Modern Day Anchors

[Olesargesas]

Hi I'm a newby on this forum. But I would like to share my anchor research, investigations and usage with others. I have been boating now for over 30 years.

Up until last year, being a one main anchor person (plus spare) I need a versatile anchor as such I have been a dedicated CQR person. Then after noting all the new modern day high holding anchors on boats around the bays where we become long term stayers in all weather I got curious and started to do some research.

Throwing away my old myth of what has worked in the past is the best for the future, taking into consideration I have only recently upgraded to a smartphone.

Anyway having extensive metals and structural fabrication and design experience I started my research with the following outcomes.

· Stainless Steel or Black Steel ? No brainer stainless regardless of grade is un-repairable as too much memory and if bent it will not ever maintain its straightened shape. Throw it.

· Concave or Convex ? For me again a no brainer, mainly because my anchorage is regularly heavy mud (crabbing). It is my view (and experience watching other boaties with concave anchors spend half an hour trying to wash the mud off, sometimes having to dig it off) that convex retains less mud on recovery than does concave. Further you fill a concave anchor with heavy mud it is no longer a concave anchor but a mud plug. You do a 180 when the tide changes the anchor pulls and will not reset properly. Also requiring something that works well in coral, foul (fishing) and firm sand. So for me Convex, even though in soft silty sand it may not be as good, but I do not frequent these areas.

· Strength ? After researching my Modern Convex Anchors of interest, it is again a no brainer. How can you beat a Bissalloy 80 Shank (it’s probably one of the strongest and abrasion resistant metals in the world) especially when you believe the section is more than fit for purpose ? You cannot. Combine this with excellent structural design and welding connection between shank and fluke. Then for me the decision was no decision.

· Published Tests and Certifications ? Having found one anchor that satisfied all of the above, how do they perform ? Reviewing tests funny enough the only anchor that satisfied all my above pre-requisites had an excellent performance rating for holding power.

As such my decision was made, I would buy a Sarca Excel in Galv. But what size. Having run a 100lb CQR previously, knowing full well my 65lb stern anchor would satisfactorily hold the boat in 35knot gusts, I went for a #8 40Kg Excel.

Don’t forget when sizing your anchor don’t use boat manufacturers boat weight. I use boat weight plus full load of fuel and water, plus 4 tonnes for misc. fittings, food, grog, 1st mates make-up, fishing gear and my junk.

First time trial on 10mm stainless chain, no swivel, just shackled. Unbelievable, unbelievable. The set, so much faster than the CQR, retrieval again once broken (not with winch) came up relatively clean in mud that washed of by the time the winch got the anchor home. The hold, lets you sleep a lot more comfortable after the first 10 nights or so in different conditions testing.

What more can I say, I am now new generation phone and anchor and very glad my 1st Mate talked me into both.

Thanks for taking the time to read my first post.

Olesargesas

[sctpc]

Originally Posted by Olesargesas

Don’t forget when sizing your anchor don’t use boat manufacturers boat weight. I use boat weight plus full load of fuel and water, plus 4 tonnes for misc. fittings, food, grog, 1st mates make-up, fishing gear and my junk.


Olesargesas

I would say to that sizing is going to fit in your locker and not too big for your winch dont ask how I know my size 6 when a 4 would be very useable and 5 not bad but the 6 sits in my garage used once.

[Olesargesas]

SCTPC The winch is very important I agree but not an issue for a 3500 Maxwell. Difference is most of our cruising is cyclone area long term as opposed to day recreational.

But excellent comment for overnighters, or those that run for the marina at anything over 20 knots coming in.

It's all personal choice, but for me I sleep better bigger.

[bobconnie]

Gosh, gone are the days of the CQR, Danforth, Fisherman, anchors! How did we ever get any sleep at anchor before the New Modern anchors were invented?? Gosh I guess Im gonna have to spend a bunch of boat dollars for a new style anchor to replace the 100 lb Danforth on my new to me ketch !! I guess I will have to sell a bunch of stuff, or take out a loan in order to get any sleep !! darn the world changes so fast !! I just can't keep up! must be from all the sleep Ive lost out on in the last 40 yrs !!!Ya think ??

