Month 35 Expenses of Cruising and Living on the Boat

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Quadrille in JB

I cruise in the summer with a couple on a 41” Morgan in the Med. Their budget is $2500 usd per month, including fuel, marinas, food, eating out, entertainment, maintenance, etc. It doesn’t include insurance. And they live quite well on this amount, staying mostly in marinas. Traveling thru the French canal system from Port Napoleon near Marseille to Amsterdam we often stayed at city docks for 2€ per night including electricity. What a great way to live.

See theres the problem, it dosent include insurance, what else dosent it include?

Not trying to be argumentative but we are talking about what it costs to run ones life while living a cruising lifestyle.

To have any meaning it must include all expenses. I include in my expenses rates on rental properties, taxes, accounting bills, bank fees etc, absolutely everything, how can you not? If you do not include absolutely everything then you dont actually know what its costing you to live.

When I was in business I had to be brutally honest about what it cost to run the business, if not I would of gone broke as the guy I sold it to is because he cant count or dosen't want to.

One of boat expenses must be counted as well.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by daletournier

See theres the problem, it dosent include insurance, what else dosent it include?

Not trying to be argumentative but we are talking about what it costs to run ones life while living a cruising lifestyle.

To have any meaning it must include all expenses. I include in my expenses rates on rental properties, taxes, accounting bills, bank fees etc, absolutely everything, how can you not? If you do not include absolutely everything then you dont actually know what its costing you to live.

When I was in business I had to be brutally honest about what it cost to run the business, if not I would of gone broke as the guy I sold it to is because he cant count or dosen't want to.

One of boat expenses must be counted as well.

Exactly, focusing on food and not including all is a pretty meaningless number - unless you are cherry picking data to arrive at your preconceived conclusion.

I had a pretty low budget conscious friend who published their detailed budget each month for a few years. All looked good. They stopped publishing when they had to replace their engine. So the big hit of the new Yanmar never made to the published budgets.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Paul L

Exactly, focusing on food and not including all is a pretty meaningless number - unless you are cherry picking data to arrive at your preconceived conclusion.

I had a pretty low budget conscious friend who published their detailed budget each month for a few years. All looked good. They stopped publishing when they had to replace their engine. So the big hit of the new Yanmar never made to the published budgets.

Yep, that $100 a day for me is year to date, when I look at the numbers come the end of December it will be abit more than $100/day when taken over the full 12 mths as I'm about to haul out, spend money making everything nice and shiny again and I'll most likely fly home which means air ticket and boat storage.

The only way to be truly sure what ones life costs them is to record every expense everyday, guestimateing is far from accurate.

[sailorboy1]

It seems to almost be taboo to talk about ones budget

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

It seems to almost be taboo to talk about ones budget

My Wife used to chastise me when I asked people what it cost them.
I believe it’s always been taboo to talk finances, however coming from a Military background where ones income wasn’t a guess, it’s not bothered me.
However working in the Civilian world I found out that it’s absolutely verboten to discuss what your salary is in a company.
I guess that carries over to life.

Our expenditures are about what yours are, but as have a lot of land based expenses, paying both kids car Insurence and storage fees etc.
But we don’t eat out nearly as much as you do either, for us it’s usually once a week.
When we were in the Bahamas, our costs were a fraction of what they are when in the US.
No marina fees, no car, no electric bill, no traveling to see family etc.
I think our costs are about $2,000 a month in the Bahamas.
But we carried a LOT of food with us, and I’ve not kept records like you have, so it’s a guess.

People will say otherwise of course, but I don’t think it can be sustained long term for less than $3,000 a month, not without the boat running down,and those big costs take a long time to amortize out

[AKA-None]

Cost to live is not a budget it’s expenses. A budget is what you plan to spend but expenses is what you actually spend. It’s easy to have a low expense rate if you leave out what you spent to get started.

[scallowayuk]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

Maybe if you posted a more detailed accounting of your boat costs you would be taken seriously. Meanwhile no one believes you cruise on $600 euros a month.

i cruise on less than that but im singlehanded.in the last year i averaged 57 euros a week. but i dont do marinas.

[scallowayuk]

Originally Posted by scallowayuk

i cruise on less than that but im singlehanded.in the last year i averaged 57 euros a week. but i dont do marinas.

why do you assume people who cruise on very little money are liars.

[CatNewBee]

Originally Posted by AKA-None

Cost to live is not a budget it’s expenses. A budget is what you plan to spend but expenses is what you actually spend. It’s easy to have a low expense rate if you leave out what you spent to get started.

Absolutely true. I don't know if there are people doing the math on land life too with that accuracy on a monthly base.

We have an idea, what it costs in average and can compare, but we make the spending decissions on occasions, we save if possible, and spend if necessary. Some places are more expensive than others.

Living on board is not cheaper than living on land.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Paul L

Exactly, focusing on food and not including all is a pretty meaningless number - unless you are cherry picking data to arrive at your preconceived conclusion.

I had a pretty low budget conscious friend who published their detailed budget each month for a few years. All looked good. They stopped publishing when they had to replace their engine. So the big hit of the new Yanmar never made to the published budgets.

