E FOY Fuel Cell Generator

[Na Mara]

Hi Jammer

1. I agree that if I was needing lots of off grid electricity year in year out that a generator (or more likely a proper rear arch with masses of solar and wind on it) would be the way to go. But I am looking for a single year of hard use and then maybe 2-5 uses per year after that. After the trip it would be a woefully under-utilised asset. A separate generator is overkill for my needs and will cost between twice and three times what a cell costs to fit. Plus one of the failure modes for such systems is contaminated diesel and if that happens I would loose both power generation modes (unless I have completely separate fuel tanks that I never fill at the same time).

2. Your, and dockheads, suggestion of a cheap gasoline suitcase generator as a backup to a big alternator on the engine is interesting. In that case I would do the big second alternator onto a big bank of LFP batteries and would rely on that and shore charging to meet our daily needs. As I posted earlier, it should manage that given our low consumption. The petrol gen would just be in case of main engine failure. Basically, it is an equivalent system to the fuel cell, second alternator system only I size the bank so that the "back up" for the alternator is never needed in normal operation. My suspicion, however, is that the cost of a larger bank and petrol generator will be up there toward the cost of a fuel cell, in which case the always there ready to go nature of the cell will probably lead me in that direction.

3. I am also aware of the minimal servicing that the EFOY requires, it is almost nothing compared to a diesel engine. They are also much more reliable than such engines.

4. I am well aware of the restricted life expectancy of the cell and the kW price of the electrons. It is an expensive way to keep the batteries charged for the year we are away, but once we return it is perfect as a way of generating silent electricity on the odd occasion we are away from a plug for longer than 3-4 days.

5. Finally, my boat has beautiful, almost flush, teak decks everywhere except ontop of the pilothouse directly under the boom. This is where I store the dinghy (its perfect for that as it isn't used for anything else and anywhere else on deck obscures the view form the interior helm). Even if I put davits on the boat there is a lot of shading here. As I talked about earlier, the only placement that makes sense on a price and expected future use basis, is on the guardrails. I could easily, and cheaply get 200W that way, but I don't love the look, the need to actively fold them up and down, the vulnerability to damage and so on. I am not dismissing it out of hand and will consider it carefully, but I doubt it could meet our needs under sail anyway. But it might make sense to do this as the backup to a big second alternator instead of the petrol genset.

Hi Dockhead,

1. Converting between AC and DC is trivial but involves loses that I deem unnecessary. I also think it is generally safer to stick with 12V.

2. I have done the numbers. At anchor we use: anchor light, interior lighting, mobile phones, occasionally laptops, refrigeration, water pump, and forced air heating (very rarely), and very occasionally a 12v TV. That comes to less than 50Ah a day on average. Underway we use: masthead tricolour, interior lighting, mobile phones, water pump, occasionally laptops, 2x Axiom9 chart plotters, AIS, VHF, GPS, ships instruments, an ewincher winch handle, hydraulic autopilot, and occasionally radar. I put that at about 150Ah per day. We can conserve power further if need be by using a manual water pump, foregoing laptops and mobiles, hand steering part of the time, etc. I would go for the new EFOY 150 fuel cell which puts out 150Ah a day. We don't have washing machines, microwaves, fans (those I might add), electric kettles, AC, water makers (we carry 500l and the decks are perfectly formed for catching rainwater), water heaters, etc. If I was going to do a water maker it would be a belt driven one off the engine. Even if it is really bad weather and we are short 50Ah or so due to the auto working extra hard, we can recover the difference by doing more hand steering, by heaving to for a rest, or running the engine. That's how I'm thinking.

4. As to how much methanol we need to carry I worked that out to be about 160l for the whole Atlantic circuit, and then 10l per year after that. On a 43ft boat storing that much methanol is not too much of a problem and it is one that diminishes as we go. I could easily half that 160l if I had a big second alternator.

