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Old 01-02-2018, 19:22   #151
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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Can you expand on this a bit? Your annual spend is higher than this (per your monthly spending posts) . Are you pulling the rest from an after tax savings account?
From my savings
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Old 01-02-2018, 20:04   #152
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

Obamacare will save your ass.

For my platinum plan from Blue Shield, which is very low cost to use $5mdrugs, $20 for most visits, and best: I can see and am covered for any specialist. No doc blocking! Before Obamacare, for this exact same plan, I paid well over $3000 per month. Obamacare lowered this premium to $2000. Since I retired and my income dropped significantly (I still have a small business, like you will have if you keep the one old plane), my out of pocket is now $1100 per month. Im 60, my wife is 55.

Not bad, considering USA health care is embarrassingly expensive.

Allianz provided my health care when I lived, worked, studied, amd worked in Germany. It as about $250 per month, included my kids and we were 35and 30. That was an amazing policy: no limits on anything including pre-existing conditions: my wife was pregnant when we got the insurance, and they covered everything. I mean absolutely every cent for any surgery, sickness, child care, even a paid two week vacation every other year for all women.
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Old 01-02-2018, 20:07   #153
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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I live in Canada, and here health care is FREE.
I think that the USA is the only country in the First World that does not provide free public health care to help cure people.

But you have a great military.
When I had cancer and was being treated at Sloan Kettering in New York, I was shocked at how many patients I met who had abandoned their better and cheaper healthcare in other countries to come to the US and pay for inferior health care. As I recall, there were more than a few Canadians on my floor.
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Old 01-02-2018, 21:23   #154
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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When I had cancer and was being treated at Sloan Kettering in New York, I was shocked at how many patients I met who had abandoned their better and cheaper healthcare in other countries to come to the US and pay for inferior health care. As I recall, there were more than a few Canadians on my floor.
Nobody here has said that US healthcare is inferior. If you can afford it, it's the best.
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Old 01-02-2018, 21:25   #155
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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When I had cancer and was being treated at Sloan Kettering in New York, I was shocked at how many patients I met who had abandoned their better and cheaper healthcare in other countries to come to the US and pay for inferior health care. As I recall, there were more than a few Canadians on my floor.
Canadians have excellent cancer treatment ..More than a few on your floor is a reach to try and make your point is my guess.
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Old 01-02-2018, 22:04   #156
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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but there are almost 10x more people here and government has a hard time running itself
Running a healthcare system for 350m people is a whole lot more complicated than one for 35m people.
China has some, ah, quirks. Like taking kidneys from prisoners?
Where in the world do you people get this stuff? The part of the government that has a hard time running itself is congress. We have people that actually believe tabloid stories and conspiracy theories running our country. They don't have a clue how global economics works and they put personal beliefs ahead of real facts and science.

You have NO idea what actually goes on in China outside of the products you buy at Walmart and what you hear from radio hosts. They provide healthcare for a billion people, not a few hundred million. I saw Cat Scan machines in small village clinics. Their doctors see more patients in a month than your doctor probably sees in a year. They are well trained, educated and have experience well beyond the average doctor in our country.

My mom had a stroke IN Hershey Medical Center and it took 4 hours for a doctor to see her. She just had a heart procedure that same day and the nurses were right outside her room. She never woke up. My grandmother died there as well. I had a simple medical with what is supposed to be a good insurance plan through work. Cost me thousands. I wonít be back for any testing any time soon. I did get a free flu shot though. Yeah!

Nothing wrong with making money doing what you do. Doctors should be paid a good wage for their work and education. But making triple digit profits off the sick, dying and elderly is obscene! No way you can sugar coat this.

Our system is broken because insurance companies are FAR LESS efficient that our government and allowing anybody to call themselves an insurance company in a "free" enterprise environment is a recipe for disaster for those (the uneducated) that don't have the time or resources to find better.

