15M Catamaran Capsize off Portugal

[XL2]

Originally Posted by newhaul

Yes but it is still a jib sail

I respectfully disagree
Just because https://sailingfortuitous.com/jib-calc/ speaks this language doesn't make it right
But then half way down the front page of this above link it goes on to explain it..... google is your friend....

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by XL2

I respectfully disagree
Just because https://sailingfortuitous.com/jib-calc/ speaks this language doesn't make it right..... google is your friend....

I could continue to post links from the various sail lofts but no amount of proof will ever change some peoples made up minds. So I will now stop and we can see if there is anything new on the loss of this catamaran.

[Thumbs Up]

Geneoa/Jib is like the difference between a rectangle and a square. A square is a rectangle but a rectangle is not (necessarily) a square.

[boatman61]

For me Genoas and Jibs are different types of headsails..
A No1 Genoa is 175% and reducing accordingly with a very low cut foot at deck level.
A Jib on the other hand is cut with a high foot starting with the No1 jib at 100%.
Cruisers of old did not use Genoas as they were to heavy to lug around, more so when wet..
They became more fashionable as man-made fires made them lighter and easier to handle.
My first boat came with a No1, 2 and 3 jib, the No1 leech brushed the mast, just.
Both are obviously headsails.
Modern terminology however no longer makes this distinction it seems.

An enthusiastic amateur delivery skipper.. Pro's grab every job whereas I pick and choose 2 to 4 a year as they come along and pass on the rest..

[smj]

Originally Posted by XL2

I disagree
nice interior that you can live on with light furniture and and minimal weight achieved by things like no hood linings or sound deadening.
very workable galley and bathrooms
I'd call it a great combination cruiser that can be raced. Certainly not a race boat....
I own a race boat that can be cruised...
And..... I call a large % of production cats "sail assisted" power boats these days. A sailboat in my opinion needs to go to weather... but that's me

I’d agree. We’ve been living and cruising on our 40’ open bridgedeck racer/cruiser for 2 years and are very comfortable, so the TS5 would be palatial compared to our 40’er and palatial compared to any of the catamarans that we’ve owned and lived on. Maybe instead of cruiser I should have stated racer/cruiser or cruiser/racer, either way one hell of a boat.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by boatman61

For me Genoas and Jibs are different types of headsails..
A No1 Genoa is 175% and reducing accordingly with a very low cut foot at deck level.
A Jib on the other hand is cut with a high foot starting with the No1 jib at 100%.
Cruisers of old did not use Genoas as they were to heavy to lug around, more so when wet..
They became more fashionable as man-made fires made them lighter and easier to handle.
My first boat came with a No1, 2 and 3 jib, the No1 leech brushed the mast, just.
Both are obviously headsails.
Modern terminology however no longer makes this distinction it seems.

An enthusiastic amateur delivery skipper.. Pro's grab every job whereas I pick and choose 2 to 4 a year as they come along and pass on the rest..

About the same here except my first sailboat ( not a toy type)
Had way to many sails for a 24 ft boat 150, 120, 100, 80 and 2 spinnakers asymmetrical and a normal symmetrical. Along with a spinnaker pole and an adjustable whisker. All were hank on .

As a now retired shipwright it seemed excessive to me even back then

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by newhaul

About the same here except my first sailboat ( not a toy type)
Had way to many sails for a 24 ft boat 150, 120, 100, 80 and 2 spinnakers asymmetrical and a normal symmetrical. Along with a spinnaker pole and an adjustable whisker. All were hank on .

As a now retired shipwright it seemed excessive to me even back then

Mine was 24ft as well, pitch pine on oak frames.. No plastic fantastic.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Mine was 24ft as well, pitch pine on oak frames.. No plastic fantastic.

1924 Mckenzie fir on oak 3/4 keel cutaway forefoot masthead sloop.
Next was my islander bahama classic plastic.
I got tired of corking and bottom work all the time

[Jim Cate]

I got tired of corking

Me? Well I just love corking... or more specifically un-corking. That lovely "POP" as the cork leaves the neck of the bottle, aahhhhh, true music to my ears.

