Big problem with Garmin 8616xsv (any 8600 i bet) bearing issue

[Karanga]

I have a Garmin 7416.
On autopilot, it does indeed zig-zag its way to a way point. Out in the ocean, this is probably not noticeable, but motoring in confines of a waterway or amongst other boats etc it is very wierd and disconcerting to feel wandering off until correction and then over correction. On very calm water, the wake can even be seen as lots of S's into the distance.

The only way I have overcome this effect is to go to autopilot settings, and change the response from normal to high 2 or 3. This feels like it makes the autopilot hydraulic motor work harder (quicker and smaller adjustments) but it probably is the same amount of work overall.

I usually adjust the setting back to normal when sailing and travel is quieter, because it reduces the sound of the hydraulic motor.

I have also learned, after a deviation from a course set, to accept the unit's insistence on returning exactly to that course set, rather than it just taking the straightest and shortest route to the next way point. It can veer quite violently back to the course. I have now argued to myself that it can't differentiate between me just wanting to get to a chosen point versus me wanting to follow a particular course to avoid hazards etc. If I don't want that violent correction, I either manually steer towards the way point or just set it to maintain a heading until I am closer to the original course (within 10 metres) and then change it back to route following. Or set a new course from current position.

On the flip side, I have found it to be excellent to exactly follow a previously designed course through very tight conditions (extremely narrow channel through widespread sandbanks, at night in the rain between channel markers). Sandy Strait comes to mind...

[Atlantic48Zen]

Update

The Garmin 8400 series MFD's do NOT support a course/heading/bearing to waypoint function. Unbelievable. Truly unreal. I could not be more disappointed in my choice of gear. Steer clear.

BTW...Someone made the logical suggestion to hit a soft key for re-calculation of route. Nope, that does not exist either.

The Garmin 8400 series ONLY routes you back to an arbitrary rhumbline that would have existed when you initially set a go-to or route. It will NOT tell you your course/heading/bearing to your waypoint if you veer even slightly off the original rhumbline. From what I can tell this is unique to Garmin. I have sailed more than 40,000 miles over my 30 years of long distance voyaging and have used many different MFD's. Course/heading/bearing to waypoint is the most baseline data on every nav device I have ever used. Garmin dropped the ball on this one and I was an idiot for assuming they would have followed the most basic of all features.

Thanks again for all your input and attempts to assist. I have asked Garmin if they would issue a patch to their OS with this feature. Crickets.

[Shrew]

Originally Posted by wholybee

Bearing is the direction to something, often a waypoint. Heading is the direction you are sailing, which might or might not be to a waypoint. There is also "course", which is the intended direction.

Yes, I understand the difference between Heading and Bearing. I didn't say I've never heard of a bearing.

I've never seen a bearing setting on a MFD, but then again, I guess I don't dig in deep enough. I've never seen an AP do what the OP is expecting. If I had a course plotted and were traversing between two way-points, If I were off course, I wouldn't expect the AP to plot a course based on the bearing to the next way point.

But then again, I don't have AP follow the plotted course. I set AP based on the heading, then monitor and tweak as needed. At a turn, I make the turn and reset the AP. I'm used to many, many years of hand steering, so this isn't a huge issue for me.

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by Shrew

Yes, I understand the difference between Heading and Bearing. I didn't say I've never heard of a bearing.

I've never seen a bearing setting on a MFD, but then again, I guess I don't dig in deep enough. I've never seen an AP do what the OP is expecting. If I had a course plotted and were traversing between two way-points, If I were off course, I wouldn't expect the AP to plot a course based on the bearing to the next way point.

But then again, I don't have AP follow the plotted course. I set AP based on the heading, then monitor and tweak as needed. At a turn, I make the turn and reset the AP. I'm used to many, many years of hand steering, so this isn't a huge issue for me.

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply you didn't understand the difference between Heading and Bearing. But some posts in this thread (not yours) used them incorrectly. And I felt that clarification would be useful, since the OP is looking for "Bearing to Waypoint", using the term "Heading" leads to not getting the information wanted.

Setting an AP to heading mode is what I think most people (including myself do). However, with my Raymarine AP I did go through and try all the functions. And if you have a route/course plotted and are in "Track" mode, it will turn to get you back on course, not go directly to the next waypoint. I can find no way to make it steer to a waypoint, except plotting a course from your current location to that waypoint, going into Track mode, and having it stay on that course. But if you drift off course (perhaps I have to steer around a crab pot) then it will turn to get you back on course, not to the waypoint.