5. Again, I see little advantage for redundancy between a fuel cell and a gasoline suitcase generator. In the first case I would size the bank so that the fuel cell would occasionally kick in under normal use (say 300Ah), in the other the aim would be to never have to deploy the petrol generator in normal use due to the noise and faff of the thing and instead we would rely on the main engine, which would mean a bigger bank (say 500-600Ah). The difference in bank size partially offsets the cost of the cell and the cell works with minimal input in all weathers, so I don't see the big win for the petrol generator.

6. I'm looking for a way to go 2-3 days between the engine firing up underway, and 5-6 days when stationary. The goal is to as much as possible have parasitic charging whilst the engine is run for propulsion.

7. The bigger the second alternator the better as the more amps I can get into the batteries while merely entering and leaving harbour and the shorter the time I need to run the engine the better. I will look into the alternators you mention.

8. My engine is a Yanmar 4JH2-DTBE 85hk (on the engine its states 92Hk) and the boat weighs 11 metric ton lightship. Really she is probably overpowered by about 25hk so loading the engine more would be no bad thing. The engine bay spans the entire bilge but there's not a lot of room to mount an alternator infront of the engine. It would need to be mounted to the right of the engine parallel to the existing 55A alternator but on the other side (maybe they can balance out each other?). I can't see any brackets there though so I would probably have to get something custom made that bolts to the engine mounts on that side.

If I can fix a big second alternator I will. I see no real downside to it given how overpowered we are. I think as to redundancy it stands between 200W of solar on the guard rails or a fuel cell. The former is cheaper, the latter is easier to live with.

Finally Pete7,

I looked into that hybrid system and it is a beaut but unfortunately it is not a bolt on system but rather a whole engine replacement. Were I repowering the boat I would definitely do this, but I am not chucking a perfectly good, reliable diesel with very little runtime on it for its age to put in a hybrid system for this trip. Not when a second alternator and some form of backup generation is going to be less than half the capital cost. Also, I doubt that such a system is the end state for sailboat marine propulsion. That is almost certainly electric engines powered by large battery banks augmented by fuel cells or copious amounts of solar power. I think I´ll wait for that tech before repowering.

Anyway, many thanks for helping clarify my thoughts and particularly the suggestion of a second high-power alternator. I really hope my mechanic can come up with a way of fitting one.

Best regards
Na Mara

[Na Mara]

Re those monster truck alternators. Bloody hell those things are beasts! 325A! Will they even run off a 90hp diesel?

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Na Mara

Re those monster truck alternators. Bloody hell those things are beasts! 325A! Will they even run off a 90hp diesel?

The first difficulty is finding room for them. The second is the effects of the belt drive on front main bearing life for the diesel.


On finding room, one of the trouble spots IMO is attachment points for the bracket; you can have anything welded up but you're placing significant loads on whatever bolts you use to land the bracket on the block or head. With the bracket and wiring you're looking at 50 pounds of extra metal that is supposed to move with the engine when you (for example) shift into gear. I see this as putting the installation well into "science project" territory on smaller engines.


As Dockhead noted upthread, the sideload posed by the belt could affect bearing life or, conceivably, lead to a crankshaft failure. Again we're in science project territory.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Na Mara

Hi Dockhead,

1. Converting between AC and DC is trivial but involves loses that I deem unnecessary. I also think it is generally safer to stick with 12V.

2. I have done the numbers. At anchor we use: anchor light, interior lighting, mobile phones, occasionally laptops, refrigeration, water pump, and forced air heating (very rarely), and very occasionally a 12v TV. That comes to less than 50Ah a day on average. Underway we use: masthead tricolour, interior lighting, mobile phones, water pump, occasionally laptops, 2x Axiom9 chart plotters, AIS, VHF, GPS, ships instruments, an ewincher winch handle, hydraulic autopilot, and occasionally radar. I put that at about 150Ah per day. We can conserve power further if need be by using a manual water pump, foregoing laptops and mobiles, hand steering part of the time, etc. I would go for the new EFOY 150 fuel cell which puts out 150Ah a day. We don't have washing machines, microwaves, fans (those I might add), electric kettles, AC, water makers (we carry 500l and the decks are perfectly formed for catching rainwater), water heaters, etc. If I was going to do a water maker it would be a belt driven one off the engine. Even if it is really bad weather and we are short 50Ah or so due to the auto working extra hard, we can recover the difference by doing more hand steering, by heaving to for a rest, or running the engine. That's how I'm thinking.

