About NOT power setting the anchor

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by desodave

Personally I always power set my anchor although the power used is definitely not full reverse

This illustrates a burning question - how do the proponents define "power-set"? Full reverse, 50%, or what? What is the desired goal - anchor tip dug in, anchor fully buried, or what?

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

This illustrates a burning question - how do the proponents define "power-set"? Full reverse, 50%, or what? What is the desired goal - anchor tip dug in, anchor fully buried, or what?

It's going to vary by boat and by conditions:
- An old 45ft monohull with a 15hp motor turning a 2 blade prop, can probably give her 100% for 30 seconds after being pulled to a stop as a very practical limit.
- A twin 500hp powerboat turning a couple of large 4 blade props would likely break something if they gave it even 50% (we used idle speed when we had a 31ft flybridge powerboat)

I'm looking to see if it's holding. If I can feel the anchor line jerk as the anchor loses grip on the bottom or we just keep going backwards, I know there is something wrong. In most cases, I can't see the anchor, so I don't know how deep it is set.

Of course, no guarantees but a lot better than toss it over the side and hope for the best.

[bumpman]

A very interesting thread, through all the anger, opinion, and wisdom. The thread made me miss being able to dive on every anchor I dropped (as in clear tropical waters). I wonder if there's a deep water camera (that's affordable) that could go down with one's anchor in low viz, deep cold water. Oh well. My take home from this thread is that whether power setting or not, the anchor tip needs to be able to dig-in, and it's most likely by initial 'gentle' persuasion with initial low reverse power or windage or hand pulling on the rode. Then the boater needs to be sure that the anchor has set in the substrate. How that's done can vary e.g. like diving on it if possible, powering back 'more' forcibly, back winding a sail, or letting wind and windage do the trick over time. If one wants to power the anchor deep or not might depend on the substrate, chance of fouling, weather forecast, duration of anchoring, or personal practice. And I guess we're all talking about modern anchors, plenty of chain, and practical catenary. I miss anything? - Always trying to be a good listener.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by bumpman

A very interesting thread, through all the anger, opinion, and wisdom. The thread made me miss being able to dive on every anchor I dropped (as in clear tropical waters). I wonder if there's a deep water camera (that's affordable) that could go down with one's anchor in low viz, deep cold water. Oh well. My take home from this thread is that whether power setting or not, the anchor tip needs to be able to dig-in, and it's most likely by initial 'gentle' persuasion with initial low reverse power or windage or hand pulling on the rode. Then the boater needs to be sure that the anchor has set in the substrate. How that's done can vary e.g. like diving on it if possible, powering back 'more' forcibly, back winding a sail, or letting wind and windage do the trick over time. If one wants to power the anchor deep or not might depend on the substrate, chance of fouling, weather forecast, duration of anchoring, or personal practice. And I guess we're all talking about modern anchors, plenty of chain, and practical catenary. I miss anything? - Always trying to be a good listener.

I’d say you summarized it well.

It doesn’t matter what pulls on the rode to dig an anchor in. It just matters there is a tug. And a sudden stop.

Once that happens, you can relax.

[Jim Cate]

It doesn’t matter what pulls on the rode to dig an anchor in. It just matters there is a tug. And a sudden stop.

How does this happen when you just dump 10:1 and forget about it as advised in other posts? In calmish conditions?

Jim

[thomm225]

Just a bit of tide will set your anchor fine in most places. Or you can drop early just after you drop sail or before if the wind is light.

Folks need to remember that for 100's and 100's of years sailors anchored without engines and many that sail engineless do fine.

Again, I've never power set an anchor but have been anchoring for almost 50 years!

I believe when you learn these things in your teens you have a better feel than most that learn later in life......

Others rely on engines ........ even though for some of us it's all about the sailing

[chris mac]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Just a bit of tide will set your anchor fine in many places. Or you can drop early just after you drop sail or before if the wind is light.

Folks need to remember that for 100's and 100's of years folks anchored without engines and many that sail engineless do fine.

Again, I've never power set an anchor but have been anchoring for almost 50 years!

And for thousands of years people walked or rode animals everywhere. Then the wheel was invented, and gears, and engines.
Lots of things work "fine" the old way. But advancements in tech and equipment allow better tools to accomplish our tasks.
If "good enough" is your benchmark, that's fine. Keep on with your way. But some of us want to utilize all tools available to achieve better, or even best.

[chrisr]

we always power set. both engines 30% for 10 seconds (our engines are bigger than normal for our size cat). i like to know our anchor (SARCA excel) is well dug in.

but question to all those who do powerset : "who remembers to put a decent strop on the chain before backing down" ?

it's not a good idea to do this on the gypsy...

cheers,

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

How does this happen when you just dump 10:1 and forget about it as advised in other posts? In calmish conditions?

Jim

The boat’s always moving, Jim.

Try it next time you’re out.

You dump it, then when it catches, the boat points into the wind and you see the chain ride up out of the water. Or in the rare instance there is absolutely no wind, AND no current, it just pulls the bow around to the reciprocal course from the one you were on when you dropped it.