However, it does DISPLAY the BTW (bearing to waypoint), so I can manually set the AP heading to that. If the Garmin truly has no way to display the BTW, that is a huge fail. I can't imagine that it won't do it. It's probably the most basic of all chartplotter functions to tell you what direction to steer to get to the next waypoint-with or without an autopilot. The answer might be to show up at the Garmin booth at a boat show. Have the guy show you how to do it. And if it can't do it embarrass them in front of potential customers. Posting on Garmin's Facebook page might help also. With many companies that is the only way to get good support.

[Karanga]

Originally Posted by Atlantic48Zen

Update







BTW...Someone made the logical suggestion to hit a soft key for re-calculation of route. Nope, that does not exist either.

I have discovered that if I have deviated from a preset course (auto guidance or manually created) to avoid a crab pot etc, then if I go to Menu, then Navigation options, then recalculate, it will tell the autopilot to continue the course from my new position, and not take me back to the original course. But maybe the later 84 series have dropped this ability

[SofiaB]

I have the 7610xsv model which does have a recalculate course function. But use the course-line to zigzag over and it helps to calculate how far to go past the line using equal distances and consistent angles. You should get used to the Garmin features. I wnr from a Garmin handheld to the 7610 and love it.

[bdbcat]

Wholybee...

Sorry for the thread drift....


I am interested in this observation:


My Raymarine autopilot controlled by OpenCPN will make a 45 degree turn to get back to the route, when it is only 50 feet off course and less than 1 degree off of a heading to the next waypoint.

I do wish there was a way to configure it between sailing to the next waypoint, vs. staying on the plotted course. But often, staying on course is important. It might be plotted that way to avoid hazards, so getting back to it is priority over taking the short course to the next waypoint.


Tell me more about your experiences in this mode, if you have the time.
Thanks
Dave

[nrx500]

I have a Garmin GPSMAP 1242 XSV with Garmin Reactor course computer unit, Garmin hydraulic autopilot, and masthead wind instruments. The unit can sail the boat based on apparent wind, waypoint, or hold the course I program from a paper chart.

When I race to the windward mark, it displays the course from the start line to the mark, but I steer manually as I tack upwind. I see the course line in pink, but I'm sailing toward the lay lines and watching the apparent wind angle, wind velocity, and time to the mark. If the wind angle remains constant, but time to the mark increases, I know I've been headed and will tack.

On the reaching and running legs, I stay closer to the pink course line between the buoys. I adjust course away from the pink line as the wind increases, decreases, or changes direction. The pink line on the course plotter does not change, and I don't want it to change. I need it to stay exactly where it is so I know the shortest distance to the mark, but as a racer, I'm more interested in time to the mark.

I've also used the autopilot to sail a straight line course from an inlet red and white midchannel marker to the center of an inlet in fog. The only safe course is the pink line between the midchannel marker and the inlet. I don't want that line to change for fear of running into a rock jetty. All the time the autopilot keeps the boat on the pink line as it broad reaches toward the unseen inlet. The Garmin automatically corrects for wind and current to keep the boat sailing within feet of the pink line.

Now in your case, if I understand you correctly, you're making hundred mile or more passages offshore and current or wind is taking you off the pink course line the Garmin set when you first programmed your course. You want a new course directly to your destination rather than steering back to the original pink line course set by the chartplotter. So why not delete the original course and program a new course from where your boat is to the destination. Just be sure to check the route for rocks and shoals when you come into coastal waters at your destination.

By the way, a Garmin chartplotter can display a different screen than the one you posted her where all data is in the 4 corners of the chart screen. I display my data along the right margin of the plotter screen in two columns. I see ETA, speed, distance to waypoint, bearing, ship's heading, and distance off the pink course line. Under power and when reaching, the Garmin keeps the boat on the course I set.

