400: Lagoon 400

[D&D]

Originally Posted by Garold

I dont have a storm jib. Hope never to go out in that strength of wind.

Fair enuf Garold, but if you're ever thinking about a long passage and want to add a easy-to-carry-and-use storm jib to your armoury just in case, check out the 'Gail Sail' from ATN.

ATN Gail Sail

[hanafe]

Stormjib
We have one on HanaFe, see attached pictured. Luckily we never had to use it and I do not want to use it ever. It will be no fun at all to hoist it in high seas.

Last thing on toilet. Yagoa understood my problem. It is not the smell, we use all the tricks you mentioned, it is the long pipe to the holding tank which leaves quite some water to run back to the bowl. I am impressed about the response of the thread.

[peterp]

Hello Garold good point, after reading Garold’s post pointing out I think correctly that Hanafe has the three head option (Hanafe you might confirm) I may hold off on Hanafe’s fix as I have the same as Garold’s two head option, hopefully the problem described by Hanafe is unique to the three head system, however if the problem does arise down the track Hanafe has come up with simple fix.
Regards Peter

Originally Posted by Garold

We have the factory fitted electric toilets (seawater). And they function just fine (now that one of our rinse pumps had been repaired). For solids and liquids. No evidence so far of any 'backflow'.

But since we are talking toilets, we have to go into detail. So, if you have a sqeamish nature then maybe stop reading now...........

And once again, these are my own thoughts based on my own experiences only........

Even though we may be talking about the same boats (L400), they can be specced differently, and so the pipes may run differently (and so the toilets perform differently). We have an owners version with one toilet on starboard side, and two cabins, with one toilet on the port side. I am not sure Hanafe if your boat is the same configuration. But in my configuration, my pipes empty just fine.

However, always aware that I will be the bloke who has to unblock the toilets if anything gets stuck, I do frequently flush whilst using (during and after), making sure that lots of fresh seawater is flowing down those pipes and washing eveyrthing away. Embarrassment won't let me go into any further detail but hopefully it's clear that I think that blokes need more flushing! And there is probably a correlation between the size of the bloke and the amount and frequency of flushing.

Interestingly, (sad that I can open a line about toilets this way) we had electric freshwater Leesan toilets installed on our last boat (L380) and they were not as effective as the L400 electric toilets. On that boat we did have a bit of what Hanafe describes, and a bit of ineffective flushing (ie not always clearing the bowl fully). However, we used a lot of fresh water on those toilets and so when presented with the option of factory fit sea water toilets, we decided to try them. Our fresh water capacity is larger (x2?) than the L380 but nevertheless, we seem to last about 4 times as long between water top ups.

Hanafe is right to point out that the quality of sea water must have an impact on smells etc, but even in crystal clear water, there is still some smell from seawater toilets. In the UK there are many yachtie opinions on this, but on our L400 (so far) it not as bad as we thought it would be. However, since some people suggest that it is from microbes that grow in the inlet pipes, maybe it will get worse over time.

And that's my piece on toilets.

Cheers

Garold

[hanafe]

Hi Peter,
yes I have the 3 head option. Master at starport side and 2 guest on port side.
Have a good week guys.

HanaFe

[peterp]

HelloYagao, thanks for a most informative response to a problem that can really spoil one’s day. Your suggestion of adding quote ‘The second step is to regularly feed your toilet white vinegar’. Yagao, how much volume of white vinegar do you recommend is added to the system.
Regards Peter

[YOGAO]

I typically add 8 - 12 ounces (250 - 350 ml). Since we are full-time cruising, I pump enough to get it out of the bowl and then go back about 4 hours later and pump it further into the system (a bit of trial and error there) to get it further along the system. It sits overnight.

We put a washcloth over the lid to remind us not to use the head being treated.

