The two person shower

[Eder]

Whats this run out of hot water nonsense? Am I the only one with a Webasto and endless hot water?

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Eder

Whats this run out of hot water nonsense? Am I the only one with a Webasto and endless hot water?

Indeed. Never a problem on my boat. Eberspacher 12kW central heating furnace with a loop in the calorifier = endless hot water. And anyway 32 liters of water at 80C or whatever is enough for a number of people to shower, even with the central heat turned off.

[Bowdrie]

Originally Posted by Montanan

6 for drinks.
4 for dinner.
2 to sleep over.

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Jesus, are you Iranian or something?

No, he probably isn't, (just guessing).
IIRC, that statement came a few decades ago from Ernest Gann in one of his books and was also stated in a boat design book by Bill Garden.
I believe it was stated as,
"The ideal boat drinks six, eats four, and sleeps two".
I'll bet Ernest and Bill were friends, (reasonable guess).

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by Joboggi

>>>Have grilled the Jeanneau 55 agent


>>> The chief kraken agent is actually a research psychologist whose expertise is PTSD.

Did the ptsd occur after speaking with you?

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

No, he probably isn't, (just guessing).
IIRC, that statement came a few decades ago from Ernest Gann in one of his books and was also stated in a boat design book by Bill Garden.
I believe it was stated as,
"The ideal boat drinks six, eats four, and sleeps two".
I'll bet Ernest and Bill were friends, (reasonable guess).

Gann had big boats -- a 75' ketch, a 117' schooner -- I don't know why he was so niggardly with the guest lists.


My salon table (in my more modest sized boat) seats 8 if you put the extra leaf in it, and I've have 10 for dinner more than a few times.

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Gann had big boats -- a 75' ketch, a 117' schooner -- I don't know why he was so niggardly with the guest lists.


My salon table (in my more modest sized boat) seats 8 if you put the extra leaf in it, and I've have 10 for dinner more than a few times.

Dockhead, I don't think it was guest list for dinner, rather the quantity of those who "tried" to stay overnight.

[Joboggi]

First of all you are correct. You just have to go around 50 feet and select carefully.

Given that I am in the middle and not the end of my search, I have this question.

Hanse ( sailing Aurora) glues the stringers. Hanse makes Moody. Are the stringers glassed in.

Repeating for emphasis only layup yields adequate strength. All boats with glued stringers need to be identified so the sailors can choose wisely.

So is layup or glue for the stringers on a Moody.

I reviewed the Jeanneau 55. I rejected that one for laminated wood. All of that wood is professionally laminated in Italy according to the Jeanneau agent.

However if I picked that one, removing the seat gives me the space. If I get old I would buy a shower seat. That is if they sold me wood cabinets at the same price.

As I wrote before. There are thousands of 40 year old boats with several poorly designed systems.

You need to know what you are buying.

If you know your sailing grounds are experienced and take bare boats when traveling then glued stringers around Annapolis for instance would be acceptable.

When I started at Pax river I often found the bottom of the bay with my keel.

[Joboggi]

Regarding the exercise room. I am going to maintain my V.O2 max above 50 as I finish my sixties and sail through my 70’s and 80’s ( hopefully)

[Matt Johnson]

Originally Posted by Joboggi

I reviewed the Jeanneau 55. I rejected that one for laminated wood. All of that wood is professionally laminated in Italy according to the Jeanneau agent.

You're talking about the veneer -- the thin outside layer of cosmetic wood. Jeanneau uses a "marine grade" of structural plywood for their interiors.

What you call "laminated" is really reconstituted veneer and is produced by ALPI Wood in Italy. For most wood species, reconstituted veneer is actually more expensive, but they use it because they can get consistent grain and color with this product.

[Joboggi]

Hylas or Amel right now

If you saw the rest of the list and you were an agent you would get right back to me.

Based on the overall quality of the entire boat.

Now I have to check to see which instrument panels will accommodate my fish finder.

Certainly the Hylas is a Frers design. I am looking at a Maine berthed Hylas already packing lithium batteries. That family is tuned in to what I want.

Add a few more solar panels, and what not.
Get a few surveys and that could be the boat.

For the most part, this was not fun at all.

I may check in but I have unsubscribed from this thread.

I do hope this is not representative of the average anchorage or yard or marina in 2024.

To the Jeanneau salesman in Annapolis, laminated is how they attach the veneer. Italian or whatever, laminated loses.

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by Joboggi

So is layup or glue for the stringers on a Moody.

Hand laid glass fibre in a temperature controlled factory in Plymouth. Today the business is called Princess Yachts.

Pete

[Joboggi]

Thanks

[Joboggi]

The three things most do not put on their list when buying a sailboat

1. Are the stringers glued or laid up?
2. Is the wood solid or laminated?
3. Are galvanized nails used in the woodwork?

As it turns out I have data on Beneteau and Hanse both mega builders for number one.

Jeanneau for number two


Beneteau again for number three


I was surprised.


If I was never aware of this defect found in number one, I would be upset.

It seems to me insurance co know the 411 on this.

Someone should catalog ALL makes and models with these three defects.

As a non lawyer I am wondering how glued stringers are tolerated?

Getting back into sailing, the Internet is extremely helpful at disseminating information

The mods should use the crowd to detail the defects I found in the fleet.

Beneteau, Hanse and Jeanneau could not possibly get bigger they make so many boats.

If someone is interested I have a Jeanneau 55 stringer picture that purports to prove it is laid up in fiberglass. The brochure itself made me wonder. Not being a shipwright I cannot tell if the stringers are glued or laid up.

I have the pic if anyone is interested.

WNL in medicine stands for WE NEVER LOOKED. Unfortunately it is clear that yacht manufacturers at the very least are very happy that the captains of the fleet never looked into these three issues.

[GordMay]

Joboggi: Could you explain why a hand lay-up of glass fibre and resin is so much better, than a two component methyl methacrylate [MMA*] structural adhesive, to bond components, such as stringers?

* ‘Plexus’ adhesives, for instance, which are often used to bond stringers [& other components], are two component methyl methacrylate structural adhesives.

[Joboggi]

Major differences in strength.

Don’t take my word for it

Do your own resesrch

You can make a box and glass it in or glue it

There are several boat builders on the internet

They do similar things while building a boat

It is not close

They do it to save money. The explanation I have so far is the lesser strength is well known.

The best explanation I have seen so far is sailing aurora repair of a Hanse

According to the description this is the first step in a series of videos.

I came to understand the entire thing watching the entire series

https://youtu.be/8X-Nb9-pbfU?si=0TNw0q0H2KkyJ6qj