Mayo

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by Krogensailor

As far as grinding grains with molars, it's called, make fire. Look, I'm simply adding to the conversation what is my experience. I no more think that there is one answer to any of this than I think there is only one race of people on this planet. Some can tolerate some things and others cannot. The muscle crowd say more protein and the egg heads say no animal protein. I'm in the middle. A muscle bound egghead, I have at home and on the boat 4 oz serving of protein in individually wrapped. Single serving size. I have one every three or so days. On the other days I eat veggie protein, spinach and other greens, nuts seeds, beans etc. It's the Palio diet, with out excluding the past 15,000 years. Which strikes me as kind of prudent. All the rest, about 80% is veggies and fruit. Eat what you like. we'll see who gets cancer first! That's a joke. Not a good one, but a joke.

My body has a clear reaction to some foods. Psyllium? Terrible for me. Ditto, blck pepper. When a food doesn't agree with you, your body makes it really, really clear. Gluten-free diets is one of the latest fads. I have friend who swears she feels "soo much better" gluten free, but she was high energy and felt great before.

By comparison, another friend truly is gluten intolerant, and it makes her very, very sick.

I react that way to psillium and to peppercorn, so I avoid them. I love milk. I love grains although I don't eat a lof of them. Our molars were made for grinding. Since 25 was old age before 15,000 years ago, we didn't have trouble eating it. Not sure when we started cooking food. Doesn't necessarily line up with when we discovered how to control fire.

MANY primitive societies have included grains in their diets. This is the fad of the week, and we'll move on to another one in a year or two.

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by Freerider

Indeed, but 10 000 years isn't very long in evolutionary terms.

Homo sapiens have only been around for 200 000yrs, while Neanderthal existed for 500 000yrs for example (give or take).

Perhaps when we realize that this processed grain diet is killing everyone, we may push it out and return to a diet in which we evolved on (a colossal undertaking mind you).

If you compare human evolution timeline to 1 year, we've only been eating grains for like 10 minutes.

Wow. It's killing everybody? How in the world did both my MIL and my FIL iive to be 89. You think the French don't eat bread? Or for that matter, how did my grandmother live to be 87?

We're all dying from the day we're born. We are ALL going to die no matter what kind of diet we embrace. But I have the evidence of people in their 80's all around me, and it's very clear that these people aren't dying from grain.

And if you REALLY want to have an evil food to blame for everythng -- CORN. I know someone who uses it as a swear word but right now I'd walk a mile for a good ear of corn -- with real butter from that awful cow, of course ...

[mbianka]

Originally Posted by Don L

Just freakin crazy talk

Agree. I'd never leave port without some Mayo on board. Just the other night I steamed up some shrimp. I took some mayo add some chipotle hot sauce and had a nice spicy dipping sauce for the meal. Next day I took some of the leftover shrimp added some mayo and had a delicious shrimp salad sandwich for lunch. A BLT sandwich without mayo? Not on my boat! Also use it in a salad dressing when I don't feel like whipping up or I'm tired of vinaigrette dressing.

[Krogensailor]

I'm kinda at a loss as to who I may have disparaged. If we have two promenent scientist debating these question's I'm geussing that what you and I hold as opinions are not so meaningful. They are just our opinions. I have spent many years trying and looking at many diets. I'm sharing my experience. That's all. I looked at the videos, clearly therre not yet a meaningful agreement as to what is causing the mirid medical issues we suffer from. Eat what you will, pay attention to who funds who to say what. What are their credentials, experience. Take your pick and well, good luck. Not even remotly interested in pissing anyone off here.

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by Krogensailor

I'm kinda at a loss as to who I may have disparaged. If we have two promenent scientist debating these question's I'm geussing that what you and I hold as opinions are not so meaningful. They are just our opinions. I have spent many years trying and looking at many diets. I'm sharing my experience. That's all. I looked at the videos, clearly therre not yet a meaningful agreement as to what is causing the mirid medical issues we suffer from. Eat what you will, pay attention to who funds who to say what. What are their credentials, experience. Take your pick and well, good luck. Not even remotly interested in pissing anyone off here.

It's not really hard to find the truth, and not hard to learn to tell science from pseudo-science:

Dissecting the Myth: Why Grains and Gluten Aren't Bad for You | Outlaw Fitness

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by Rakuflames

It's not really hard to find the truth, and not hard to learn to tell science from pseudo-science:

Dissecting the Myth: Why Grains and Gluten Aren't Bad for You | Outlaw Fitness

I disagree. All these writers are smart people. On both sides, and the more clever they are, the harder it is to get the real skinny.

Outlaw Fitness was new to me but that was a good read. I noticed a couple of other articles I was interested in reading. Tough to argue with a guy who is not benefiting financially by his work. Thx

[Krogensailor]

Thanks for the link, dissecting the myth. There's always the latest fad afoot, Atkins, Eat right for your blood type, and a boatload of others. Apparently it's as bad as politics, state your view and watch the fur fly. I am personaly gratefull that I have finally set down the doughnut. If one thinks this is a simple matter, do an experiment. Don't eat refined sugar for one week. Post the result's. It took me a few years to kick the addiction. Been over a year now with zero refined sugar or refined flours. Lost 30lb and all meds are in half. Whatever you wish to call it, getting away from the processed food industry is the answer. To be mildly redundant, don't eat food with labels, and if it comes in a bag, a box, a can, or a bottle, don't eat it. And all of this relates to traveling and living aboard our boats. Not having to row into town each morning to make McDonalds by 11am is a wonderful thing.