How could you tire of that?

Jim

[Palarran]

Originally Posted by XL2

I disagree
nice interior that you can live on with light furniture and and minimal weight achieved by things like no hood linings or sound deadening.
very workable galley and bathrooms
I'd call it a great combination cruiser that can be raced. Certainly not a race boat....
I own a race boat that can be cruised...
And..... I call a large % of production cats "sail assisted" power boats these days. A sailboat in my opinion needs to go to weather... but that's me

And I disagree. I watched the video again and really think the interior looks like crap, especially for what I can imagine it cost. Look, I can live in a tent, but choose not to. But I don't call a tent a house. Call it what is it.

It's also funny to read you "super racer" cat sailors bash the rest of us. Just so you know, we don't care - not at all. No way would I give up all the nice things that makes cruising comfortable for my wife, family, friends, and myself for the sparsity it takes to achieve whatever level of performance your bragging about.

But in other news, I don't recall a thread deviating so far off topic - ever. Literally the last 3 pages have had maybe 5% to do with the specific catamaran capsize and instead is now arguing what head sails are called. Now that we all should find hilarious. For those in the US, have a nice Thanksgiving.

[Jim Cate]

But in other news, I don't recall a thread deviating so far off topic - ever. Literally the last 3 pages have had maybe 5% to do with the specific catamaran capsize and instead is now arguing what head sails are called.

This is true... but really, there has been little real new info since around page 2 and we're now on page 12. Not surprising that folks have drifted off in the discussions. Kinda like killing time, keeping the thread bumped and hoping that some new info will appear, info that will educate us as to what really happened.

To me, this is better than endlessly debating the same old discussion with no further input. YMMV, and that's ok.

Jim

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Me? Well I just love corking... or more specifically un-corking. That lovely "POP" as the cork leaves the neck of the bottle, aahhhhh, true music to my ears.

How could you tire of that?

Jim

Back in the day the guys that did the caulking of the mso's made here at tacoma boat .
We were called corkers because caulkers didn't sound right at the bars in Seattle .
Think about it .
MSO = minesweeper ocean
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aggr...vy%2C%20among%

[smj]

Originally Posted by Palarran

And I disagree. I watched the video again and really think the interior looks like crap, especially for what I can imagine it cost. Look, I can live in a tent, but choose not to. But I don't call a tent a house. Call it what is it.



It's also funny to read you "super racer" cat sailors bash the rest of us. Just so you know, we don't care - not at all. No way would I give up all the nice things that makes cruising comfortable for my wife, family, friends, and myself for the sparsity it takes to achieve whatever level of performance your bragging about.



But in other news, I don't recall a thread deviating so far off topic - ever. Literally the last 3 pages have had maybe 5% to do with the specific catamaran capsize and instead is now arguing what head sails are called. Now that we all should find hilarious. For those in the US, have a nice Thanksgiving.

There’s no doubt your FP 56 is going to have more space and creature comforts than the TS5. Sometimes to gain the pace you have to give up the space, and that’s purely a buyers choice. And I wouldn’t consider your cat a dog.
I don’t think the performance based crowd bash the others, once again a personal choice. We are on our 11th catamaran and each one has guided us to what we desire. I’m sure we’ve had many sailors dinghy by our cat and feel sorry for us based on the living space, but to be honest we don’t need more.
As far as thread drift, at least at this point I feel as if I’ve learned the correct way to run over a deer in my truck, which hopefully will never happen.

[Palarran]

Originally Posted by smj

As far as thread drift, at least at this point I feel as if I’ve learned the correct way to run over a deer in my truck, which hopefully will never happen.

Holy crap, I literally spit out my drink. Still laughing. Wow, needed it. Thanks.

[XL2]

Originally Posted by newhaul

I could continue to post links from the various sail lofts but no amount of proof will ever change some peoples made up minds. So I will now stop and we can see if there is anything new on the loss of this catamaran.

I'm a sailmaker.... or was.....but you are right... and it doesn't matter ... i was just being factual