[Chrisatlantic]

Originally Posted by Atlantic48Zen

Hi,
I made a BIG mistake and bought the Garmin 8616xsv without checking some features. After making my purchase and completing a full custom install I started practicing with the gear. The radar is fine and simple to use. The problem I have is with the plotter and, in particular, the "bearing" for a go-to or on a route. Upon initial engagement of a go-to or route the bearing displays the GPS course to steer to my waypoint. Within seconds however the bearing starts to shift as the boat veers off the ruhmbline BUT it is not providing the new course to the waypoint (like every other chart plotter in the world), it displays the course back to the rhumbline. It seems the Garmin default setting is to steer you back to the rhumbline and follow that course. Well, on a sailboat that is not always the way it will work. If the waypoint is directly up wind then the sailboat needs to tack back and forth to reach the waypoint.

I have searched through all the settings and I have been back and forth with Garmin support (worthless) and I cannot find a way to change this "bearing" to display the course to the waypoint. Can anyone help??

Hi Tom,

Thought you guys were putting the boat on the hard this winter in Newport. We will be headed to the Bahamas in a couple weeks, sounds like you'll be in the Caribbean?

Anyway, about your question… I couldn’t believe that there could be a modern chart chart plotter without a bearing to waypoint feature. I suspect that there are actually two ways of achieving what you want.

1) I’m hoping that there is a data field that you can place on the screen that is in fact BTW bearing to waypoint.

2) I am guessing that you have been using a route to navigate. It seems that your chart plotter will behave as you discuss, which is effectively trying to minimize cross track error by always going back to the course line, when, in the route mode. There is another navigation choice you can make instead of navigating a route, that is “going to” a point. See page 50 of the manual, screenshot below. It will basically draw a purple bearing to waypoint line from the vessel position at any point in time to the Waypoint while the original magenta track to waypoint remains in the position it was when you selected the Go To.

Hope this actually works as I’ve presented it, best I can figure from the manual. I have B&G Zeus and Vulcan chartplotters that handle this well but I have several other complaints so if you can solve this you might end up liking where you’re at.

Chris J
Emotional Rescue

[donradcliffe]

It sounds like Garmin has joined Boeing and Southwest, and put the bean counters in charge. The old Garmin GPS were more user friendly that the modern ones, but this takes it to a new level.

[nonav]

Find someone familiar with Garmin’s GUI.!

They definitely allow display of heading and bearing at the same time.

To navigate, drop the bombsight on your intended waypoint, select Go To (it’s one of the icons on the top of the screen), hit Go when asked.

You’re not using a Garmin AP, so not sure if you’ll see Engage Auto Pilot.

You’ll get your rhum line, heading and bearing.

These will change as the vessel yaws or drifts off course.

If you get way off, there is a Restart Navigation command under Nav Options.

The “intuitive” GUI takes a little getting used to.

Happy New Year!

[DiverSailor]

I will assume you have a NMEA 2000 compass in the system and adjusted? Yes?

[nonav]

Originally Posted by DiverSailor

I will assume you have a NMEA 2000 compass in the system and adjusted? Yes?

Good point!

Heading sensor should be part of the install.

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by bdbcat

Wholybee...

Sorry for the thread drift....


I am interested in this observation:


My Raymarine autopilot controlled by OpenCPN will make a 45 degree turn to get back to the route, when it is only 50 feet off course and less than 1 degree off of a heading to the next waypoint.

I do wish there was a way to configure it between sailing to the next waypoint, vs. staying on the plotted course. But often, staying on course is important. It might be plotted that way to avoid hazards, so getting back to it is priority over taking the short course to the next waypoint.


Tell me more about your experiences in this mode, if you have the time.
Thanks
Dave

I use the "track" mode to navigate a river I sometimes go up. Lots and lots of turns and shallow areas.

It keeps me withing a couple feet of the route, it's very accurate. But I have to get on the route by hand, and be following it exactly, before I engage the autopilot. If I am 25 feet off the route, the autopilot will make a sharp turn, and then overshoot the route, and makes S turns for quite a while before it settles onto the route.

Raymarine has a safety feature where everytime a waypoint is reached, the operator needs to press enter on the controller. Failure to do this and the pilot will not make the turn. The lawyers seem to have forced it, and it REALLY SUCKS. Imho, it makes the autopilot more dangerous, not safer. However, I use a YDWG-02 as my gateway between OCPN and my n2k bus, and it has a feature to press enter for you.

Except for going up the river, I don't use the feature. It works much better to just hold a heading if you are sailing.

[vk4hr]

What compass are you using? Do you have more than one on the network