4. As to how much methanol we need to carry I worked that out to be about 160l for the whole Atlantic circuit, and then 10l per year after that. On a 43ft boat storing that much methanol is not too much of a problem and it is one that diminishes as we go. I could easily half that 160l if I had a big second alternator.

5. Again, I see little advantage for redundancy between a fuel cell and a gasoline suitcase generator. In the first case I would size the bank so that the fuel cell would occasionally kick in under normal use (say 300Ah), in the other the aim would be to never have to deploy the petrol generator in normal use due to the noise and faff of the thing and instead we would rely on the main engine, which would mean a bigger bank (say 500-600Ah). The difference in bank size partially offsets the cost of the cell and the cell works with minimal input in all weathers, so I don't see the big win for the petrol generator.

6. I'm looking for a way to go 2-3 days between the engine firing up underway, and 5-6 days when stationary. The goal is to as much as possible have parasitic charging whilst the engine is run for propulsion.

7. The bigger the second alternator the better as the more amps I can get into the batteries while merely entering and leaving harbour and the shorter the time I need to run the engine the better. I will look into the alternators you mention.

8. My engine is a Yanmar 4JH2-DTBE 85hk (on the engine its states 92Hk) and the boat weighs 11 metric ton lightship. Really she is probably overpowered by about 25hk so loading the engine more would be no bad thing. The engine bay spans the entire bilge but there's not a lot of room to mount an alternator infront of the engine. It would need to be mounted to the right of the engine parallel to the existing 55A alternator but on the other side (maybe they can balance out each other?). I can't see any brackets there though so I would probably have to get something custom made that bolts to the engine mounts on that side.

If I can fix a big second alternator I will. I see no real downside to it given how overpowered we are. I think as to redundancy it stands between 200W of solar on the guard rails or a fuel cell. The former is cheaper, the latter is easier to live with.

. . .

It's useful to have your numbers. That is a very small power budget indeed. I think you would be fine with school bus alternator, and your Yanmar can handle it. There is even a factory optional bracket (which I have on my Yanmar, as my boat was built from new with the second alternator) and pulley set which makes installation easy.



I don't know why you think you need to increase the bank size. It's nice to be able to go for days without charging, but is that luxury worth the cost of a bank which doesn't even add luxury when you're on the hook? And lithium ages out, so once you are finished with your Atlantic circuit all that money will just be rotting away. I'd do 300 or max 400 amp/hours and call it good. That will give you days between charges on the hook, and more than a day underway. And did you realize that, unlike with lead, with lithium a larger bank won't allow you to charge faster? So a bigger bank would not reduce the amount of time you run the engine, just would lump it together. So instead of two hours every day, you'd be running four hours every two days -- is that luxury?


Since your heavier power draw is underway, you could also add some towed generator like the WattNSea. https://www.wattandsea.com/en Sell it when you get back from your big trip. That might actually do your power underway all by itself.



I know you're not considering an AC generator, so this is not really relevant to your specific task, but for the record, the conversion losses to DC really are immaterial and in many cases will be recouped by more efficient AC generation. Certainly you will never notice a difference in fuel burned. The main cool thing about a DC generator is that it does not require a specific RPM so can be variable speed, which uses the diesel engine more efficiently so can more than make up for the slightly less efficient generation, but again, the differences are so small that you will never notice any difference in cost, which in any case will be 20x or 50x less than the cost of producing the same amount of power with a fuel cell.



As to safety -- I personally much prefer dealing with low amperage 230v circuits with far less fire risk, than high amperage 24v or even worse 12v circuits. High voltage circuits are far easier to make safe. An AC powered battery charger mounted close to the lithium bank, with only short DC cables, I think is a superior setup to having to pull long fat DC cables through the boat.