If a batch of billionaires can bring us affordable health care that is non-profit, I'm all in. Cut out ALL the other insurance companies and force the greedy pharmaceutical companies to provide affordable medications. Most of the research is government sponsored, why should they reap incredible profits?

I love America, but free enterprise is simply not free. Iím over 60 so medical care costs are a very real obstacle to me sailing and enjoying my golden years. If something catastrophic happens, I will most likely lose my house. In PA, putting my vegetable Mom into a medical facility cost half the value of her home. Although the house was already paid for, I had to get a big mortgage to save the home. Our medical system will bankrupt many people long before they die. We are the richest country in the world. Is this the best we can do?

A system that works pretty darned well in a country like Canada, would work even better in a rich country with more people, all pooling their money for a common cause. Just take a minute to think about that for a minute. Any argument you can give cannot refute the math. If China can do it, we are just a sad people if we canít do better. My sailing future depends on it.
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Old 02-02-2018, 04:55   #157
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

you guys just can't stop yourself from ranting about the various countries health care systems can you
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Old 02-02-2018, 06:24   #158
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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Our medical system will bankrupt many people long before they die.
IMO that's a feature not a bug. It's how the system was designed.

My one brush with the US "healthcare" system for a chronic disease, I came away with the impression they were more interested with getting me a pill regimen vs curing the issue. I changed doctors to one not from the US and we got me off the pills in a year with just common sense lifestyle changes (nutrition, exercise, and activity level changes). Of course, most american's wouldn't do that as it's easier to just take a pill but that's another discussion.
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Old 02-02-2018, 07:34   #159
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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Canadians have excellent cancer treatment ..More than a few on your floor is a reach to try and make your point is my guess.
The complaint from Canadians, apparently, is the time it takes to schedule operations. We became good friends with a Canadian couple on our last cruise, and the wife had a hip problem. She had been on a wait list for her surgery for two years, and they were at the point where they were about ready to pony up the money and go to the US to have ot done. Which, she said is what most people they know in Canada with money do when they don't want to wait.
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Old 02-02-2018, 08:08   #160
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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The complaint from Canadians, apparently, is the time it takes to schedule operations. We became good friends with a Canadian couple on our last cruise, and the wife had a hip problem. She had been on a wait list for her surgery for two years, and they were at the point where they were about ready to pony up the money and go to the US to have ot done. Which, she said is what most people they know in Canada with money do when they don't want to wait.
There is a little bit of truth to what you say. Hips, knees etc. are elective surgery unless in serious pain and there is indeed a waiting list but it's usually measured in months and not years although 6 months is not uncommon and each Province is a bit different, some have very short waiting lists and others longer. The waiting lists are monitored on an ongoing basis and reported on to the public..no one would put up with 24 months much less 12 months..Personally I think your friend was exaggerating or possibly her Doctor didn't think she needed it right away because I watch this sort of stuff and have never heard of anyone waiting 2 years.
What this does is allow for immediate care for serious stuff like Cancer and Heart surgery and any number of non elective medical conditions.
I recently was put through the system and chose to get some tests at a private clinic where I could get 1 day service at my expense but from the time I met with the surgeon to when the operation took place was 10 days so I can't bad mouth the system.
Some people with a few bucks that are never used to a short wait for anything do indeed travel elsewhere to get knees and hips done although India is probably many times more popular than the USA as their work and skill is excellent and the prices are less than 1/3 of the USA. I have actually met several Americans that has knees done in India.
The important thing to remember is that we chose to run it the way we do, it save us lots of money and no one is going to die waiting a few months for a knee operation. Anything life threatening is dealt with immediately. Its not the best system in the world, we are usually rated better than the USA but not as good as many other countries so if we wanted to spend more we could improve it but most Canadians are ok with our current system. No one is going to have to mortgage their home or worry about a child that chose to not insure themselves and just got into an accident nor feel they have to keep a job they dont like to maintain insurance...It's better for a Nations well being not to have to worry about this sort of stuff.Our costs to the individual is close to 1/2 of the USA and like Americans we all pay into the system from the day we start work. It's just insurance for a service without the profit motive. If you have deeper pockets then I'm sure your system works as well or better for you.
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Old 02-02-2018, 08:10   #161
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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Nobody here has said that US healthcare is inferior. If you can afford it, it's the best.


