Damaged anchor?

[thinwater]

I did not mean to imply that lightweight boats can use a weaker anchor. In fact, I have subjected the cleats of my test multihulls to loads of 50-100% of the boat displacement (taken as a pair) without a groan. I meant to say that there is a point where something is going to fail. It's great that a 40# anchor can sometimes hold 5000 pounds, but more often the bottom will fail. Most test results do not show a 125:1 holding ratio, certainly not if we exclude Fortress.

I was simply reemphasizing the importance of seeking shelter in the worst conditions. Many of the dragging episodes I know have would have been prevented if the sailors had under taken the inconvenience of relocating, either away from the path of the storm, or in protection. It can be a lot of work, but it will reduce the load more than going up a size. Yup, sometimes it's not an option.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

Good point, but have you ever seen a boat ashore because its cleats broke?

Personally, no. All of the broken cleat incidents I've known of second-hand or closer have involved a dock, short lines with not enough stretch, severe shock loads, etc.

Plenty of production boats have well mounted cleats that would give me no concern (my own boat included), but I have seen some where I'd call the mounting downright poor (either no backing plates or just lag bolted into a wood caprail, etc.).

[Kettlewell]

I was simply reemphasizing the importance of seeking shelter in the worst conditions. Many of the dragging episodes I know have would have been prevented if the sailors had under taken the inconvenience of relocating, either away from the path of the storm, or in protection. It can be a lot of work, but it will reduce the load more than going up a size. Yup, sometimes it's not an option.

^^Yes^^ Many times I have been tucked up some creek listening to a gale screaming through the trees while our boat was barely pulling on its anchor rode. Even if you can't get much shelter from the wind getting someplace without wave action reduces peak loads substantially. Practically every summer I witness boats on the rocks just across a spit of land where I am anchored on the other side out of the waves.

[Mickeyrouse]

We have used a Fortress Fx-23 on our 20,000 lb ( design weight) boat, and I have been very pleased with the 24 years it’s held us to the bottom. Overtime, the crown has become bent. At first, I thought it had suffered a rather hard docking, or bumped up against the dock while pitching in high winds. But since this boat has never docked without me at the wheel, and since we were living aboard for a few years, I could not recall any event like those. The folks at Fortress have cheerfully honored the lifetime warranty, and replaced the crown, no problem. But it still keeps getting bent. It has the beginnings of a slight curve even now.
I have decided it happens on the tide change, or just as the boat swings on a wind shift. I think when the anchor is side-loaded on a wind or tide shift, the crown on the lee side remans dug in, and being subjected to a great deal of leverage, bends ever so slightly. Overtime, bend increases. I also have a comparably sized Danforth. I don’t use it much any more- I replaced it with a second FX-23- and have noted that the zinc hot-dip always fails first on the ends of the crown, where it is getting strain the rest of the anchor doesn’t. That supports my hypothesis.
Anyway, That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

[Panope]

I have no reason to doubt Thinwater's assessment that the most common cause of anchor (and bow roller) damage is collisions while maneuvering in tight spaces (docking).

I'll guess that the second most common cause of damage happens on RETRIEVAL when the anchor is stuck on a solid object (or buried really deep).

In the PNW (especially up North) I believe the most likely bending scenario involves rock/boulders. The vast majority of commercial fishermen continue to use ancient pivoting fluke anchors largely because of their immense strength.

Perhaps "cruising geography" should be a major factor in the needed anchor strength.

Is the East Coast and Gulf Coast pretty much free of boulder bottoms?

[Panope]

Originally Posted by Mickeyrouse

We have used a Fortress Fx-23 on our 20,000 lb ( design weight) boat, and I have been very pleased with the 24 years it’s held us to the bottom. Overtime, the crown has become bent. At first, I thought it had suffered a rather hard docking, or bumped up against the dock while pitching in high winds. But since this boat has never docked without me at the wheel, and since we were living aboard for a few years, I could not recall any event like those. The folks at Fortress have cheerfully honored the lifetime warranty, and replaced the crown, no problem. But it still keeps getting bent. It has the beginnings of a slight curve even now.
I have decided it happens on the tide change, or just as the boat swings on a wind shift. I think when the anchor is side-loaded on a wind or tide shift, the crown on the lee side remans dug in, and being subjected to a great deal of leverage, bends ever so slightly. Overtime, bend increases. I also have a comparably sized Danforth. I don’t use it much any more- I replaced it with a second FX-23- and have noted that the zinc hot-dip always fails first on the ends of the crown, where it is getting strain the rest of the anchor doesn’t. That supports my hypothesis.
Anyway, That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Mickeyrouse, could you please clarify which part of your anchor is bending? When you say "crown", I think you might be meaning to say "stock".