But my boat is different from yours, with a lot of AC-powered gear and a power budget several times yours. I have a heavy duty 1500 RPM 6.5kW Kohler generator in a sound enclosure which in turn is inside a soundproof engine room, so it is completely inaudible from the cockpit (risk of forgetting you are running it in fact) and barely audible, like a dishwasher, below decks. So I just run that for a few hours a day and don't worry about it. I have 450AH (x 24v) of Trojan golf cart batteries.

[Na Mara]

Hi Jammer.

Space is not an issue. I have the luxury of a very large engine bay that stretches the width of the boat under the pilot house. Directly to starboard of the engine is a space that is nearly 2 ft high, 2.5ft wide and 5 ft long. It would easily accommodate a generator and a water maker, never mind an alternator. There is not so much space infront of the engine and the hot water tank is in the way to port. but aft and to starboard there is loads of sound insulated space. The battery bank is immediately forward of the engine bay. Any cable from an alternator to the batteries would be less than 2 ft long. System centralisation over the keel is one of the best reasons to have a pilothouse, or center cockpit, boat.

If nothing else I have the engine mounting points on that side on which could be attached a structure to hold the alternator and that should move with the engine, but according to Dockhead Yanmar sell brackets for second alternators so maybe this is a mute concern as is extra ware on the camshaft?

Hi Dockhead,

I would be very interested about that extra bracket from Yanmar and whether its a simple bolt on affair or whether it needs welding on. If you have any pictures of it that would be great.

I looked into the hydropower units and they are an option but many have had problems with them in the Caribbean due to weed which is where we are headed, and for most of the sailing we will be doing (day hops with occasional overnights) they are not so useful as the hassle of deploying and recovering them is too great and most people just leave them up for those kind of trips. The good ones are also not much less than a fuel cell (though they can generate more) and that cell will also produce power while we are stationary which a hydro unit won't. Again though, as a backup when you need it or even as the main power supply underway, they are good bits of kit. I can see their merits but not for me and my intended future use.

I take your point about bank size. If I am backing up the second alternator with a fuel cell or something else that actually contributes to charging in normal circumstances then I would go smaller in any case. 300-400Ah sounds about right.

My one concern about all this second alternator stuff is the extra ware on the engine, but if Yanmar supports this then it can't be that much of an issue.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Na Mara

Hi Jammer.

Space is not an issue. I have the luxury of a very large engine bay that stretches the width of the boat under the pilot house. Directly to starboard of the engine is a space that is nearly 2 ft high, 2.5ft wide and 5 ft long. It would easily accommodate a generator and a water maker, never mind an alternator. There is not so much space infront of the engine and the hot water tank is in the way to port. but aft and to starboard there is loads of sound insulated space. The battery bank is immediately forward of the engine bay. Any cable from an alternator to the batteries would be less than 2 ft long. System centralisation over the keel is one of the best reasons to have a pilothouse, or center cockpit, boat.

If nothing else I have the engine mounting points on that side on which could be attached a structure to hold the alternator and that should move with the engine, but according to Dockhead Yanmar sell brackets for second alternators so maybe this is a mute concern as is extra ware on the camshaft?

Hi Dockhead,

I would be very interested about that extra bracket from Yanmar and whether its a simple bolt on affair or whether it needs welding on. If you have any pictures of it that would be great.

I looked into the hydropower units and they are an option but many have had problems with them in the Caribbean due to weed which is where we are headed, and for most of the sailing we will be doing (day hops with occasional overnights) they are not so useful as the hassle of deploying and recovering them is too great and most people just leave them up for those kind of trips. The good ones are also not much less than a fuel cell (though they can generate more) and that cell will also produce power while we are stationary which a hydro unit won't. Again though, as a backup when you need it or even as the main power supply underway, they are good bits of kit. I can see their merits but not for me and my intended future use.

I take your point about bank size. If I am backing up the second alternator with a fuel cell or something else that actually contributes to charging in normal circumstances then I would go smaller in any case. 300-400Ah sounds about right.

