Mayo

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by SmartMove

Maybe, I stopped growing several years ago at 5'-7". I think I am happy about that though, lol.

Seriously? You are under, say 25?

[SmartMove]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

Seriously? You are under, say 25?

I wish, maybe I should have said decades ago -- but that just sounds so old.

[Blue Crab]

Yep, yeah, and yepper.

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Krogensailor

The statistical facts say differently, You will not live as long.

The experts I am aware of beg to differ. In Europe 1/3 of everyone born in 2000 is expected to see 2100...

Your children are in much worse condition than you may have been at their age. Obesity and consequently, diabetes, hypertension, heart disease, all diet related disorders are showing up in children under twenty. Their lives will be effected by the current situation. I'm not offering any advice. I'm sharing what I do in my home and on my boat. Do as you will.

There's a whole world out there that is not called US of A.
For example, where I am now there is a whole generation growing up that is not even bothering getting a driving licence. These kids are moving a lot more as their parents did. They are also eating more varied.

When we sit down at our dinner table tonight, O' wait, we don't sit down to dinner together anymore. Well, when you sit down to implant your Big Mac tonight, because we don't chew either, know that there are over 3000 chemical compounds that are in there that were not in your grandparents dinner.

So there are chemicals in our food that weren't there decades ago. And there are chemicals that are no longer there. And there are patogens that are no longer there.
And there are things in our food that are bad for us. Big deal. It has always been like that. Our bodies are under constant assault, and have been so every since the first multi cellular organisms arose. Our bodies know how to deal with that.

Your grandparents if they lived before 1956 never ate chemical fertilizers. They ate cow **** contaminated goods. We sell that today and call it, Pro-biotics. We can each have our own opinion, our own feelings and our own thoughts, what you can't have is your own facts.

If you think that chemical fertilisers were not used before 1956 than you indeed seem to have your own set of facts...
BTW. "Cow ****" is still killing people worldwide.

And I know it's hard to discern what the facts are, but that hopefully won't stop us from seeking them out. Cancer is in fact off the hook. How many of our grandparents had skin cancer? Has the sun changed in some way? No.

No. The sun hasn't changed. Our behaviour has. And it is changing again. This btw illustrates the problem of lumping all cancer together as if it was one desease. Cancer is a family of deseases, and there are lots of different cancers, each with their own causes.
The rise in skin cancer has everything to do with behaviour changes. And skin cancer will go down in the future, as people have become aware, are exposing themselves less to the sun and using sun screen (chemicals!), which has improved a lot.
Other cancers are caused by viruses. Girls here now get a vaccine that means that their generation will see 2/3 less cervical cancer...
I'm quite certain the type of cancers associated with smoking will go down too in the future.

We have. Aids, Epstien Barr, MS, limes, psoriasis, Chronic fatigue syndrome and on and on. All are known to be the result of a diminished and exhausted immune system.

They are mostly the result of better diagnosis. People used to just get sick. We got better at putting labels on sicknesses.

Further, it's in many cases our own immune system that's attacting us. We can see it or not. We can care or not. We can look to responsible unbiased, non commercial sources of info, NHI, CDC, Major Universities, or you can read a blog by some guy. You can ridicule creative brainstorming, people of good will attempting to understand.

On of the "non commercial, academic" sources of info I look at, is the increasing evidence that humans are prone to pessimism. In a way our brains are indeed still stuck in the Savannas, where not seeing a lion that is there is a more costly mistake to make than seeing a lion that is not there.
Hence we tend to pessimistic of the future, and nostalgic of the past.
Once you know that you are biased however, and that this bias is hard wired in your brain you can do something about it.
And then you look around with different eyes. And then you see that the world is changing, that the world has always been changing and that indeed some of the changes are not for the good.
But I also see that our diet is not getting worse. People are eating more fruit and vegetables than they did 200 years ago, and in a greater variety. It is a fact that in the early nineteenth century the technology to bring fresh produce to the inhabitants of a city like London (then already a huge place) at prices they could afford simple didn't exist. So the city folk lived on potatoes, bread and pork. How things have changed.
I counted 8 different breeds of tomatoes in the supermarket yesterday. I do know for a fact that the choice of produce available to us was a lot less when I was a child. (We never had Broccoli for example). Food wise I eat a lot better than my parents do, our my grandparents (nevertheless they all lived well in to their nineties...). I eat vegetables I didn't even know existed 10 years ago...

Or you can sit down in your favorite fast food joint and commiserate with the other patrons about what a bunch of idiots are out there. For me, at my age, I've seen too many people die off from the above diseases, I'm looking to not be one for as long as possible. Good luck to all. Bon Apetite' . PS. And my main point is to simplify my nutritional requirements on the boat. Simple. cheap, healthy.

Actaully, I do like fast food occasionally. I especially like "local" fast food, as every place has it. However, if there is no time to investigate what the best local food is, and you are in a place where good food isn't evident (like the UK...) McDonnalds can be a good alternative. Just get water in stead of a Coke.
That is the worst thing about anglosaxon eating habits. I still can't understand how adults can drink soft drinks...