[Kettlewell]

Is the East Coast and Gulf Coast pretty much free of boulder bottoms?

Rocky bottoms are pretty rare on the East Coast south of Maine, but up there they are common. Florida, the Bahamas, and the Caribbean do have coral, but usually you can avoid anchoring on actual reefs--and you should! It is more common to find chunks of old coral littering the bottom in some anchorages, but frequently it is shallow enough and clear enough that you can dive on the anchor to dislodge it. It is much more common to foul the anchor on old junk on the bottom, which can lead to extreme loads when trying to retrieve.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Panope

I have no reason to doubt Thinwater's assessment that the most common cause of anchor (and bow roller) damage is collisions while maneuvering in tight spaces (docking).

I'll guess that the second most common cause of damage happens on RETRIEVAL when the anchor is stuck on a solid object (or buried really deep).

In the PNW (especially up North) I believe the most likely bending scenario involves rock/boulders. The vast majority of commercial fishermen continue to use ancient pivoting fluke anchors largely because of their immense strength.

Perhaps "cruising geography" should be a major factor in the needed anchor strength.

Is the East Coast and Gulf Coast pretty much free of boulder bottoms?

Free of rocks, yes, at least outside coral country.


Trees, on the other hand, can be a problem. All of my good snags have been trees. Sometimes a branch or even a huge log will drift into the rode with the tide. I've seen anchors bent horsing them off logs, just the same as rocks. One shopping cart and several tires!


So yes, you can always bend an anchor. Just run up over it with the engine, like the books all say. You might even bend the roller too.


I'm always amused at the number of bent anchors on rollers. If the anchor is bent enough that I see it walking by, it will hold zero. It's just embarrassing to have it there.

[Don C L]

Trip lines!

[Kettlewell]

Trip lines!

Yep, trip lines are good for tripping out your anchor--usually when you don't want to! I have never regularly set a trip line, and have never regretted not doing so. The very few times my anchor has been fouled I have been able to retrieve it some other way. OTOH, there is a very good chance someone will catch your trip line while motoring around the anchorage, which I have seen done several times. In fact, boats often foul on their own trip lines. Yes, there are ways of setting one far enough below the surface to not snag on most boats, but in my experience it is not worth it for that once-in-a-blue-moon need.

[Kettlewell]

Here's a couple seen down in the Caribbean:

[rognvald]

We lost our engine approaching the Virgin Gorda shallows back in the early 90's. We popped our headsail on the charter boat in the light winds and sailed to the east approach of the marina before dowsing our sail and dropping our anchor. We stuck immediately and saw that we blew an impeller. After replacement, we pulled the hook and it was bent 90 degrees on the shank. It was a Hi-Tensile Danforth 12H bent ,apparently, on coral. We were very surprised based on the anchor's reputation. The charter company crossed the channel and brought us a replacement--another Danforth 12H.
Rognvald

[s/v Jedi]

The Sundeer 56 and 60 came with a 50kg Bruce and the 64 with an 80kg Bruce. Dashew wasn’t messing around with anchor gear. A Maxwell chain stopper mounted over a partial bulkhead and a Maxwell 3500 windlass 10’ aft of the bow to bring the chain and it’s weight back.

None of that is bending with anything.

[rognvald]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

The Sundeer 56 and 60 came with a 50kg Bruce and the 64 with an 80kg Bruce. Dashew wasn’t messing around with anchor gear. A Maxwell chain stopper mounted over a partial bulkhead and a Maxwell 3500 windlass 10’ aft of the bow to bring the chain and it’s weight back.

None of that is bending with anything.

No doubt, Jedi . . . on a two million dollar plus boat!
Rognvald

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by rognvald

No doubt, Jedi . . . on a two million dollar plus boat!
Rognvald

?? The Sundeer 64’s sold new for under $500k.

You have the wrong boat in mind, probably an Oyster, HR or Contest etc.