Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 15-01-2021, 19:33   #1
Registered User
 
sailingabe41ds's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Channel Islands, CA
Boat: Jeanneau 41 DS
Posts: 559
Americas Cup and simpler days

I have not followed Americas Cup for a long time. Then I looked at some of those sailboats and thought "what the heck are those things".
Does anyone else but me think we should go back to having a race without so much technology where sailors actually use there sailing skills instead of using computers and sailboats that belong in space?
IMHO....I would love to see simpler sailboats sailed by sailors who can use there sailing skills and who actually are citizens of the country where the sailboat was built.
I also do not see the average citizen as interested in Americas Cup as before...and again I think it has to do with what I mentioned above.


Best,

Abe
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	gettyimages-579951813-2048x2048.jpg
Views:	318
Size:	404.3 KB
ID:	230463  
sailingabe41ds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 19:53   #2
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: NZL - Currently Run Aground Ashore..
Boat: Sail & Power for over 35 years, experience cruising the Eastern Caribbean, Western Med, and more
Posts: 2,129
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ew-223827.html

27 pages of discussing the AC in that thread.

If you search my posts there you will find that you are actually mistaken to believe that the AC, even the very first race way back in 1851, was not all about the very latest technology.

jmh2002 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 20:05   #3
Moderator
 
Jim Cate's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 21,135
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

^^^^^^^

Abe, there are plenty of venues where the type of boats that you envision are in use, and many of those attract very top end sailors, so the competition is fierce. Classes like the Star, Etchells 22s, and the Congressional Cup come to mind.

To regress to the 12 meter class or something similar for the Americas Cup would be like running Grand Prix races in Hudson Hornets... good ole simple cars from yesterday. Nostalgic but boring to modern audiences. The AC has always been an elite event with vessels owned or sponsored by extremely rich individuals or corporations and employing professional skippers and crews and today's event is no different. It is true that the current boats are hardly recognizable as yachts, but the performance is incredible and the racing exciting for the viewers... something I never felt with the twelves!

I await the upcoming competition with interest.

Jim
__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II, lying Port Cygnet Tasmania once again.
Jim Cate is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 21:32   #4
Registered User
 
wingssail's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: On Vessel WINGS, wherever there's an ocean, currently in Mexico
Boat: Serendipity 43
Posts: 5,508
Send a message via AIM to wingssail Send a message via Skype™ to wingssail
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

I just watched the second day of the Prada Cup in these new AC75 boats.

This is as much sailors sailing as it ever was in the old days, and just as much designers designing as it was in the old days.

Remember that it was a design that took the America's Cup away from the USA in 1983, not necessarily the sailors, but it was also a leader that put that team together.

Today we see sailors that can win or lose the start which can cost them the race, same as it ever was.

We see designers, engineers, and builders that can turn a dog into a winner and that is now more a factor than ever.

And we see a leader that can pull together a team of sailors, designers, engineers and builders together and create a come back that can put that team in the lead, same as it ever was.

So I, as a racing sailor myself, think this is as much a sailing event as it ever was, and I love it.

I watched them sail today confronting the patchy wind and struggling to get going, and tomorrow I am going out on my own race course, a bit slower to be sure, but the wind is expected to be light for us too, and I am motivated to sail my boat, with my team, as well as these guys sailed theirs.

This new AC sailing is true sailing, make no mistake. We don't need the "good old days".
__________________
These lines upon my face tell you the story of who I am but these stories don't mean anything
when you've got no one to tell them to Fred Roswold Wings https://wingssail.blogspot.com/
wingssail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 21:43   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: NZL - Currently Run Aground Ashore..
Boat: Sail & Power for over 35 years, experience cruising the Eastern Caribbean, Western Med, and more
Posts: 2,129
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingssail View Post
...So I, as a racing sailor myself, think this is as much a sailing event as it ever was, and I love it.

...This new AC sailing is true sailing, make no mistake. We don't need the "good old days".


Tomorrow a front is likely to come through around race time probably bringing the opposite conditions, 15kn gusting 25kn from the NW.

Ineos must be very happy to have pulled off another win today in their 'least favoured' light air conditions.

And as you said, that was a result of true sailing, sailors skill, and sailors physical effort.

Anyone who thinks that 'computers are sailing the boats' must have missed all of the athletes onboard these very physically demanding AC75 race boats.

jmh2002 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 22:01   #6
Registered User
 
sailingabe41ds's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Channel Islands, CA
Boat: Jeanneau 41 DS
Posts: 559
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

Well...

I guess you are right. We need to change with the times. As for me, I will be throwing away my compass, charts, and those ropes that had knots to measure speed. Maybe Ill will move up to one of the electronic systems....Raymarine.
Seriously, I see your point.....and after sailing for 30 years I would never go back to sailing without all the modern equipment.
Abe
sailingabe41ds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 22:14   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Oz
Posts: 1,042
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingabe41ds View Post
I have not followed Americas Cup for a long time. Then I looked at some of those sailboats and thought "what the heck are those things".
Does anyone else but me think we should go back to having a race without so much technology where sailors actually use there sailing skills instead of using computers and sailboats that belong in space?
IMHO....I would love to see simpler sailboats sailed by sailors who can use there sailing skills and who actually are citizens of the country where the sailboat was built.
I also do not see the average citizen as interested in Americas Cup as before...and again I think it has to do with what I mentioned above.


Best,

Abe

I tend to agree with the Country of origin for these types of races. It takes away slightly when a crew are from another country than which flag is flown. I think the crowds would be a bit more engaged with some nationalistic pride. It's a bit like the Olympics, what would be the point of say the soccer team or rowing 8 having mixed nationalities..



