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Old 24-09-2019, 06:35   #1
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Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Hi all,
I'm 'danger close' to placing an offer on a boat after a year of searching. I found a make I like, but each of the three boats I am interested in has a potential major post-purchase cost associated with it in the near term. Interested in your opinions on which is an easier/smarter job to tackle, and which job will present more return when I go to sell the boat down the road. I will be a first time boat owner, but not new to sailing...just new to the big maintenance tickets!

Boat 1: high engine hours with uneven idle at low RPM. Engine access is not great, only three sides, with the maintenance side conveniently not accessible. The rest of the boat is meticulously maintained, but all systems are dated.

Boat 2: 30yr old teak decks (screw down). Visited the boat once, no sign of dark spots around bungs. The rest of the boat is meticulously maintained with systems upgraded.

Boat 3: 50-100 blisters about 1" in size. Broker claims they are dry and not bleeding. I haven't seen this boat in person yet - the blisters set the brakes for me.

Thanks. As before, really appreciate everyone's insight, especially those with first-hand experience on these items.
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Old 24-09-2019, 06:43   #2
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Congratulations, Froggy.

Eliminate #3. You know it is going to be a deep hole to drop money/time into. Get a compression check and general professional evaluation on the #1's engine. It could be minor, it could be worn out. What is the problem with #2? It's got teak decks, but you don't mention a repair that is needed.
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Old 24-09-2019, 07:00   #3
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Thanks, tkeithlu,

Appreciate the advice.

engine: I did have a certified yanmar mechanic look at the engine. He spent 1.5 hours surveying it and he stopped at the point where he said he definitely recommends a compression test. He guessed it could be as easy as injectors and pump (?), but didn't want to speculate. He was not impressed with engine access, and said if I did need/want to repower, he would not entertain a rebuild - he would replace. He estimated under $30k for replacement given the location of engine, but said there could be up to $10k of carpentry needed to get to it.

teak decks: They are slivered up around the jib sheet tracks, and the teak is well below the rubber strips. other than that, i listed it as the hot item because i've always read teak usually needs to be replaced between 25-30yrs, and is never a straight forward job, especially with the screwed down decks. I got quotes from different yards up and down the east coast, ranging from $20k - $100K (guess which was the quote from Annapolis), and that range took me by surprise.
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Old 24-09-2019, 07:03   #4
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Kinda hard to say without more info. But based on what you provided I would take the blister boat in terms of cost/time of repair. Assuming these are all below the waterline it's fairly straightforward to grind them out, fill and fair, barrier coat and paint. All stuff you can do yourself with a little research. First boat may require repowering. Second boat...stripping off a teak deck and refinishing is a long tedious job.
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Old 24-09-2019, 07:11   #5
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Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

I would take the blister boat too, I believe blisters are pretty common actually, I think a lot of older boats have them, not sure why, but it seems that taking a boat from up North to down South brings out the blisters, perhaps it’s because they don’t spend half the year on the hard?

Then age seems to also go with blisters, I don’t know if new resin is better, or does it just take decades to develop blisters?

Poor engine access is a no go for me, even if it was a good motor.

Then teak decks will be an expensive proposition, guaranteed. However it’s the likelihood of a wet deck that would worry me more than having to remove and or replace the teak.
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Old 24-09-2019, 07:23   #6
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Thanks for your input

blisters: they are all below the waterline. what bothered me most about them is that the owner had the boat out of the water, clearly saw them, and chose to just have a painter do a normal bottom paint job and didn't address the blisters. I understand he is selling, but the other owners continue to fix discrepancies as they appear during showings.

all three boats are Taswells, if that has any relevance to these items.
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Old 24-09-2019, 08:12   #7
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

What age and how high are the hours on #1 ? You say high but that can be subjective. I’d do a oil analysis and pull the oil cap while it’s running check for blow by before spending too much money on #1. If both those check out, then get a compression test done, go from there. Both #2 and #3 could be big bucks to fix, if everything else on #1 is as good as you say an engine is a relatively easy fix, go new or go used, there’s always someone selling a used diesel. But to have the teak decks removed recored and glassed by pro’s will cost about the same as the new engine, and the blister boat is again an unknown until you start stripping the bottom but could add up quickly if it’s really far gone (peel and reglass, plus barrier plus paint) and that’s assuming the owner hasn’t treated rest of the maintenance like the hull.
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Old 24-09-2019, 08:26   #8
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Thanks, rbk.
The engine hours are north of 8,300. At the time of survey, I was going to have an oil sample taken, except the owner had conveniently just performed an oil change. Wasn't sure it would be much good at that point.
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Old 24-09-2019, 08:28   #9
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Quote:
Originally Posted by Froggy Seas View Post
Thanks, tkeithlu,

Appreciate the advice.

engine: I did have a certified yanmar mechanic look at the engine. He spent 1.5 hours surveying it and he stopped at the point where he said he definitely recommends a compression test. He guessed it could be as easy as injectors and pump (?), but didn't want to speculate. He was not impressed with engine access, and said if I did need/want to repower, he would not entertain a rebuild - he would replace. He estimated under $30k for replacement given the location of engine, but said there could be up to $10k of carpentry needed to get to it.

