Will our next battery bank be Sodium ion?

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by coopec43

Well what about a Sodium ion powered motor car? Would they be off the table too?

Probably the same thing most EVs do with water cooled, temperature controlled battery packs to keep them from getting too hot or cold based on outside temps and heat from periods of heavy load (fast acceleration and fast charging).

[Zil]

"From smartphones, tablets, scooters and electric cars to children's toys, portable chargers, robot vacuums and electric toothbrushes, lithium-ion batteries are powering an increasing number of personal items. Over the past year, they've caused more than 1000 fires around Australia".26 Apr 2024 (SMH)
That is just false information.
"Lithium-Ion" covers a lot of different chemistries. Lithium Iron Phosphate is just one of the family of Lithium-Ion batteries. LiFePo is safe, they have not been on fire. Provide evidence that LiFePo are a fire hazard. Get your facts and refer to the real chemistry, not just the family of lithium batteries.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by coopec43

Well what about a Sodium ion powered motor car? Would they be off the table too?

Buy what you want...

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by coopec43

Well who said Sodium ion marine batteries are not on the horizon?

SIB 12v 24v sodium-ion batteries 50ah 100ah 200ah 300ah 400ah sodium ion battery pack for solar yacht marine boat RV Camper. US$ 35. 10–499 Units. US$ 34. 500 ...

https://www.globalsources.com/Sodium...212575521p.htm

Buy it and test it instead philosophy in your armchair...i stay with LTO and Lifepo4

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by Zil

"From smartphones, tablets, scooters and electric cars to children's toys, portable chargers, robot vacuums and electric toothbrushes, lithium-ion batteries are powering an increasing number of personal items. Over the past year, they've caused more than 1000 fires around Australia".26 Apr 2024 (SMH)
That is just false information.
"Lithium-Ion" covers a lot of different chemistries. Lithium Iron Phosphate is just one of the family of Lithium-Ion batteries. LiFePo is safe, they have not been on fire. Provide evidence that LiFePo are a fire hazard. Get your facts and refer to the real chemistry, not just the family of lithium batteries.

That is the whole issue that a whole category lithium and one battery chemistry is named the same way...Li-ion....
So there is not a lot of misinformation but a lot misunderstandings.

But when we talk here in the forum about lithium or LFP everybody means LiFePo4 if not stated otherwise and its direct derivates which are save to use if properly installed.

In powertools and powerbanks you only find the LI-ion with its huge energy density that makes it very easy to seperate LI-ion and Lifepo4. that high energy density is dangerous and can get a get thermal runaway (most frequent reason overcharging) means it can even ignite itself. A no go on any seagoing vessel as house battery. You can step out of a burning EV early enough and be safe but you cannot from a vessel at sea.

And for your powertools which chemistry Li-ion whicg you cannot avoid only use well known brands and their original chargers. When charging these batteries keep an eye on them, do not place them near entrance of the cabin or walkways, staircase and immediately take them out of the charger when full. I store them wrapped in a fireblanket for the gas oven and easy accessible, if they self-ignite through a thermal runaway and still be able to grab it due to the fireblanket and throw overboard. The tiny 4AH AEG 18V battery pack was able to start my Volvo D2-50...thats 350A surge current. If that would self ignite and you have it stored in a mono close to the staircase you death trapped yourself...happened already several times. Mine are stored easy accessible in the bow close to a hatch.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by coopec43

OK!


I started to watch one of his video clips and thought it was a joke. I'm sure he tries but he is an amateur (like us) not an expert to take advice from..

For you, of all people, to call him an amateur, is beyond funny.

He has done more hands-on experimentation and testing than any of the endless spam channel links you post from your random Google results.

He documents his findings and incorporates feedback from his huge group of followers. His data is extremely valuable.

You post advertisements that would make Alibaba vendors blush and cite them as fact.

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

That is the whole issue that a whole category lithium and one battery chemistry is named the same way...Li-ion....
So there is not a lot of misinformation but a lot misunderstandings.

But when we talk here in the forum about lithium or LFP everybody means LiFePo4 if not stated otherwise and its direct derivates which are save to use if properly installed.

In power tools and powerbanks you only find the LI-ion with its huge energy density that makes it very easy to seperate LI-ion and Lifepo4. that high energy density is dangerous and can get a get thermal runaway (most frequent reason overcharging) means it can even ignite itself. A no go on any seagoing vessel as house battery. You can step out of a burning EV early enough and be safe but you cannot from a vessel at sea.

And for your powertools which chemistry Li-ion whicg you cannot avoid only use well known brands and their original chargers. When charging these batteries keep an eye on them, do not place them near entrance of the cabin or walkways, staircase and immediately take them out of the charger when full. I store them wrapped in a fireblanket for the gas oven and easy accessible, if they self-ignite through a thermal runaway and still be able to grab it due to the fireblanket and throw overboard. The tiny 4AH AEG 18V battery pack was able to start my Volvo D2-50...thats 350A surge current. If that would self ignite and you have it stored in a mono close to the staircase you death trapped yourself...happened already several times. Mine are stored easy accessible in the bow close to a hatch.

Excellent advice!

Having had an 18V L ion battery about to burst into flames I had to throw it into a bucket, race up the gangway, across the deck and douse it in seawater. These days I won't leave them on board overnight.

Since they are now manufacturing Sodium ion 18650 batteries I wouldn't be surprised to see them powering our hand tools by the end of the year.

[coopec43]

In Australia we had an urgent recall of LG Lithium solar storage batteries however they were undoubtedly L ion.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/lg...f-774918740a41

[GILow]

Originally Posted by coopec43

In Australia we had an urgent recall of LG Lithium solar storage batteries however they were undoubtedly L ion.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/lg...f-774918740a41

And you’d probably be wrong. Most LG stuff is nickel based.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by coopec43

In Australia we had an urgent recall of LG Lithium solar storage batteries however they were undoubtedly L ion.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/lg...f-774918740a41

There is no need for high energy density in home battery systems. Lithium Ion would be a poor choice.

[coopec43]

LG Lithium battery recall.

https://solarbatterygroup.com.au/und...-safer-choice/

[GILow]

Originally Posted by coopec43

LG Lithium battery recall.


https://solarbatterygroup.com.au/und...-safer-choice/

Given that lot refer to them as “Lithium Iron” batteries, I’d take their article as not worth printing for toilet paper.

Didn’t you notice that? Of course not.

The correct approach is to find the model numbers of the recalled batteries from a reliable source, like the manufacture or perhaps the ACCC. Then I would find the technical specifications of the ACTUAL recalled batteries from the manufacturer.

At that point you may well find they are Lithium Ion, but then you will KNOW instead of making silly sweeping statements based on, of all things, a Channel 9 new article.

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by GILow

And you’d probably be wrong. Most LG stuff is nickel based.

Maybe you should have a look at this?

[GILow]

Originally Posted by coopec43

Maybe you should have a look at this?

Congratulations. You just reached the level of fact analysis expected of a 15 year old by ACARA.

A big leap forward from your precious efforts. Gold star for improvement.

[UFO]

Apart from the fact that coopec43 has 3770 posts, reading through this thread makes me think of an AI bot