My one concern about all this second alternator stuff is the extra ware on the engine, but if Yanmar supports this then it can't be that much of an issue.

I'm separated from my boat at the moment (Danish borders closed) so can't photograph it, but I think my bracket is bolted on. Certainly the engine was designed to have a second alternator, and it was supplied by Yanmar with the second alternator already installed by Yanmar. My engine is a 4JH3HTE but yours is the same block, just one generation older, so perhaps even the same bracket would fit. Just talk to Yanmar.


I probably wouldn't worry too much about crankshaft wear -- just be careful with belt tension and don't overdo it (don't UNDERdo it either -- N.B.!). A 200 amp (x12v) school bus alternator is within spec for the Yanmar, maybe even 300 amps. If you have the choice of a serpentine belt, then definitely go that way -- solves the side loading issue and is much easier to keep in tension.


If I were you and had all that engine room space AND needed a watermaker, I would sure look hard at this: https://aquamarineinc.net/aquagen.php. This is a beautiful, simple, inexpensive solution to all your problems. You even get your power in 12v like you like it. That plus the second alt on the main engine and you are fully redundant even down to the power source, and would not need to carry a suitcase gen backup. Every time you make water you are automatically filling up the batts. And with lithium batts and their high acceptance rate, you could run BOTH this AND your main engine and charge twice as fast.

P.S. Here's an aftermarket supplier of second alternator mounting kits: https://marinesmartenergy.com/items/...g-Bracket-Kit/


And one from Mark Grasser: https://markgrasser.com/?product=yan...ual-alternator

[Na Mara]

Hi Dockhead.

Our boats are neighbours then as my home berth is Dockan Marina in Malmö.

Yeap one of those kubota systems would indeed fit with space to spare and the lack of sound insulation on the unit wouldn't be a problem as the whole bay is well insulated. I could live with plentiful fresh water and I could even have my belt driven bilge pump driven off of this and leave my engine alone. But there are a few issues.

1. Diesel contamination would still be a risk to both generation modes.

2. How would I even source this in Sweden?

3. Presumably I couldn't share the water inlets and exhaust from the engine so extensive new plumbing would be needed.

4. With pt. 3 in mind and cost of the unit, shipping and fitting this is presumably going to be an expensive option even if I do it instead of the second alternator and/or fuel cell?

5. Finally, again we return to this being a sledge hammer to crack a nut. Once we return from the Atlantic cruise we aren't going to need the capabilities of a system like the kubota. It will be an under-utilised asset again.

I have already sent a query to Yanmar Sweden to check about the possibility of doing a second alternator.

The Markgrasser thing looks like a way of replacing the existing alternator with a more powerful alternative (one of those truck beasts for example). That would not be my first choice having just spent a lot on a new alternator and having a spare in reserve.

The electromaax thing looks more like it, though I would need to replace the v belt that is on the engine at the mo with a serpentine belt system. Those two together are 1000 dollars. I would then also possibly have to replace the hitachi alternator unless I can change the pulley on it and the spare, (another 1000 bucks, though I could go for an upgrade here). Finally, I would need the new alternator as well (a further 1000+) and then regulators and wiring. So all in here, plus fitting and so on, I am looking at about 5000 dollars to do this.

The reason why that might well be worth it to me is that it would mostly pay for itself over the trip by reducing runtime on the fuel cell, also once we return I would get the benefit from it every time I motored into or out of harbour. Indeed, it would probably make the fuel cell or any other auxiliary generation redundant for our typical cruising. Anytime we motored for propulsion we would load our batteries with enough juice to last us days on the hook and a couple of days in transit.

No, I am now thoroughly convinced of the wisdom of this. I just need to see if I can get it to work.

Best

Na Mara

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Na Mara

Hi Dockhead.

Our boats are neighbours then as my home berth is Dockan Marina in Malmö.

Yeap one of those kubota systems would indeed fit with space to spare and the lack of sound insulation on the unit wouldn't be a problem as the whole bay is well insulated. I could live with plentiful fresh water and I could even have my belt driven bilge pump driven off of this and leave my engine alone. But there are a few issues.