Jim, boats have been anchoring for thousands of years before the internal combustion engine was invented. This isn’t some new magic.

The best thing for anyone to do is simply try it.

This is no different than the rotating prop vs stationary prop drag argument. Try it. Sail along at a couple knots and put her in gear. You’ll see the boat slows significantly.

This is one to try too.

Come into a spot you want to anchor and drop your anchor right down to the bottom. A second or so after it hits, dump out 10:1. You’ll never drag.

[Uricanejack]

[QUOTE=thinwater;3313355]Let's start with this:


Chotu

"I [can't] see why everyone else uses their engine to pull on the anchor to try to set it. I literally throw mine overboard and dump out 10:1, or at worst case, 8:1. Nature does the rest. Never dragged once in my life and I’ve lived at anchor more nights than on land in my life...."

I have a firm personal policy.
A gentleman never tells another gentleman how to sail, manoeuvre or anchor his boat when one is a guest.
Unless ones opinion is explicitly asked for.

I sail quite often with my brother in law, on his boat or mine.
He is an Engineer
we get along quite well, so long as we stick with the above.

He drinks Prosecco and Martinis, I drink beer and malt.
He subscribes to your anchor theory.

I subscribe to the traditional lore.

When I sail with Donald we take particular care to ensure or position is well Checked with transits ect.
We Donald sails with me we do the same.

When I sail with Donald we have been known to drag.

Purely coincidence I’m sure and I would never be so impolite as to point out
We didn’t drag when we were out on my boat.

A gentleman usually keeps another gentleman’s choice in stock.
Even when it’s not to ones own taste

[Chotu]

[QUOTE=Uricanejack;3314545]

Originally Posted by thinwater

Let's start with this:


Chotu

"I [can't] see why everyone else uses their engine to pull on the anchor to try to set it. I literally throw mine overboard and dump out 10:1, or at worst case, 8:1. Nature does the rest. Never dragged once in my life and I’ve lived at anchor more nights than on land in my life...."

I have a firm personal policy.
A gentleman never tells another gentleman how to sail, manoeuvre or anchor his boat when one is a guest.
Unless ones opinion is explicitly asked for.

I sail quite often with my brother in law, on his boat or mine.
He is an Engineer
we get along quite well, so long as we stick with the above.

He drinks Prosecco and Martinis, I drink beer and malt.
He subscribes to your anchor theory.

I subscribe to the traditional lore.

When I sail with Donald we take particular care to ensure or position is well Checked with transits ect.
We Donald sails with me we do the same.

When I sail with Donald we have been known to drag.

Purely coincidence I’m sure and I would never be so impolite as to point out
We didn’t drag when we were out on my boat.

A gentleman usually keeps another gentleman’s choice in stock.
Even when it’s not to ones own taste

Don’t be a dbag.

You’re quoting a post I DIDN’T EVEN MAKE and telling me to mind my own business?

Maybe you missed the fact that I wasn’t the original poster. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt as you’re probably misreading something or drunk.

[japawil]

[QUOTE=Chotu;3314554]

Originally Posted by Uricanejack

Don’t be a dbag.



You’re quoting a post I DIDN’T EVEN MAKE and telling me to mind my own business?



Maybe you missed the fact that I wasn’t the original poster. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt as you’re probably misreading something or drunk.

To be fair, while you didn’t post that in this thread, it is quoted (with corrected typo) from your post in another thread (about 4 to 1 scope).

I agree, it was in questionable etiquette for someone else to use your named quote to start a thread. As suggested previously, it probably would have been better to generalize the quote or use it anonymously, thus not dragging you unwillingly into this thread. That horse has left the barn unfortunately.

However, those are your words (with corrected typo), and you have actively defended them, thus making them fair game for rebuttal.

[Jim Cate]

Come into a spot you want to anchor and drop your anchor right down to the bottom. A second or so after it hits, dump out 10:1. You’ll never drag.

Your saying this repeatedly does not make it true, mate.

I submit that in the several cases I mentioned before, where the anchor had landed on debris and failed to set at all, that your technique could well have put us on the putty. There are a variety of other scenarios where your practice will not work, and "Never" is a very long time!

Such statements make me wonder about your claim in another post to "know everything about anchoring"...

And before you again say that you have anchored more than anyone else on the forum, I'd wager that I have anchored more times, in more varied places and for more years than you have. However, I openly admit that I'm still learning...

Jim

[Don C L]

One thing about laying out 10:1, it will take more horsepower to set the anchor because a good amount of horsepower is working just to drag the chain along the bottom. And, if you drop your anchor on debris, and it is fouled, and you have 10:1 out and light winds, you will have the mistaken impression you have a really great anchor.

[dfelsent]

I’m hoping that the many people I respect (and sometime times disagree with) that are on this thread can recognize the value in each other’s viewpoints.
I for one have been anchoring on and off for 50 years (since childhood) as have many here. And I constantly made and make mistakes and learn. I am learning from this thread too.