Our Yanmar 100hp has only 2400 hours on it, and we’ve only put 1400 on it over an eight year period which amounts to less than 200 per year. Our Perkins 225hp has only 800 hours total on it since new.

Our Onan 12.5kw generator is three months old with 35 hours total and our Westerbeke 10kw has only 1500 hours. This year with solar we’ve only put 35 hours on it.

Our sails are brand new DYS tri-radial cut on both boats with an expected life span of 30,000 sailing miles. We’ve put less than 10 sailing days on them to date.

At this rate of wear, I don’t expect any need to replace any of these big ticket items in my lifetime... so they’re not part of the budget, and don’t need to be. Starting out with everything brand new makes a big difference in the monthly service/replacement cost to run a cruising boat.

[Hartings]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Our Yanmar 100hp has only 2400 hours on it, and we’ve only put 1400 on it over an eight year period which amounts to less than 200 per year. Our Perkins 225hp has only 800 hours total on it since new.

Our Onan 12.5kw generator is three months old with 35 hours total and our Westerbeke 10kw has only 1500 hours. This year with solar we’ve only put 35 hours on it.

Our sails are brand new DYS tri-radial cut on both boats with an expected life span of 30,000 sailing miles. We’ve put less than 10 sailing days on them to date.

At this rate of wear, I don’t expect any need to replace any of these big ticket items in my lifetime... so they’re not part of the budget, and don’t need to be. Starting out with everything brand new makes a big difference in the monthly service/replacement cost to run a cruising boat.

So your new generator and top quality sails (for both of your boats) come from The Magic Money Tree ? Therefore they are excluded from your sailing ‘costs’. It all makes sense now if that’s how you do your accounting.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Hartings

So your new generator and top quality sails (for both of your boats) come from The Magic Money Tree ? Therefore they are excluded from your sailing ‘costs’. It all makes sense now if that’s how you do your accounting.

Purchase an older boat then replace items piece-meal on a monthly basis as they wear out, or purchase a newer boat or refit with newer items to begin with.... then not worry about big ticket items on a monthly basis except four routine service done by operator.

The choice is yours.

[Hartings]

I totally agree with you that there are various ways of minimising costs; from buying a newer boat to installing new equipment. I don’t see how capital expenditure such as a new generator and a new suite of sails can be excluded from ‘costs’ ? Maybe you can enlighten me ? Alternatively just confirm what the generator and sails cost you. Each individual can then compute those costs as they see fit.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Hartings

I totally agree with you that there are various ways of minimising costs; from buying a newer boat to installing new equipment. I don’t see how capital expenditure such as a new generator and a new suite of sails can be excluded from ‘costs’ ? Maybe you can enlighten me ? Alternatively just confirm what the generator and sails cost you. Each individual can then compute those costs as they see fit.

Here you go,

Our 62 was purchased already having a brand new Onan 12.5kw generator supplied by the previous owner for us to install after delivery, his cost was $14,000. The sails that came with the 62, had very little if any wear on them according to the sail loft upon inspection following delivery.

We replaced the sails on our 53 two summers ago with money that had been set aside the prior year for that purpose (3 years ago) $23,000 for all three sails. We didn’t use the boat last summer, therefore the low hours. The solar array was purchased 19 months ago for €3500.

I started with a clean slate one year ago regarding costs, since then.... I’ve been claiming €15-€20 euros per day expenditures for everything to cruise the Eastern Med including, Italy, Montenegro, Croatia and Greece.

Yesterday we spent €24 to eat out, and today... we spent €0?

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

My Wife used to chastise me when I asked people what it cost them.
I believe it’s always been taboo to talk finances, however coming from a Military background where ones income wasn’t a guess, it’s not bothered me.
However working in the Civilian world I found out that it’s absolutely verboten to discuss what your salary is in a company.
I guess that carries over to life.

Our expenditures are about what yours are, but as have a lot of land based expenses, paying both kids car Insurence and storage fees etc.
But we don’t eat out nearly as much as you do either, for us it’s usually once a week.
When we were in the Bahamas, our costs were a fraction of what they are when in the US.
No marina fees, no car, no electric bill, no traveling to see family etc.
I think our costs are about $2,000 a month in the Bahamas.
But we carried a LOT of food with us, and I’ve not kept records like you have, so it’s a guess.

People will say otherwise of course, but I don’t think it can be sustained long term for less than $3,000 a month, not without the boat running down,and those big costs take a long time to amortize out

I agree that overtime if your using the boat to travel 3k / mth is the minimum most will spend,its very close to what I spend. As you said you can obviously let the boat run down and save money short term. Many spend more.

Usage obviously plays a big part, if one sits at the same Anchorage for 12 mths well then that changes everything.

Boats cost money, as mentioned my boat is in extremely good condition BUT stuff gets old. I replaced 3 Lewmar hatch hinges last week. Most boats these days have these hatches. The hinges eventually break, just the way it is. These hinges at Budget marine are approx $60usd a hatch. Theres $180 gone just like that. This is normal. Replaced my chain 1 mth ago ,2k, my jib that was new 18 mths ago as a small RIP, it's going to the sail maker today, the list goes on.