Fair Winds,
Mike

[paulrack]

Believe me I avoid those winds if I can, however the forecasting seems to be becoming less accurate. A good example was this weekend when they forecast 30 and it blew 60. It seems to be happening more often in summer as well, you go out with a forecast of 35kts and you come back in 45!. My storm jib has a spectra halyard that fits to an eye on the inside of the front crossbeam witha block lower down the mast at the second set of stays. I have two padeyes on the coachroof at the correct distance from the stormjib clew which two blocks on snapshackles get attached. The jib has soft hanks and is then raised on the spectra halyard. I had a similar setup in the picture on my monohull where it goes around the furled headsail. The problem is actually getting it up in the wind as there is a lot of friction. Where to attache the tack without damaging the furler and on my boat the sheet blocks were then in the wrong place.

How do you treat electric toilets where you cannot control water staying in the pipes?

[peterp]

bman and hanafe, I think you both have the 40hp option as I have coming, what is the brand of the folding prop fitted by Lagoon? Also I am researching rope cutters anybody have any comments on type, brand, experience for folding props, plenty of stuff on the net on fixed but zip on folding.
Thanks in advance. Peter

[paulrack]

Hi Peter

I am not sure what lagoon put on, I had the same dilemma, what folding prop. I eventually went with a Flexofold 3 blade folding prop. The size flexofold suggested for my boat was a 17X12. (I have a Volvo 40hp on a Maverick 400). I am very happy, great performance and fantastic in reverse.

[Garold]

Originally Posted by peterp

bman and hanafe, I think you both have the 40hp option as I have coming, what is the brand of the folding prop fitted by Lagoon? Also I am researching rope cutters anybody have any comments on type, brand, experience for folding props, plenty of stuff on the net on fixed but zip on folding.
Thanks in advance. Peter

Peter

As you know, I have fixed props. But we do have Ambassador rope cutters, which we had fitted to our previous boat.

Not sure that I could recommend them but my experience may be irregular.

On the last boat we had a loud noise from the port drive after one trip. At inspection, the rope cutter had disintegrated and was spinning round the shaft behind the prop. The fitting guy reckoned that though the cutter had given up, we must have had maybe some cable round the prop and the cutter had freed us but destroyed itself in the process. We had to pay for another new rope cutter (the previous one was only about 8 months old). The fitting guy suggested that this was proof that the cutter was necessary and had done it's job. For me, I was not aware that to do its job, the rope cutter sometimes needed replacing!

On our current boat, we have a minor whine from the starboard drive at about 1800 revs which disappears 200rpm later. I dried out to check the drive and the only evidence that I could find of any difference between the two drives, was that the rope cutter on the starboard drive is a bit looser than that on the port side. I believe that this play is causing the whine.

So, that's my experience of rope cutters. They seem to do their job but they may keep you aware of their presence.

For what it's worth, I met bloke yesterday who had lived on his L380 for six years. He had folding props and no rope cutter. He had never had a problem. He reckoned that because he sailed a lot, and the props were folded when doing so, he had much less chance of picking anything up. Worked for him. Also, he has had no probs with control under power.

Cheers

Garold

[peterp]

Thanks Paul, might sound silly but I don't know what brand prop is on the 40hp Yanmar's, it comes as a package, all I know they are folding props, Garold has fixed props.....Regards Peter

[peterp]

Having a look, it may be possible to cut any rope off the prop with out getting wet as the prop is very close to the bottom step. Regards Peter

[bman]

Hi Peter

You are correct I do have folding props and Yanmar 40s. I have looked through the information I have at home but I do not have details on the make of folding props. I will check again when I go to my office as I think I may have information there.

Bruce

[peterp]

Thanks bman, thank goodnes I'm not the only one that is in the dark, only three or four days to go and i'll know for sure as my baby will be here. Regards Peter

[jfjelnset]

Hi peterp, Bman and Garold. I`m about to make the order for a Lagoon 400. I wanted to have an idea of what price I could get and started looking for both new and used 2009-2010 models. And then ended up with asking for a 9 percent disscount on the original price from the Norwegian vender.(Same pricelist as UK) This is more or less the same price as a 2010 model with 50 hours on the engines and 500 miles sailing (used for 2 months) . does this seem like a good price for you guys? Or did I aim to low/high? hoping for a quick answer as i`m about to close the deal..

Cheers

Jens