Killer whales off the Pacific Attacking Boats Too!

[donradcliffe]

Don't forget South Africa.

[Mike OReilly]

The best option in these wildlife conflict cases is to remove the humans. The second-tier approach is to dissuade and mitigate any interactions. But that is not always possible.

I’m no expert in orcas, nor in the watery region in question, but as I understand it, the likelihood, or even the ability, to remove humans from the area is nil. So another way must be found. Destruction of vessels, and worse, deaths of humans, will not long be tolerated. Nor should it.

Maybe there are mitigating techniques boaters and fishers can use. These should be investigated and tried. But if nothing helps, then reluctantly I agree… the whales must go.

ADD: In the case of wildlife encounters in the wild, humans need to be aware of the dangers, and they need to accept the risk. But the first thing we always do in the case of serious or fatal encounters, is to hunt the offending animal. This is true in grizzly country. My emotional response is often that I wish we’d shoot the humans, and leave the bears, but that’s not the real world we live in.

[Calif.Ted]

The whales all seem to know exactly where you are and while some like to trail along with you they all avoid contact except for Humpbacks. The humpbacks are unpredictable, they will breach at any time, you really want to give them their space.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Calif.Ted

The whales all seem to know exactly where you are and while some like to trail along with you they all avoid contact except for Humpbacks. The humpbacks are unpredictable, they will breach at any time, you really want to give them their space.

Again, I'm no expert, but why wouldn't such obviously intelligent animals be as aware of us, as we are of them?

I've spent some time in somewhat close proximity to humpbacks. They are probably the most common whale in our waters, along with minkes. I've never yet felt worried by their presence. I figure they must be able to know where I am, just as I know where they are.

... or maybe they know, but don't care?

[Calif.Ted]

... or maybe they know, but don't care?

That's the impression I get, Humpbacks and blues are here now and Grays in winter, Minke and Fins year round. Minke's are seen as the good samaritans of the area, they avoid boats but have accompanied SUP's between Catalina and mainland. Starting to get more transient Orca's coming thru following the grays or hopefully gorging on the damn sea lions.
This Gray is known locally as "Capt. Hook."

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Again, I'm no expert, but why wouldn't such obviously intelligent animals be as aware of us, as we are of them?

I've spent some time in somewhat close proximity to humpbacks. They are probably the most common whale in our waters, along with minkes. I've never yet felt worried by their presence. I figure they must be able to know where I am, just as I know where they are.

... or maybe they know, but don't care?

this has also been my experience. Because I am in the north Atlantic as well typically.

Humpback. Minke. Right whales. I see these almost every time I make a passage. A ton of right whales live right off of Boston Harbor actually. anytime you go to Maine you have to pass by them. and they never fail to be there. Every single time.

I feel like they seem to know exactly where we are just the same way dolphins and porpoises do. But we always go our separate ways and don’t get too close.

And I’ve also only felt nervous once when one of them got a bit close. But it didn’t really do anything. It just kind of got close for a minute. Then it went on its way.

i’m not sure I agree that the whales should be killed. I definitely don’t agree with that.

I think it’s kind of on us to just deal with it. Maybe we need some "whale spray" like bear spray if they start knocking into the boat.

[Ryban]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I’m no expert in orcas, nor in the watery region in question, but as I understand it, the likelihood, or even the ability, to remove humans from the area is nil. So another way must be found. Destruction of vessels, and worse, deaths of humans, will not long be tolerated. Nor should it.

Maybe there are mitigating techniques boaters and fishers can use. These should be investigated and tried. But if nothing helps, then reluctantly I agree… the whales must go.

What agency or group is responsible for protecting human life from wildlife outside of territorial waters? I have no doubt that it would get done fast and efficiently though, given how much better we are at destroying (wild)life than protecting it -- certainly existing international policy and law meant to protect wildlife outside of territorial waters has been far more difficult to enforce than the opposite.

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by Chotu

Maybe we need some "whale spray" like bear spray if they start knocking into the boat.

There have been a number of orca deterrent products suggested and trialled by skippers under attack. These include marine “pingers” (these are used on fish farms to keep predators away), motoring backwards (orcas cannot swim backwards), adding sand to the water around the boat (this irritates the animals) and even firecrackers (the underwater bang is unpleasant) to name a few. Unfortunately, the authorities have declared most if not all these non lethal solutions illegal.

