Modern Day Anchors

[JonJo]

Originally Posted by flash

Just curious if anyone has experience with the new Manson Boss? Been trying to decide between that and the more expensive Spade. Supreme wont fit my roller and I don't want to modify. Thanks.

Chuck Hawley posted some months ago (I think CF but do not recall which thread) that he had a Stainless Steel version on his yacht and he would post his experiences. Chuck has an obvious interest in the success of the Boss as he works at West Marine and they sell Manson product. Nothing has been posted since, draw any conclusions you like, maybe Chuck is real busy (or its been winter ever since and he has not been out on the water).

I have seen no detailed independent comment.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by JonJo

Noelex,

We have tested a steel and alloy version of the Spade 80, so 16kg and 8kg. Frankly cannot tell the difference, except for the weight. They both set in the same distance, they both turn, or shuffle. They both sommersault identically and if you do a winch pull test they develop the same awesome holding capacity. They both dive and if loaded sufficiently disappear. And they fit our bow roller! We have been sufficiently confident to use the alloy Spade on a cruise to and from the Gold Coast, stopping and anchoring, Sandy Bay, Broughton, Laurieton, Trial Bay, Coffs (anchored in the harbour) Byron Bay and then a variety of places on the Gold Coast and then repeated on the way back. They do not carry mud. Never a problem - and it is inevitable that you enjoy 35 knot gusts (I admit not that high) in an anchorage on a cruise of that duration and some of the anchorages are pretty exposed to swell. Interestingly the alloy Spade will be stronger than the stainless version.

Spade are not an economic option here, in Oz.

We carry an FX23. We have never found a problem with it shuffling round but have never tried a 180 degree pull - its on the list. I'd rather carry a Fortress than a concave.

After hurricane Ivan in Grenada, the alloy Spades were tossed everywhere. Their shanks are hollow and welded and they just bend and tear apart. The steel versions also bent the shanks but did not tear apart and held the boat. Steel won convincingly.

[barnakiel]

I like moder anchors but I do not like their price tag.

How come a Lewmar Claw costs me X units and an equivalent modern day slab of metal costs me 3 to 6 times this figure?

Rants aside, I think moder anchors are good stuff and I am buying one.

b.

[Dsanduril]

Up until last year, being a one main anchor person (plus spare) I need a versatile anchor as such I have been a dedicated CQR person. Then after noting all the new modern day high holding anchors on boats around the bays where we become long term stayers in all weather I got curious and started to do some research.

So, after all that research you ended up with Sarca Excel = CQR - shank swivel := pretty much the same old anchor

[Cotemar]

Originally Posted by Bash

The secret of using a Fortress in vegetation is to let it sit for a while--like 30 minutes--before setting it. This allows the flukes to settle through the vegetation slowly. If you set too quickly, you'll end up with a weed ball every time.

Yes, weed ball is exactly what I got.
Nice tip to wait 30 minutes before the set. Will just have to remember next time I use it, which in not often.

Maybe I will put a post it on it "
"Let it sit for a while--like 30 minutes--before setting it"

[downunder]

Originally Posted by Dsanduril

So, after all that research you ended up with Sarca Excel = CQR - shank swivel := pretty much the same old anchor

Yeah. You must have seen and used one I assume.

[Olesargesas]

Dsanduril

No comparison between them when you use them. Definately chalk and cheese.

Mind you some people love chalk, again its just personal choice nobody is wrong.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

How come a Lewmar Claw costs me X units and an equivalent modern day slab of metal costs me 3 to 6 times this figure?

I just looked it up and for a Manson Surpreme it looks like 3 times as much (60#). But the only thing I considered as far as saving money when I got mine was to not get SS. I'm expecting that fancy piece of metal to protect my boat that is worth 192 times the anchor cost, so it seems pretty low cost to me!

[Cotemar]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

I like moder anchors but I do not like their price tag.

How come a Lewmar Claw costs me X units and an equivalent modern day slab of metal costs me 3 to 6 times this figure?

Rants aside, I think moder anchors are good stuff and I am buying one.

b.

They are giving away Lewmar Claw (Bruce) anchors now. Just $134 usd

Lewmar Horizon Claw Anchor

If you just need a lunch hook or day anchor that is the way to go.