[jongleur]

Blue Crab said:

Tough to argue with a guy who is not
benefiting financially by his work.

If that's your criteria, you can discount any
study by anyone who has ever been paid for
their work.

How can he call it "Outlaw Fitness" if he's
just spouting conventional wisdom (which
has been a healthcare disaster for the past
40 or so years)?

The "Outlaw" cites as credible the American
Dietetics Association. Look who are the
biggest sponsors of the ADA, which has
changed its name to the Academy of
Nutrition and Dietetics (AND) and has eliminated
the link to their sponsors. Maybe because
they are CocaCola, General Mills,
Kelloggs, Mars, Pepsico and Hersheys. Didn't
someone say to look at who is behind the
advice?

Reasonable criteria would be Randomized
Controlled Trials which are answering these
questions. Try reading Gary Taubes, Good
Calories, Bad Calories. Check out Peter
Attia's website, The Eating Academy.

[Blue Crab]

"Tough to argue with a guy who is not
benefiting financially by his work.

If that's your criteria, you can discount any
study by anyone who has ever been paid for
their work."


Yepper. I do tend to discount the studies. How can a layman tell what's what? Thx for the references. I'll read them. I've been casually following the diet business for awhile and feel I know less, for sure, now than I did just growing up with my mom's info.

[Freerider]

Originally Posted by Rakuflames

Wow. It's killing everybody? How in the world did both my MIL and my FIL iive to be 89. You think the French don't eat bread? Or for that matter, how did my grandmother live to be 87?

I don't think your 3 person study group would hold up as evidence of anything.

Global cancer rates are up 20% in the past decade, what gives?

[hellosailor]

"Global cancer rates are up 20% in the past decade, what gives? "
Oooh, ooh, I'll bet I can prove the answer!

It isn't all the chemicals around and in us. Forget that "epigenetics" is now mainsteam biology but fifty years ago it didn't exist either.

The cancer rate is a direct result of all the AC electricial fields being pumped into the planet. Like Romans with their hygienic new lead water pipes, we all need to simply shut down all the power.

No, wait, that's wrong, it must be cosmic rays, I know an astrologer who can show you exactly why the new alignment is simply going to expose us to more ionizing radiation for the next thousand years, deal with it.

No, wait, I know a better one, an old Druid priest who can prove all this cancer started when men started to scoff at the old TRUE gods, this is their vengeance for all the folks following the new false gods. Who obviously must be false, since the world did so well for so many thousands of years before the new names were even spoken.

And since the priest doesn't get paid for his dedication, he obviously has it right.

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Krogensailor

The rules for a historically, healthy and normal diet for human being's. Historical meaning the past 12,000 years, excluding the past 100 year disaster. If it comes in a bag, a box, a can, or a bottle, don't eat it. Eat only foods that have no label. If this sounds extreme, it is. But nowhere near as extreme as cancer, heart disease, diabesity, and the list goes on. I've learned this, I hope, not too late, and it's really not that tough to do. I think of my Grandparents, they prepared virtually every meal they ever consumed. From food that came straight out of the earth. Food that can be easily carried on a boat. Freeze some 4 oz protein packs, pic up local veggies and use killer filters on the water system. O' yea, if you do this you will find out in about five days just how clinically addicted you are to the American Diet. Sugar, fat, refined carbs, designer chemicals, (that are designed to addict). Frankenfoods.

I am not going to follow you advise. Yet I am quite certain that my chance of living significantly longer then my grandparents did is pretty good. On average we eat a lot better then our ancestors did. (City folk in the 19th century for example had no fresh food whatsoever....)

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Rakuflames

my husband had emergency bypass surgery in 1986. The doctor and a nutritionist told us with great confidence that he should eat margerine -- specifically, Fleischmann's. I went to the store and read the labels, and chose the margerine with the fewest chemicals in it, which wasn't easy.

I hate to disappoint you. But all food is composed for 100% of water, minerals and organic and inorganic chemicals. And its not because some chemical was produced in a plant and not a factory that it is by definition healthier. You should see the amount of poisonous stuff some common herbs, vegetables and spices contain.

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

"Global cancer rates are up 20% in the past decade, what gives? "

Actually it's all the other diseases that are down. Imagine we manage to conquer all diseases but one... I guess a lot of people would then be whining how X is causing us all to get Y...

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Krogensailor

The rules for a historically, healthy and normal diet for human being's. Historical meaning the past 12,000 years, excluding the past 100 year disaster. If it comes in a bag, a box, a can, or a bottle, don't eat it. Eat only foods that have no label. If this sounds extreme, it is. But nowhere near as extreme as cancer, heart disease, diabesity, and the list goes on. I've learned this, I hope, not too late, and it's really not that tough to do. I think of my Grandparents, they prepared virtually every meal they ever consumed. From food that came straight out of the earth. Food that can be easily carried on a boat. Freeze some 4 oz protein packs, pic up local veggies and use killer filters on the water system. O' yea, if you do this you will find out in about five days just how clinically addicted you are to the American Diet. Sugar, fat, refined carbs, designer chemicals, (that are designed to addict). Frankenfoods.

Ogh yes our predecessors, funnily they typically died much younger then current and the future generations

Despite eating all the " frankenfoods" our problems are people living too long not dying because of such foods.

I'm not saying that a diet of burgers is good for you but a healty diet with. Carbs, fats and proteins all eaten in moderation is the best. Simply saying eat food without a label is nonsense

Dave