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

Apparently the milking machines irritate the cows' nipples so the cows respond by sending white blood cells (pus) to repair the damage which, unfortunately is constant. So pus is going into the milk, plus the antibiotics from the dairy "farmer". I realize the milk is then pasteurized, blah blah, but knowing about the pus has ruined milk for me.

A hint: Don't investigate what your other food comes from. And don't even think about where eggs come from :-)

Or get over the fact that food is messy, that preparing food is chemistry. And that a bit of "pus" never harmed anyone.
When I sail on the local lake I drink water from it when I'm thirsty. The same water the local fish go to the loo in...

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Krogensailor

And as far as living in the city and fresh foods, I don't know how old you are, but I remember very well the hucksters rolling through the city streets, in I hesitate to say it, their horse and wagons. Cheez, am I that old? Loaded with fresh vegetables. "Fresh tomatoes, Broccoli, Batatoes" I can hear em now.

I don't think you are old enough to remember the 19th century. I'm only in my forties however, and can still remember discovering broccoli in my 20ies...

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Krogensailor

Of course there a farm within 50 miles of anyone's home. 100 at most. I can deliver veggie that distance in a hour and a half. And we do everyday.

But if I limit myself only to local farms cooking would become rather boring...

I don't drink milk at all, because it infant food for a cow. Have you ever seen a cow lay on it's side and slide up under another cow to get some lunch?

There is nothing natural about anything we eat.

Life move's along. Excepting the creationist out there, all life 'evolves', meaning it goes forward. Not backward. And for good reason.

We do indeed evolve. And one of the nice examples is how we have evolved to be able to digest milk (at least in some populations)

[Seaworthy Lass]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

I think (without any more expertise than the next guy) we should stop eating white things and stick with colorful food.

I have had this theory for the last few decades that most food (or at least component of food) that stains clothes really really badly is really really good for you. I call it my "laundry test".

Thank goodness red wine fits into this strategy (still figuring out how Scotch and chocolate might though ).

[cheoah]

Well this got interesting. As a farmer, it is entertaining to hear perceptions on things like milk.....

I keep a little Jersey cow out back my farm shop to cream coffee, milk for staff and families, and freeze her colostrum when she freshens for calves in the beef herd when needed.

Yes adult cows will sneak a little milk (before the other cow kicks her in the head) and I've had one that even self-nursed from time to time.

Dairymen monitor the white blood cell counts in their milk and cows that have high cell counts or get mastitis (infection of the udder) get treated and the milk is dumped. The milk gets tested on the milk truck too, so dairymen work hard to keep it clean because it can affect their bottom line. Hard to do when you're milking 7000 cows. Improper milking technique with auto milkers can cause mastitis , but so can lying in the mud, and also a calves mouth can transmit, and there is also a genetic propensity to mastitis too. Hell even my little jersey, who's teats are gently caressed by fair, young, maidens gets mastitis. I don't drink much milk, and I know it ain't for everyone, but dairy products come in many forms, from different species and many are very good.

Lots of opinions about eating and food. Some are very extreme. No doubt too much carbs is unnecessary for us idle adults, but tell my 18 yo daughter playing NCAA D1 athletics that carbs are bad.... She is a very good eater, whole grains, fruit, veggies, some of my grassfed beef, lamb, pork, chicken, eggs, and of course she likes tofu some - which I don't raise. God knows what she will eat in college next year. When we visited and looked at the stirfry line - along with brown rice, she complained they use too much oil.

Everyone needs to find out what works for them. If your doctor says you are overweight, you probably have not quite figured it out yet. Not my place to judge. I'm a 40 yo farmer now, who used to eat large portions of meat, 6% Jersey milk, desserts, etc. Now I eat small portions of my home grown pasture raised meats, and way more fruits and veggies, and way less carbs overall. I'm down 30 lbs to 200 now, and feel pretty good. But that's me, and my friends with different genetic backgrounds are a little different. In general though, I've discovered that I was eating way too much, and with smaller meals, and fruit throughout the day, I'm still meeting all my dietary needs.

I tend to eat much healthier on the boat. I eat way more fruit and way less food overall. For short cruises, we take green veggies from our garden, lots of fruit, eggs, and an assortment of meats. Having gotten used to producing most of my own food over the years, it is one thing I will mis when we shove off for longer voyages. No matter, I do just fine traveling in Latin America for work, eating rice and beans.

Now that I am making charcuterie on farm, I find myself having to test my products, which are often made from pork belly. Pork belly is mui rico, and will put the L-B's on me in a hurry. Every batch of pancetta, guanciale, fresh sausage has to be tested....

Moderation...., along with a mixed diet of nutrient dense food, is optimal for most, but a coke here and there is just fine, imho

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by jongleur

Just because something has been consumed
for a long long time doesn't mean it's good
for you.

Check out:
Wheat Belly Blog | Lose the Wheat Lose the Weight

Can't argue with that logic! If it's on the internet, it's true. Every single word of it.