1. Diesel contamination would still be a risk to both generation modes.

2. How would I even source this in Sweden?

3. Presumably I couldn't share the water inlets and exhaust from the engine so extensive new plumbing would be needed.

4. With pt. 3 in mind and cost of the unit, shipping and fitting this is presumably going to be an expensive option even if I do it instead of the second alternator and/or fuel cell?

5. Finally, again we return to this being a sledge hammer to crack a nut. Once we return from the Atlantic cruise we aren't going to need the capabilities of a system like the kubota. It will be an under-utilised asset again.

I have already sent a query to Yanmar Sweden to check about the possibility of doing a second alternator.

The Markgrasser thing looks like a way of replacing the existing alternator with a more powerful alternative (one of those truck beasts for example). That would not be my first choice having just spent a lot on a new alternator and having a spare in reserve.

The electromaax thing looks more like it, though I would need to replace the v belt that is on the engine at the mo with a serpentine belt system. Those two together are 1000 dollars. I would then also possibly have to replace the hitachi alternator unless I can change the pulley on it and the spare, (another 1000 bucks, though I could go for an upgrade here). Finally, I would need the new alternator as well (a further 1000+) and then regulators and wiring. So all in here, plus fitting and so on, I am looking at about 5000 dollars to do this.

The reason why that might well be worth it to me is that it would mostly pay for itself over the trip by reducing runtime on the fuel cell, also once we return I would get the benefit from it every time I motored into or out of harbour. Indeed, it would probably make the fuel cell or any other auxiliary generation redundant for our typical cruising. Anytime we motored for propulsion we would load our batteries with enough juice to last us days on the hook and a couple of days in transit.

No, I am now thoroughly convinced of the wisdom of this. I just need to see if I can get it to work.

Best

Na Mara

Ha cool. Malmo is one of my favorite weekend destinations. I was even thinking about sailing there next weekend, except now the Danish border is closed to me


By the way, a thought -- if you WERE to go to fuel cell -- which I don't really like because of the horrendous operating cost, but still -- you don't need lithium at all. A constant small supply of power goes with lead acid batteries like cookies with cream. I would just forget lithium, if I had a fuel cell, and so the total capital cost of the system might look different.


As to the Kubota generator/watermaker, which I think is the superior solution for your use case -- why don't you just call them and ask? I think they ship it as a kit and you put it together on site. If there is some CE mark issue maybe you can source the Kubota engine separately.


As to the second alternator -- best thing since sliced bread. Definitely figure out how to make that work. I'm sure there is a cheaper and better solution, best of all probably the Yanmar parts.


To inspire you, let me just say a few words about how much I love my school bus alternator, which was supplied by Yanmar as part of the original build of my boat. Whenever the main engine is running, I have a 2.5kW generator working. I can run a load of clothes in my washing machine, dry them, to electric cooking -- whenever I'm motoring (and we all motor about half the time, don't we?) it's like being connected to shore power. It's absolutely awesome. And if I have any problem with the generator, which is pretty rare, but still -- just crank up the prime mover.


As to fuel contamination -- why are you paranoid about that? Just take good care of your fuel tank. And keep a few jerry cans of fresh diesel on board (which you will anyway on an Atlantic circuit). In a really bad case (which should never happen) you can feed the generator directly from a jerry can. This is really not a reason to decline a diesel generator, which is the classical solution to your use case. And it's classical for a good reason - it has huge advantages.

[phantomracer]

Thought I would update this thread, since I installed an Efoy 1600 in 2014, 8 seasons on it now. Like my comments on the Firefly battery thread(s), this is my anecdotal experience.

Overall, it has far exceeded my expectations. Initially I went through a lot of methanol due to having realllllly bad house batteries. Replacing the FLA batteries with Firefly batteries (similar bank amps), greatly improved performance and greatly reduced methanol used!

The reason I installed a fuel cell, was I installed electric refrigeration (Frigoboat). Needed extended power. Wind and solar were not options to me.