As far as technology, that is human nature and the nature of this particular race is to try and win with both man and machine. There are plenty of one design world championships but they rarely attract any sort of crowd except maybe Olympics if sailed close to shore.
Bean Counter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 22:28   #8
Registered User
 
martinworswick's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: southern denmark
Boat: naver 29
Posts: 190
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bean Counter View Post
I tend to agree with the Country of origin for these types of races. It takes away slightly when a crew are from another country than which flag is flown. I think the crowds would be a bit more engaged with some nationalistic pride. It's a bit like the Olympics, what would be the point of say the soccer team or rowing 8 having mixed nationalities..



As far as technology, that is human nature and the nature of this particular race is to try and win with both man and machine. There are plenty of one design world championships but they rarely attract any sort of crowd except maybe Olympics if sailed close to shore.
i think there is a nationality rule,it was introduced in the last cup that 70% (or so) of the crew on board must be from the host nation
martinworswick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 23:27   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: The Pacific
Boat: 44ft mono hull
Posts: 390
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

I agreed with the op as I couldn't get excited about a race that has zero bearing on how I sail day to day amd sewd so unobtainable.

Then one day a few weeks ago I had an uncomfortably close encounter with tje Luna Rossa boat when they were put practicing. They are very very cool piece of kit and I'm now converted.
Olly75 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 23:51   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: New Zealand
Boat: 50’ Bavaria
Posts: 1,809
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

The other boats wouldn't have much of a chance without their Kiwis

But I also disagree with the OP. The America's Cup has always been about outrageous boats costing fortunes to build and run, and continues to be so. The racing, even when it's all going pear-shaped, is exciting. When the wind is stronger it's going to be even more full-on.

If you like, you can watch old America's Cup matches on YouTube. It's like watching paint dry.
Tillsbury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2021, 23:55   #11
Registered User
 
KiwiSkipper's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Wanganui, New Zealand
Boat: Lidgard 37
Posts: 14
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

Well said !
Tomorrow the wind is up .. so we will see some fast and furious sailing happen.
Cheers From NZ
KiwiSkipper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2021, 01:30   #12
Registered User
 
Island Time O25's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,027
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

Agree with OP. I just can't relate to those sailing i-boats.
Island Time O25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2021, 03:10   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 987
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

Fwiw, I couldn't relate with 12 m classic boats either, flying or not, they are completely different from a (small) cruising boat.

I find it incredibly interesting. Nostalgia has no place in America's Cup races.
250224 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2021, 03:38   #14
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Little Compton, RI
Boat: Cape George 31
Posts: 2,962
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

While I find that following racing is worse than watching grass grow, I have to grudgingly admit that there have been some advantages.
Around here, it drives a healthy portion of the economy, and brings me 80% of my work.
It drives innovation, some of which trickles down to be useful to cruisers. If rope companies weren't developing newer and better lines, we wouldn't have the variety of type or range of sizes of Dyneema rope and cover options: we'd be borrowing from the commercial fishing industry (where Dynice Dux came from). They simply don't have the demand for covered loops and soft shackles and toggled strops that the race boats have made popular. Some construction techniques and materials--at least their ready availability--are owing to racing. I built a carbon and kevlar rowing dinghy for a tender only because I had easy access to materials and vaccuum pumps and expertise and all that jazz, and that only because I live in a hub of boatbuilding and racing.
The downside is that racing philosophy trickled into cruising design to the extent that there are thousands of boats that do neither well, and good cruising designs are rarely made, hard to find, and expensive (because they're not in production like Bene/Huter/Catalina/Bavaria etc).
On the whole though, I think racing is ok, as long as other people do it. And those Cup boats are advancing the cutting edge of knowledge and practice, which is good for all of us.
__________________
Ben
zartmancruising.com
Benz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2021, 09:36   #15
MJH
Registered User
 
MJH's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Gig Harbor, WA
Boat: Tayana Vancouver 42ac
Posts: 1,196
Re: Americas Cup and simpler days

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingabe41ds View Post
I have not followed Americas Cup for a long time. Then I looked at some of those sailboats and thought "what the heck are those things".
Does anyone else but me think we should go back to having a race without so much technology where sailors actually use there sailing skills instead of using computers and sailboats that belong in space?
IMHO....I would love to see simpler sailboats sailed by sailors who can use there sailing skills and who actually are citizens of the country where the sailboat was built.
I also do not see the average citizen as interested in Americas Cup as before...and again I think it has to do with what I mentioned above.

Best, Abe
The America's Cup no longer interests me as well as other races that begin and end at the same port...the sole exception is the Vendee Globe for obvious reasons.

For me sailing is about man and machine overcoming nature to get somewhere...someplace other than the place you started...and the longer the better. This speaks to the design and reliability of both machine and man hanging together against the changing forces of nature (weather and seas), not simply being faster over a short given distance for the afternoon.

America's Cup is just another race. It has become a technology test bed competition for high rollers. Nothing wrong with that, I guess. There is room in sailing for all types.

~ ~ _/) ~ ~ MJH
MJH is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cruising - Is it a Simpler Life ? Bo English Meets & Greets 34 28-01-2021 21:08
Americas's Cup settles Mono vs Cat once and for all? Scotty Kiwi Flotsam & Sailing Miscellany 60 13-09-2017 22:24
Crew Available: Ex Olympic and Americas cup sailor and girlfriend looking to crew h.olsen Crew Archives 3 26-04-2014 14:35
Americas Cup televised? Razman23 General Sailing Forum 6 04-05-2007 03:00
Americas Cup - Valencia swagman Europe & Mediterranean 4 09-02-2007 01:13

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 00:30.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.