Propane drainage

[Jack Long]

Okay, so the locker goes outside and drains any leakage over the side. A hose run to the BBQ on the rail... What about the stove? It seems like running a hose inside would open up a whole can of "how are you draining propane from the cabin" but I can't believe that every boat with a propane stove has some above the water thru-hull for this or is in danger of esploding...?

I was thinking maybe some sort of quick release on the hose outside since I wouldn't use the inside stove often?

[GordMay]

Your opening propositions are more or less accurate. Please re-state your question.

[Jack Long]

Are most people with propane stoves living at risk?

Is there something inherently less leak risk prone about the hose and stove side connections that alleviate the need for interior drainage with an external tank?

Do most people without internal storage use a quick disconnect to minimize risk since they don't have the aforementioned drainage?

If my tank is setup outside in a locker with over-the-side drainage can I just use a Y valve and leave the stove hooked up?

Originally Posted by Jack Long

Are most people with propane stoves living at risk?

Is there something inherently less leak risk prone about the hose and stove side connections that alleviate the need for interior drainage with an external tank?

Do most people without internal storage use a quick disconnect to minimize risk since they don't have the aforementioned drainage?

If my tank is setup outside in a locker with over-the-side drainage can I just use a Y valve and leave the stove hooked up?

NO!!!!

You must use a solenoid to shut off gas flow when it is not being used.

Also, the entire run inside the hull must be one continuous piece of copper tubing, except for the flex hose connecting to the stove itself.

If you are living with a propanse system designed by someone who did not KNOW what they were doing you ARE living with a bomb.

Get it checked out NOW.

The owner of this boat got free internet advice on how to install his propane system:

[Jack Long]

The firemen?

I intend to use BBQ supplies.

By solenoid do you mean something electric? How is that safer than cranking down the valve by hand and opening it when you want to use it?

[Shu]

I have a multi-tank system. There is a hand shutoff for each tank as well as a solenoid between the tanks and stove which is mounted out side the cabin area. The entire locker for the tanks and solenoid is vented as well as having an outside drain. I believe the solenoid is required by Coast Guard these days.

[Ex-Calif]

A picture is worth a thousand words.

Propane Systems by Don Casey

On a couple of boats I have been on lately there has also been a manual shut off on the bulkhead entering the cabin. That is a manual valve on the tank, a solenoid and pressure guage etc, in the locker a continuous line to the cabin bulkhead with a bulkhead fitting and a manual closuure on the inside of the cabin.

I personally would also concentrate on making the minimum number of connections outside the storage locker.

Originally Posted by Jack Long

The firemen?

I intend to use BBQ supplies.

By solenoid do you mean something electric? How is that safer than cranking down the valve by hand and opening it when you want to use it?

I can't stop you from using "BBQ supplies" to install a propane system on the inside of your boat.

All I can do is tell you you do not know what you are doing and some of the advice you are getting here is dangerous.

You come here asking for advice, when you get it you argue with it.

Propane is the most potentially the most dangerous system on your boat. It can also be very safe. Lots of thought has been put into what makes a safe system. You can ignore that careful and knowledgable thought and figure you know better. Maybe you do know better, but I doubt it.

[Zoomie]

Originally Posted by GreatKetch

NO!!!!

You must use a solenoid to shut off gas flow when it is not being used.

Errrr... shutting the tank off by hand works just as well and has no electronic or moving parts. Except my hand. I just read a thread about a "smoking solenoid". Not something I'm interested in experiencing.

[Jack Long]

I should have put a smiley after the firemen comment to make it clear I was kidding.

I do come here asking advice. And when the advice is outside the scope of my capabilities- for time, money, experience, or whatever- I will explore alternatives. Absolutely.

I am also prone to rejecting dogma. We have locked horns on this before. It makes me a little sad when you get aggressively preachy, but it doesn't make me wrong. There are "righter" and "wronger" ways to do just about everything. Very few things, even on a boat, even with propane, have only one right way to do them.

Here is what I know. I've used propane BBQs for years and while I've had the entire guts of a system rust out- I've never seen any corrosion or wear on the hoses or fittings. That doesn't mean I don't think they corrode, but it does mean that my experience with over the counter BBQ hoses and fitting indicates they are fairly robust. With the locker I am setting p and my intended usage patterns I feel pretty good that I can avoid the robust/safest/permanent installation by removing the hose from the stove and cabin after each use.

Here is our problem Ketch: You seldom answer the questions asked or provide advice on the proposed plan. You take the rough outline of the plan, or an alternate form of the question that you think SHOULD have been asked, and then crawl on a soapbox made out of time and money.

This forum has been TREMENDOUSLY helpful to me and I am very grateful for it, but I've said before and will say again- if my threads bother you just ignore them.

[Pblais]

Maybe you should rephrase the question.

[Pelagic]

Thanks for the great Link Dan. I have everything but the pressure gauge as I soap test about once a month.

My 2 tanks are inside my cockpit locker seat which is vented on deck, plus if I ever have had a leak when changing tanks…you can smell it right away, but the pressure gauge is a much better way to monitor complete run…. so I will look to install.

One question….My propane tanks are in chocks laying on their side, rather than standing up. Is there any problem with that?

[drh1965]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Thanks for the great Link Dan. I have everything but the pressure gauge as I soap test about once a month.

My 2 tanks are inside my cockpit locker seat which is vented on deck, plus if I ever have had a leak when changing tanks…you can smell it right away, but the pressure gauge is a much better way to monitor complete run…. so I will look to install.

One question….My propane tanks are in chocks laying on their side, rather than standing up. Is there any problem with that?

Is the vent above the tank? If so, remember that propane vapor is heavier than air.

[cal40john]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Thanks for the great Link Dan. I have everything but the pressure gauge as I soap test about once a month.

My 2 tanks are inside my cockpit locker seat which is vented on deck, plus if I ever have had a leak when changing tanks…you can smell it right away, but the pressure gauge is a much better way to monitor complete run…. so I will look to install.

One question….My propane tanks are in chocks laying on their side, rather than standing up. Is there any problem with that?

Some tanks are designed to be upright, others on their side . The tanks are designed to supply vapor when they are in their proper orientation. If you tip them over so that they supply liquid, that is supposed to be bad. Since I had never heard exactly what bad was, your question made me curious what that was. Here's a discussion I found.

Propane explosions (John De Armond)

Unless I misunderstood you, it sounds like your propane locker is not safe. It should be a sealed box that opens on top, with a drain on the bottom going overboard with no dips in the drain tube. This way if you ever have a leak, the propane goes overboard. The hose and wire entering the box should be near the top and sealed. The solenoid valve allows you to shut off the fuel in the locker when ever you are not using the stove, so a leak in the hose or stove outside of the box only dumps what's in the hose in the boat when you are not using the stove. Shutting off the valve on the main tank every time you turn off the stove pretty much accomplishes the same thing. My theory is it was assumed that most people would not bother to do that, so the solenoid valve allows you to do that from the galley. I suppose that if you happen to have a leak while using the stove, the solenoid is a quick way to shut off the fuel as well.

Some other things that are supposed to be done for a correct install, all tees inside the locker, no joints in propane line outside of the locker, except for joint to flexible coupling to the gimbaled stove.

(I have repeated some if not all of what others have said here.)

Calder's book, or a good propane installer/store (in Seattle, Sure Marine seems to be good.) are good references. You should make sure you get the whole list of a proper install from the above or from ABYC.

John