Because these options are illegal, some skippers have been reluctant to report their results so it difficult to assess the effectiveness of these measures, but hopefully a reliable method of deterring these creatures will be found before someone is killed.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Ryban

What a human response. We take away habitat, we make changes to our climate, we put undo pressures on these animals due to our own behavior/greed/ and need of perpetual growth, and we treat their space as our playground and then when there are unpleasant encounters between humans and wildlife, our solution is to destroy the animal.

Originally Posted by Ryban

Yup. If you go backpacking or camping in grizzly country, swim in shark infested water, or sail where orcas are known to get a little too playful, then I think the better option is to prepare and plan, take steps to mitigate an unpleasant encounter, and accept that there are risks when we push our adventures outside the safe confines of our developed world. Instead though, we try to tame the wild to fit more nicely with our expectations.

I’m sorry, you have been misinformed. When animals behave this way, something is wrong. Often people have been feeding wildlife or maybe a fisherman didn’t let the orca take his catch etc. but this is not natural behavior.

When you walk through alligator or bear country, or sail the oceans, you normally move among countless animals and everyone does their own thing without bothering each other.

However, when one takes aggress Action towards another, you get a defense response. Every healthy animal, every healthy human will do this, we are programmed to defend ourselves. You can not demand others to offer their throats to the wolves but you can do this yourself if you want

[Ryban]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I’m sorry, you have been misinformed. When animals behave this way, something is wrong. Often people have been feeding wildlife or maybe a fisherman didn’t let the orca take his catch etc. but this is not natural behavior.

Maybe that's the case here, maybe it isn't. The fact is, you also don't have enough information to make that determination. How do you define natural behavior? These are smart animals that are adapting to their environment, increasingly encroached on by humans -- do we expect them to behave like they always have before we occupied every square mile of this planet?

By your argument, humans also do not exhibit natural behavior any longer -- should that also be corrected and dealt with?

I get it -- we are humans, we look out for fellow humans. All other species are inferior to us, and are subjects to our will. For a self-described intelligent species, we sure are narrow in our views of the world.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Ryban

Maybe that's the case here, maybe it isn't. The fact is, you also don't have enough information to make that determination. How do you define natural behavior? These are smart animals that are adapting to their environment, increasingly encroached on by humans -- do we expect them to behave like they always have before we occupied every square mile of this planet?

By your argument, humans also do not exhibit natural behavior any longer -- should that also be corrected and dealt with?

I get it -- we are humans, we look out for fellow humans. All other species are inferior to us, and are subjects to our will. For a self-described intelligent species, we sure are narrow in our views of the world.

You are okay with it when orcas kill sailors? Just let them do it because it is their natural evolution to do so? You will not allow those sailors to defend themselves? Oh my

[Adelie]

Here's an educated opinion about why they are attacking.

https://www.salon.com/2023/05/23/an-...boats_partner/

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

You are okay with it when orcas kill sailors? Just let them do it because it is their natural evolution to do so? You will not allow those sailors to defend themselves? Oh my

Sorry. Did I miss something? Do we have a bona fide report of an Orca killing a sailor? And was it an actual attack on the human? Did the Orca bite the human as a shark might? Or, as they say in the war biz, was the death collateral damage from some other event?

As I said in a previous post, I've never heard of an orca killing a human in the wild around here - which I find surprising as, when we are in the water, it would be easy to mistake us for a seal or small sea lion. And we have LOTS of occasions when orcas and humans are in close proximity.

[Ryban]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

You are okay with it when orcas kill sailors? Just let them do it because it is their natural evolution to do so? You will not allow those sailors to defend themselves? Oh my

Your straw-manning my point. If an Orca is actually attacking a vessel, and trying to sink it, I think people can and will defend themselves. That's fine.

I was arguing against the suggested solution of culling orcas because they are getting curious about boats. I think the prudent solution would be to collect more data, and in the meantime, for vessels to take precautionary actions.

I will say though that I am very grateful we have a giant transom hung rudder, and not one that is only supported by the rudder post.

[Jim Cate]

I note that many of those who don't want active measures to be taken sail in waters half a world away from the affected regions. I can but wonder if they would be so accommodating if the Orcas were circling just outside their home port

Jim