teak decks: They are slivered up around the jib sheet tracks, and the teak is well below the rubber strips. other than that, i listed it as the hot item because i've always read teak usually needs to be replaced between 25-30yrs, and is never a straight forward job, especially with the screwed down decks. I got quotes from different yards up and down the east coast, ranging from $20k - $100K (guess which was the quote from Annapolis), and that range took me by surprise.
The only proper way to remove teak entirely is to remove all deck hardware, strip the teak, remove all teak screws, fill holes, glass over completely, fair and Awlgrip with non skid. If you don’t glass over, the screw hole filler will pop and leak. That is the estimate to ask for in pricing. This can be done in Trinidad for around half of US costs, FYI.

Blister hull is a peel. Pricing for that is straight forward.
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Old 24-09-2019, 08:52   #10
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

As others have said it's not enough info. For example we don't know if only one boat has teak decks or all three. Or if one of them has been repowered or if one has had an osmosis treatment done. Or what the price difference is between them and how long you plan to keep the boat.
1. Engine: if all of the boats have original engines and you plan to keep the boat for a while you will be confronted with a repower someday regardless of wich you choose.
2. Deck: I think all Taswells have balsa cored deks. Regardless of teak or no teak this could become a problem if fittings were not installed correctly.
3. Blisters. If none of the boats have been treated already it's a 50:50 chance the others will get it to.

A repower now saves you trouble for years to come. Same for deck and osmosis. So wich one is cheapest and wich one do you like best?
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Old 24-09-2019, 09:26   #11
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Go with the blister boat. It’s a known commodity and as you see here there are lots of opinions on blisters.
I also have a Taiwanese boat with blisters. Remember a boat has never sunk due to blisters and they are almost always cosmetic. Grind one out as part of the offer and inspect if it’s under the gelcoat or between the mat and weave.
I have compiled research I can point you to for my own project and am willing to talk about my experience if you are interested. PM me.
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Old 24-09-2019, 09:30   #12
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Thanks Rumpi, let me add some info...
I plan to keep the boat for 3-5 yrs; liveaboard; full time cruising for at least first 6 months. Will probably sell it before I deploy next. It's just me and my girlfriend at this point, but we like hosting friends.

teak deck boat: 1990 49'; 5200 hrs on original engine, no repower; upgraded electronics; electric stove NO propane lockers; 2500 hrs on genset; awlgripped in 2012; nothing known on state of hull beyond that; all other systems upgraded- batteries/solar/chargers/AC; standing rigging 2014; inmast, sails ~10yrs old; 12v refrig; solar

engine boat: 1992 43'; 8200+ hrs engine, original no repower; 2500 hrs genset; original nonskid decks; awlgripped 2014; in-boom furling; 110 refrig; old electronics; wet batteries; arch

blisters: 1992 49'; less than 1400 original hours; 800 hrs original genset; no teak decks; hull was blasted and barrier coated in 2014, but now has the blisters; electronics and upgrades rate somewhere between the other two boats.
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Old 24-09-2019, 09:38   #13
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Other things equal, if the blister hull is otherwise sound, repairs is easy and known. No intrusion to the interior. It sounds like it has the youngest engine. It may be the best resale when you are done.

Have a survey?

I had massive blisters on our 1982 Camper. The rudder was junk as well. Photos on this site. If you get into a big glass project give me a PM. I’d be happy to share experience.
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Old 24-09-2019, 10:08   #14
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

OK, I think I spoke to soon on the blisters. You can determine whether it is serious or just gelcoat, and whether you can do it yourself. The other two jobs will require professional help and could be very expensive. So, you know that the teak job is a killer. But, it might still be the case that the engine is OK, based on what happens in a compression test. If the engine is OK, you could get the whole thing at purchase price, if not, then it's the blisters to evaluate, and probably get out your sander and respirator.

How do you feel about itchy fiberglass in your skin?

Who the @##$% built a boat with an engine that takes major surgery to get out, or for that matter, get to?
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Old 24-09-2019, 11:00   #15
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Re: Repower, Old Teak Decks, or Dry Blisters

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suijin View Post
Kinda hard to say without more info. But based on what you provided I would take the blister boat in terms of cost/time of repair. Assuming these are all below the waterline it's fairly straightforward to grind them out, fill and fair, barrier coat and paint. All stuff you can do yourself with a little research. First boat may require repowering. Second boat...stripping off a teak deck and refinishing is a long tedious job.

#3 - I wholeheartedly agree! I love teak decks! I now love them only on someone else's boat! My new opinion after recently stripping teak and repairing the core of my teak deck -- never again!

Between my last three boats, I have repaired hundreds of below the waterline blisters, it's no big deal. Just as Suijin explains, grind, fill, fair, barrier coat, paint.

AND, I've never seen a dry blister below the waterline, that's a new one. well, one exception and that was on a boat that was close to another boat on fire in the yard.
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