I like that when the batteries get low to the turn on point, the efoy comes on, tops off the battery bank. Just like you plugged in a battery charger on land. You can configure the length of time of bulk/absorption and the voltages of each as well

Other than initial cost, and the cost of the fuel, I, honestly, don't see much of a downside. I think it would be best as part of a system with solar/wind, to keep methanol costs down.

Nice thing it runs at night, where solar rarely performs well ! No noise, other than a slight hum of the fuel pump. Only output, other than electricity, is a bit of heat and water.

After replacing the battery bank with firefly batteries, with the refrigeration running, I am finding a single methanol container lasts about 2.5 years, running the refrigeration when we out out cruising (maybe 50 days a year, give or take) .

What I like:

• totally hidden below deck
• No dangerous CO output
• out of the weather
• no windage
• near silent
• reliable (so far)
• automatic operation
• configurable settings
• it works for my specific needs

what I don't like

• high initial cost
• high fuel cost
• hard to find fuel
• shipping hazard fees
• wish it were more powerful

Not selling this as a better choice than wind/solar, just sharing my experience with it for anyone who wants to know what real life is like with it.

[skipmac]

Hi Paul,

Thank you very much for the update. Sounds like, other than the negatives you already mentioned, the EFoy has been a great success.

One suggestion, if you want to take the risk. I used to work for a company that produced ultra high purity chemicals for the lab and research industries and methanol was one of our products. Knowing how that industry works I doubt very seriously that EFoy is custom refining methanol to some special standard but instead is buying a high grade methanol that they repackage and resell for a huge markup.

Again, if you want to gamble, try contacting one of the chemical lab supply companies for high purity methanol. A couple of the majors in this: Sigma Aldrich, Fisher Scientific, Avantor (formerly Mallinkrodt) or VWR. Bet you could save a chunk.

[Na Mara]

I’d be interested in how the output is holding up. After 8 seasons you should be noticing a drop off in the Ah it can put into the battery in any 24hr period (and so reduction in efficiency). The literature claims a 50% drop off after 5000hr.

[phantomracer]

Originally Posted by Na Mara

I’d be interested in how the output is holding up. After 8 seasons you should be noticing a drop off in the Ah it can put into the battery in any 24hr period (and so reduction in efficiency). The literature claims a 50% drop off after 5000hr.

Unsure, when it kicks in, does not seem to run longer than it used to.

I doubt i have even close to 5k hours (will check next time I am at the boat)

[phantomracer]

Originally Posted by skipmac

Hi Paul,

Thank you very much for the update. Sounds like, other than the negatives you already mentioned, the EFoy has been a great success.

One suggestion, if you want to take the risk. I used to work for a company that produced ultra high purity chemicals for the lab and research industries and methanol was one of our products. Knowing how that industry works I doubt very seriously that EFoy is custom refining methanol to some special standard but instead is buying a high grade methanol that they repackage and resell for a huge markup.

Again, if you want to gamble, try contacting one of the chemical lab supply companies for high purity methanol. A couple of the majors in this: Sigma Aldrich, Fisher Scientific, Avantor (formerly Mallinkrodt) or VWR. Bet you could save a chunk.

Thanks, I doubt it is a custom blend. Issue would be how to safely reload the cannister, but where there is a will there is a way.

I did purchase a good amount (probably have 8 cannisters left) of methanol when there was a sale and free shipping, so I stocked up. Conservatively, at the rate i am going, it should be good for another 10-15 years or likely more!

We have modest needs other than the refrigerator. Just electronics/AP/lights . Pretty basic boat otherwise. No 75" tv and surround sound!

But the nutshell answer is it is performing exactly as, or better than, I expected.

[Benz]

With apologies for dredging up this old thread: I just delivered a boat that had an EFoy, and was pretty impressed. It ran the autopilot and boat electrics (basic, sure, but still something) for days while we sailed without a thought to running the engine to charge batteries. No wind or solar. A six-day passage with minimal motoring drew the tank down less than 20%.