I donít think so, pretty inferior actually.
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Old 02-02-2018, 08:29   #162
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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Originally Posted by taxwizz View Post
I live in Canada, and here health care is FREE.
I think that the USA is the only country in the First World that does not provide free public health care to help cure people.
There are zero countries that provide free public health care. After all, doctors need to eat too.
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Old 02-02-2018, 10:18   #163
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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WOW, is this country full of snowflakes! Since when is $3500 an enormous deductible? One auto accident or heart attack can put you in a hospital where after two weeks the 24 hour doctor/surgeon/anesthesiologist/hospital/nurse/facility/lab/drug/personal injury insurance/janitorial fees for those taking care of you can quickly shoot past $150,000, Do Americans believe that health care is free or that health care workers work for min wage?
We think it should be almost free. We'll pay a little. And the govmint shouldn't be involved in paying for any of it, because socialism is satanic (unless it's losses that are being socialized).

So yes, all insurance companies are supposed to give us almost free-health care.
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Old 02-02-2018, 15:41   #164
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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Originally Posted by Group9 View Post
The complaint from Canadians, apparently, is the time it takes to schedule operations. We became good friends with a Canadian couple on our last cruise, and the wife had a hip problem. She had been on a wait list for her surgery for two years, and they were at the point where they were about ready to pony up the money and go to the US to have ot done. Which, she said is what most people they know in Canada with money do when they don't want to wait.
Contrast this Canadian complaint to a US complaint that a lifetime working, good citizen, ends up bankrupt from medical expenses after getting sick, leaving the spouse with debts and no.savings. Different systems,different goals.
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Old 02-02-2018, 15:49   #165
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Re: Early retirement and health care for boaters

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There is a little bit of truth to what you say. Hips, knees etc. are elective surgery unless in serious pain and there is indeed a waiting list but it's usually measured in months and not years although 6 months is not uncommon and each Province is a bit different, some have very short waiting lists and others longer. The waiting lists are monitored on an ongoing basis and reported on to the public..no one would put up with 24 months much less 12 months..Personally I think your friend was exaggerating or possibly her Doctor didn't think she needed it right away because I watch this sort of stuff and have never heard of anyone waiting 2 years.
What this does is allow for immediate care for serious stuff like Cancer and Heart surgery and any number of non elective medical conditions.
I recently was put through the system and chose to get some tests at a private clinic where I could get 1 day service at my expense but from the time I met with the surgeon to when the operation took place was 10 days so I can't bad mouth the system.
Some people with a few bucks that are never used to a short wait for anything do indeed travel elsewhere to get knees and hips done although India is probably many times more popular than the USA as their work and skill is excellent and the prices are less than 1/3 of the USA. I have actually met several Americans that has knees done in India.
The important thing to remember is that we chose to run it the way we do, it save us lots of money and no one is going to die waiting a few months for a knee operation. Anything life threatening is dealt with immediately. Its not the best system in the world, we are usually rated better than the USA but not as good as many other countries so if we wanted to spend more we could improve it but most Canadians are ok with our current system. No one is going to have to mortgage their home or worry about a child that chose to not insure themselves and just got into an accident nor feel they have to keep a job they dont like to maintain insurance...It's better for a Nations well being not to have to worry about this sort of stuff.Our costs to the individual is close to 1/2 of the USA and like Americans we all pay into the system from the day we start work. It's just insurance for a service without the profit motive. If you have deeper pockets then I'm sure your system works as well or better for you.
Thanks, but I'll stick with our system. But, I will admit, it takes better care of people who put some planning into their lives, than of those who don't. Kind of like life in general.
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