[Olesargesas]

Bob and Connie

I know the feeling, I had few sleepless night on my CQR, but it was run out in the shank pin and needed to be replaced.

As I said its all personal choice based on personal needs, for my needs I'm extatic with my choice.

If my CQR was not run out, I would still be using it most probably.

Kindest

Olesargesas

[S/V Alchemy]

Originally Posted by bobconnie

Gosh, gone are the days of the CQR, Danforth, Fisherman, anchors! How did we ever get any sleep at anchor before the New Modern anchors were invented?? Gosh I guess Im gonna have to spend a bunch of boat dollars for a new style anchor to replace the 100 lb Danforth on my new to me ketch !! I guess I will have to sell a bunch of stuff, or take out a loan in order to get any sleep !! darn the world changes so fast !! I just can't keep up! must be from all the sleep Ive lost out on in the last 40 yrs !!!Ya think ??

Well, technically, you're supposed to keep an anchor watch...

I've mentioned before that here in freshwater, not only are people still using Granddad's boat, they are using his Bruce or CQR. There's still a place for those anchors, and you can hit a combination of seamanship (sufficient scope and weather knowledge to anchor properly), a boat with low windage, and dumb luck to have never had a mishap with an older anchor design. I do think, however, that some of the newer designs have merit and that if you can afford the cost in dollars and weight, it's good to carry a variety if you intend to really go beyond the well-known spots.

A challenge for me is the conceit that the new anchors will work as well as the old with less scope. This to me is the same arguments found with cars: seatbelts and airbags don't save lives so much as allow speeders to avoid otherwise Darwinian fates. A new anchor isn't going to save you from a poor technique, and as far as I am concerned, that means plenty of scope. An anchor isn't a miracle play, just a rather elaborate hook. Scope, particularly chain or the first 10 metres in chain, along with bridles and snubbers, is part of the equation that adds up with even the most fantastical of the "new anchors".

After all, boats were anchored for centuries with a rope parcelling a rock! Scope must have done most of the job.

[JonJo]

I went through my Cruiser Forum archives and found this one posted in 1954:

quote: Gosh, gone are the days of the Fisherman anchors! How did we ever get any sleep at anchor before the New Modern anchors, CQR, Danforth were invented?? Gosh I guess Im gonna have to spend a bunch of boat dollars for a new style anchor to replace the 200lb Fisherman's on my new to me ketch !! I guess I will have to sell a bunch of stuff, or take out a loan in order to get any sleep !! darn the world changes so fast !! I just can't keep up! must be from all the sleep Ive lost out on in the last 40 yrs !!!Ya think ??

Unquote

[boatman61]

Here we go again Bruce me old mate....

[JonJo]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Here we go again Bruce me old mate....

Boatman - you are quite at liberty not to read anything that does not appeal to you. And Bruce is either sexist or showing an unhealthy support for a Manxman's design and thus jingostic - please be careful, the thread might be pulled.

[Olesargesas]

Must admit, if I was not an avid creek crabber and was a clean keel sailboat or weekender anchoring in soft sand or silt, then I would have probably chosen the Super Sarca, purely because of the metals stregnth, and manufacturing quality and its tested holding power in these environments. It also has the famous halo ring, and comes in stainless for the Riv's and Maritomo's.

Kindest

Olesargesas

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by JonJo

Boatman - you are quite at liberty not to read anything that does not appeal to you. And Bruce is either sexist or showing an unhealthy support for a Manxman's design and thus jingostic - please be careful, the thread might be pulled.

LOL... no worries mate... learnt how to dance a little since I 1st joined..

[Cotemar]

Originally Posted by Olesargesas

Must admit, if I was not an avid creek crabber and was a clean keel sailboat or weekender anchoring in soft sand or silt, then I would have probably chosen the Super Sarca, purely because of the metals stregnth, and manufacturing quality and its tested holding power in these environments. It also has the famous halo ring, and comes in stainless for the Riv's and Maritomo's.