Not sure how they can make and ship an anchor that cheap.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Cotemar

They are giving away Lewmar Claw (Bruce) anchors now. Just $134 usd

Lewmar Horizon Claw Anchor

If you just need a lunch hook or day anchor that is the way to go.

Not sure how they can make and ship an anchor that cheap.

That is not a Bruce but a cheap knock-off with very differently shaped claws. Even an engine block holds better and certainly doesn't bend shanks as easy.

True Bruce anchors can only be bought 2nd hand now and need to be heavier than the new tech anchors that have improved holding in order to match performance. That said, I would not want to miss my 80kg Bruce!

[JonJo]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

After hurricane Ivan in Grenada, the alloy Spades were tossed everywhere. Their shanks are hollow and welded and they just bend and tear apart. The steel versions also bent the shanks but did not tear apart and held the boat. Steel won convincingly.

Anyone who thinks alloy, or stainless, can ever compete with high tensile steel needs their head examined. Alloy has its place and as long as you are conscious of its limitations there should not be an issue. However to expect a shank (in this case Spade whose dimensions (thickness of metal) are identical whether it be stainless, alloy or steel to all have the same strength is unrealistic. Fortress beef up their shanks, they try to engineer some extra strength. You will note that Spade suggest that if an alloy anchor is to be used as the primary anchor it should be the next size up.

One reason Spade shanks might bend, or tear apart, is that the anchor has a very efficient fluke and pull an immovable object with something not strong enough - and something has to give.

For those advocating some brands of anchor - can anyone tell me what the shank is made from - my view is that in many cases no-one knows and given the number of advocates for the products this actually suggests - no-one cares.

The difference with Spade, or Fortress - one knows exactly what the tensile strength of the alloy is, between 250 and 275 MPa (vs 750 MPa for Bis 80 - and I'm sure I do not need to repeat, but will anyway, that the Boss, Supreme and Excel all use the 750 MPa steel in the shank).

[Kettlewell]

Somebody anchored right next to me in Marathon pulled up his Claw after a frontal passage that might have had a gust or two over 30 knots, and the shank was bent right over. There are a ton of Bruce-look knock offs out there that are worse.

[Cotemar]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

That is not a Bruce but a cheap knock-off with very differently shaped claws. Even an engine block holds better and certainly doesn't bend shanks as easy.

True Bruce anchors can only be bought 2nd hand now and need to be heavier than the new tech anchors that have improved holding in order to match performance. That said, I would not want to miss my 80kg Bruce!

Maybe that is way they are so cheap. You know there is a problem when they tell you twice that its made from high grade steel (China)

Manufactured from high grade steel
The design of these anchors is based on anchors that are used to secure oil rigs in the North Sea
The Claw anchor is constructed of high-grade steel cast in a single piece
The Claw anchor sets effortlessly and holds in a variety of sea beds
Stows easily on the bow roller of most boats
Manufactured from high grade steel

[s/v Jedi]

I mention the hollow shanks that tear apart because I got the idea that some are contemplating to use alloy Spade anchors for a primary anchor, which is a bad idea imo.

I have alloy Fortress anchors, including "the Beast" (FX125) and like them for what they are: complemetary to a big heavy, steel primary anchor that can be used on it's own in 99% of all anchoring conditions.

ciao!
Nick.

[JonJo]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I mention the hollow shanks that tear apart because I got the idea that some are contemplating to use alloy Spade anchors for a primary anchor, which is a bad idea imo.

I have alloy Fortress anchors, including "the Beast" (FX125) and like them for what they are: complemetary to a big heavy, steel primary anchor that can be used on it's own in 99% of all anchoring conditions.

ciao!
Nick.

Alloy as a primary is fine in that most people, most of the time, do not 'suffer' under winds more than, say 25 knots, and as long as you have some back up in case the conditions are much worse than forecast. I have met lots of 'cruisers' who carry a 'normal' sized anchor on their bow roller and a 'storm' (which is bigger) anchor (often under an amidships berth). I have also met a lot who carry a Fortress as a storm anchor. As long as you are cognisant of the limitations of whatever gear you have (and have that sensible fall back) then it should not be an issue.

I too have seen a torn apart alloy Spade, seams ripped open - quite an eye opener. But then I have seen other bent anchors as well (that were, mild?, steel).