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by Freerider

Its true, but a century isn't a very long time.

Dr. Fasano, director of the University of Maryland Center for Celiac Research has estimated that 6-7% of the population is gluten-sensitve, however most don't even know it.

That's like 20 million americans, enough to make you wonder if we're really mean't to eat it.

Also with the advent of Agriculture, the human skeleton began to decline in size and health, when compared with their hunter-gatherer ancestors.

Dawn of agriculture took toll on health

Dishonest reading.

He didn't say century. he said centurIES. If you want credibility, don't do things like that.

As for your quote, see my comment above about the complete infallibility of anything on the internet.

That makes the world flat. Who knew?

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by Krogensailor

The statistical facts say differently, You will not live as long. Your children are in much worse condition than you may have been at their age. Obesity and consequently, diabetes, hypertension, heart disease, all diet related disorders are showing up in children under twenty. Their lives will be effected by the current situation. I'm not offering any advice. I'm sharing what I do in my home and on my boat. Do as you will.
When we sit down at our dinner table tonight, O' wait, we don't sit down to dinner together anymore. Well, when you sit down to implant your Big Mac tonight, because we don't chew either, know that there are over 3000 chemical compounds that are in there that were not in your grandparents dinner. Your grandparents if they lived before 1956 never ate chemical fertilizers. They ate cow **** contaminated goods. We sell that today and call it, Pro-biotics. We can each have our own opinion, our own feelings and our own thoughts, what you can't have is your own facts. And I know it's hard to discern what the facts are, but that hopefully won't stop us from seeking them out. Cancer is in fact off the hook. How many of our grandparents had skin cancer? Has the sun changed in some way? No. We have. Aids, Epstien Barr, MS, limes, psoriasis, Chronic fatigue syndrome and on and on. All are known to be the result of a diminished and exhausted immune system. Further, it's in many cases our own immune system that's attacting us. We can see it or not. We can care or not. We can look to responsible unbiased, non commercial sources of info, NHI, CDC, Major Universities, or you can read a blog by some guy. You can ridicule creative brainstorming, people of good will attempting to understand. Or you can sit down in your favorite fast food joint and commiserate with the other patrons about what a bunch of idiots are out there. For me, at my age, I've seen too many people die off from the above diseases, I'm looking to not be one for as long as possible. Good luck to all. Bon Apetite' . PS. And my main point is to simplify my nutritional requirements on the boat. Simple. cheap, healthy.

MY children have diabetes. OMG -- they didn't tell me!!!!

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

I don't know where you are getting your facts , but on average life expectancy is rising ( for well off societies) . This is down to nutrition and improved Heath care.

That is not to say , there are elements of what you say that are not correct , many of your points are valid. However in recent years there has been a tendency to return to cooked meals etc amongst the middle classes. All conventional proper dieticians will advocate balanced diets.

Yes people living out of McDonald's have a problem , but often this is poverty or education issues.

Dave

That's how most of these theories take off. There's a kernel (pardon the pun!) of truth and then the imagination takes flight.

It's like the old blood type diets. The kernel of truth is that there's more than one blood type. For some hucksters (and that's all they are), that was enough.

I don't mean the people HERE are hucksters. But I do think they have been persuaded by hucksters.

[Freerider]

Originally Posted by Rakuflames

Dishonest reading.

He didn't say century. he said centurIES. If you want credibility, don't do things like that.

As for your quote, see my comment above about the complete infallibility of anything on the internet.

That makes the world flat. Who knew?

Sorry mom.......centurIES

[Rakuflames]

[QUOTE=Krogensailor;1285111]Just from the diabetes point. There are other graphs that indicate that in more recent time, trends are moving in a likewise manner.

Welcome to the CDC Diabetes - Data & Trends site. (end quote)


Sorry, but you have just demonstrated a huge level of science illiteracy. I don't want to be that harsh, but it's the truth.

True science does not make the great LEAPS you have made from those sites to the "paleo diet." That is a leap that only you and other paleo fans have made, and apparently, you truly think the science you just cited supports you.

This is the kind of scientific hubris the mathematician was railing against in JURASSIC PARK. It's junk science, one of the best examples (I'm sorry) I've seen in a very long time.

It is EXACTLY what I was talking about when I said that most people think they understand what they're reading in research when they actually don't have a clue.

We saw something similar when we were talking about the ColRegs. They're written in "leagalese," and the average person can read them and think they mean something very different than they actually do. Such people (if they survive the collision at sea) will be surprised and outraged when Maritime Law rules solidly against them.

Same thing here. The only people who will believe what was just posted are people who are scientifically illiterate. But for the most part, those people will completely dismiss the notion that they aren't getting it, and instead think that the person who pointed it out (in this case, me) is naive and duped by some form of a great medical conspiracy to squash the truth.

Five years from now the people who expect to live forever on this diet -- the older ones anyway -- will develop the inevitable ailments of old age -- arthritis, or something more serious -- and will search for a NEW diet to save them. They will then extoll that diet far and wide to anyone who will listen (or can't get away).