Kindest

Olesargesas

Olesargesas,

Welcome aboard the CF.

Interesting first post.

We had a member here refered to as Olesage, Olesarge in the Sarca Excel thread, but he was not very nice. Here’s hoping you’re the nice one

Lots of Australia cruisers like those Sarca Excel anchors

[Jimbo485]

This is going to be lots of fun. Good on you, OleSargeSAS!

Cotemar is treading lightly....

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by Olesargesas

· Stainless Steel or Black Steel ? No brainer stainless regardless of grade is un-repairable as too much memory and if bent it will not ever maintain its straightened shape. Throw it.

The big problem with SS anchors is that they are very expensive. Far more expensive than the material costs indicate they should be, at least in the eyes of consumers.
Another concern is crevice corrosion (and other corrosion mechanisms) this is particularly of concern to long term cruisers because our anchors spend their lives buried in sand or mud.

Bending anchors only happens very rarely and many of the reputable manufactures will replace a bent anchor anyway.

A third option is aluminium. Apart from the Fortress, Gardian and Spade there has been little choice in aluminium. The aluminium Spade does not seem to work very well (In contrast to their great steel anchor). The Fortress is a fantastic anchor, every boat should have one for its unique properties, but it is prone to to failing when the direction of pull changes.

As I understand we are about to see an aluminium Excel, let's hope they can succeed in transferring the design to the lighter material more successfully than the Spade. There is a big gap in the market here.

Originally Posted by Olesargesas

· Concave or Convex ? For me again a no brainer, mainly because my anchorage is regularly heavy mud (crabbing). It is my view (and experience watching other boaties with concave anchors spend half an hour trying to wash the mud off, sometimes having to dig it off) that convex retains less mud on recovery than does concave. Further you fill a concave anchor with heavy mud it is no longer a concave anchor but a mud plug. You do a 180 when the tide changes the anchor pulls and will not reset properly. Also requiring something that works well in coral, foul (fishing) and firm sand. So for me Convex, even though in soft silty sand it may not be as good, but I do not frequent these areas.

If history is a teacher the big advantage of a concave blade is their higher holding capacity. Many yachtsmen, like myself, will sacrifice a small amount of cleaning for added peace of mind at night.
Normally dangling the anchor in water, for a short time, will clean the anchor easily. Occasionally with thick mud a push with a boat hook is needed. It is really not a big deal and its never going to take anything like 1/2 hr unless you want to give it a polish and wax as well.

However, many power boats retrieve their anchor with no one at the bow and I can understand how a self cleaning anchor may be important factor.
Concave anchors are not self cleaning.

The concave anchors such as the Rocna, MS and Spade have a reputation for being the most reliable anchors with changes of wind /tide and I have to disagree with the suggestion that they are suspect in this regard. I would argue the opposite.

I have seen a lot of anchors, spoken to a lot of cruising sailors and read a lot of anchor threads. IMHO the top rated anchor designs are Rocna, MS and Spade ( in no particular order). These are all concave designs.

I am sure we will see better designs in the future, but personally I would be surprised if we see a return to convex anchors as the preferred option..

Welcome to the forum Olesargesas.
As you can see anchor threads do become controversial. Having read your CV I am sure you are used to some spirited boardroom debate. So please accept my thoughts are only my personal opinions.

Oh and next time I in Australia can I get an invite on your fantastic looking boat

[thinwater]

Yup, concave anchors bring up mud (also Chesapeake) whilst my Delta came up clean. However, hosing off an anchor always struck me as OCD. A few moments (8 second for 3-4 strokes) with a plastic scraper with an 18-inch handle takes off 95% of the mud; all that matters. Rain and spray will get the rest.

I really liked the Delta--stowage and great veering behavior--but I think the concave ancors are positive step in evolution--better in soft mud amoung other things-- and I'm sure there will be more. However, the reason I changed was more size than performance (up 10 pounds). I would have kept a proper size Delta.