquid you found is not uncured resin but decomposed resin. It is acid & nasty. Keep it off your skin and away from your eyes. We had big blisters under pressure that I had to lance with a drill to control the blow-out.

My gallery photos are here. Lots of glass projects. All 635 resin.
Member Galleries - Cruisers & Sailing Photo Gallery

Looks like you are well into the big job & looking good.

[austinsailor]

It's probably splitting hairs and doesn't matter one way or the other, but what is in the few voids that have liquid is just old water. What I describled as resin is quite similar to the resin I'd spill in my shop and not clean up. Thick and slowly moves. Sticky, runny in the same was as old tree sap. I't isn't coming from blister or voids, but slowly oozing out of a very thin layer between the good solid glass below and the crap on top.

Of course, I've only gotten into maybe 5%, so there is no telling what else lurks in there. Maybe a sample of everything anyone has suggested!

I'll try to get another 4 hours or so tomorrow. About all I can do these days.

Of course, I can always take a break and work on laminating up the extension on the too-small rudder. But that is a different subject, I guess.

[austinsailor]

Well, everyone likes pictures, especially if it's of someone else's misery, not their own!

This thing is a lot of work, but in the last day I've spent some time figuring out how to adjust it correctly and using it in verttical passes. It's working much better and faster. I'm still doing the low hanging fruit (eye level, not laying on my back) but it's going much better. The pictures show today's 2 hour's work. Front part is to good glass, back sectikon is 3 passes on the front part, 2 on the back. You can see it's nearly through the green glass (both color and curing) with 3 passes. Nearly 3/8" inch. I'm also surprised that I'm still on the first side of the first blades. The manual says gelcoat is harder on them, and since I have none I guess they are going a long ways. Of course, the glass is pretty soft, too.

Last picture is the start of an extension on the rudder. As I get sick of planing, I'll lay up some glass.

I should get a job - these hobbies are killing me.

[Zach]

Idea:

Take sharpie marker and mark out the areas with the depth of cut you stopped at, total... either in number of passes or sum of depth as you've adjusted it.

Makes it a lot easier if you do any exploratory digging, to lay back up the required number of layers and have a fair job.

Cheers,

Zach

[Nicholson58]

From my experience, you may find the rudder requires a total rebuild or at least a re-core. If the skin is OK but interior is crap, you can make a few windows, dig out the krud and refill using syntactic foam. That is epoxy/microballoon mix. Using the epoxy I noted above, I mix 3 gallons of epoxy with 10 gallons of balloons in large plastic buckets & use a drywall mixer in a 1/2 inch drill. The 635 resin is very slow and will not liberate enough heat to matter. My rudder pour was 6 inches thick and never was warm to touch. Cure time hard for sanding was 3 days in the basement. (Pictures on my photo site noted above)

[minaret]

Originally Posted by austinsailor

Well, everyone likes pictures, especially if it's of someone else's misery, not their own!

This thing is a lot of work, but in the last day I've spent some time figuring out how to adjust it correctly and using it in verttical passes. It's working much better and faster. I'm still doing the low hanging fruit (eye level, not laying on my back) but it's going much better. The pictures show today's 2 hour's work. Front part is to good glass, back sectikon is 3 passes on the front part, 2 on the back. You can see it's nearly through the green glass (both color and curing) with 3 passes. Nearly 3/8" inch. I'm also surprised that I'm still on the first side of the first blades. The manual says gelcoat is harder on them, and since I have none I guess they are going a long ways. Of course, the glass is pretty soft, too.

Last picture is the start of an extension on the rudder. As I get sick of planing, I'll lay up some glass.

I should get a job - these hobbies are killing me.

Much better. Only input I'd have from here on your peel job is that I would have done a single pass over the whole bottom, then a second, then a third if necessary. If you just make multiple passes on a given area you are going to make keeping a fair bottom unlikely, whereas if you incrementally take the whole bottom down the exact same amount everywhere until all bad glass is gone, it will be much easier to glass back up relatively fair. But it's a bit late for that in this case. Keep at it and good luck!

[HappyMdRSailor]

I think this nightmare warrants a free pass at the pearly gates when the time comes...

Unless of course... You did something karma-cally horrific... But you don't seem that type of guy at all...

I'm elated you have the invaluable help watching ... Good luck man!

[austinsailor]

Doing one pass on the whole boat would not be practical. Among other problems, they would have to move the stands every couple hours. In addition, it's not likely the whole boat will need the same amount removed.

I will say that, now that I'm getting the hang of this thing it's an amazing tool. I am 100% sure buying this was the right way to go.

I just wish the guys on the next boat weren't painting it all the time!

[minaret]

Originally Posted by austinsailor

Doing one pass on the whole boat would not be practical. Among other problems, they would have to move the stands every couple hours. In addition, it's not likely the whole boat will need the same amount removed.

I will say that, now that I'm getting the hang of this thing it's an amazing tool. I am 100% sure buying this was the right way to go.

I just wish the guys on the next boat weren't painting it all the time!

Exactly my point. While it's not likely the whole boat needs the same amount removed, you should do so anyway. That way you can glass back up with the same amount everywhere and end up with a relatively fair bottom, especially if you do staggered butt joints. The way you are doing it will lead to problems at the glass stage and fairing stage.


If you need better dust control for the sake of your neighbors, tent your bottom. It should be anyway. I don't know how much footprint the EPA has in your area, but fines are substantial.

[austinsailor]

Got a little more done today. Been offering various people the opportunity to see how a Gelplane works but no takers do far. Darn the luck.

But the question has come up as to what to put on once the glass is restored, and more specifically, should it have gelcoat on it?

Any thoughts as to what should go on the surface before bottom paint?

[austinsailor]

As to making the same number of passes on the entire boat, or removing the same amount of material, I have (already have) to take 3/4" off on the starboard side in the middle. That is thicker than the glass on the bottom at the transom. I'd have nothing but air!

I have one crack where the front of the keel turns into boat bottom. I think that is where I was getting water into the boat. I'll grind that back pretty deep, then build it up, probably an inch thhicker than original. Maybe the whole front edge that would hit something first.

[austinsailor]

I have what appears to be a 1/2" hole drilled and filled with a dowel rod about 1 foot below the waterline, 1 each side, in the center of the boat.

I wonder - did someone take a core sample and drive a dowel in? Makes no sense.

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by austinsailor

Doing one pass on the whole boat would not be practical. Among other problems, they would have to move the stands every couple hours. In addition, it's not likely the whole boat will need the same amount removed.

Not exactly true. Here is how we managed it. I was able to borrow chains and ratchets for load securing on truck-trailers. I placed the modified tops of four tall tack stands (borrowed from the yard) so that the tops wedged under artifacts on the hull above the water line. I joined the stands on opposite sides near the top; under the keel and torqued the chains tight. The geometry at this point prevents the hull from falling as that would require longer chain. You can easily see this from the front-on view. We did this so that the barrier coat could be applied 2-3 coats per day & antifouling continuously without stopping. Our boat dimensions are 58 LOA; 16 beam; 6'-8" draft; 35 tons. If it was really windy I would have added a few of the other stands back in. Certainly, you could do this and put back stands if you will be away for a while.

[austinsailor]

The fun goes on.

[cpa]

This looks like a tough project. It does looks like you are kicking butt though! Also thanks for sharing with pictures. I had to do a peel on the hull of my last boat. I hired it out and I think it cost me $1k. Luckily the blisters were just below the gelcoat and very little glass had to be removed. All I had to do was the final fairing and barrier coat. It was a rough couple months though. Good luck.