Transom Steps on Catamarans

[Sand crab]

Originally Posted by markpierce

these boats look suitable for enclosed bays and lakes. can't imagine them doing well in serious following seas.

The South African cats cross the Atlantic immediately after being built
The French cats, ditto
The Australian cats, Pacific or Indian
The rest of them from wherever to wherever then they all go wherever and hve done it for decades.
So how did all these crews survive if they are only for enclosed bays and lakes? BOB

[Lagoon4us]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

The South African cats cross the Atlantic immediately after being built
The French cats, ditto
The Australian cats, Pacific or Indian
The rest of them from wherever to wherever then they all go wherever and hve done it for decades.
So how did all these crews survive if they are only for enclosed bays and lakes? BOB

Sugar scoops like them are getting a little silly, seems there is an importance on who can come up with the grandest set of back stairs.
I will say i've never had a following sea issue on any modern boat other than when my dinghy nearly swamps when the motor suddenly dies.
I'd think that todays modern cat wouldn't see too many following sea issues as that's not a point of sail often used.
Cheers Frank

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

The South African cats cross the Atlantic immediately after being built
The French cats, ditto
The Australian cats, Pacific or Indian
The rest of them from wherever to wherever then they all go wherever and hve done it for decades.
So how did all these crews survive if they are only for enclosed bays and lakes? BOB

(falling down laughing)

This thread has been all over the place. OBVIOUSLY they work.

I've got a small cat and the transom steps are one of her best features. My wife would have a great deal of difficulty boarding without them (knee replacement).

Yup, railings are good; too many boats are shot on them.

Following seas? I just haven't had the problem. I suspect as long as they are open on one side the issue is overstated. And who is kidding whom; it's a very limited number of boats that spend much or their lives on serious crossings. If that were my intent, I would opt for a moderate step design.

[Cheechako]

The only downside of the transom engine configuration is that it means you must have sail drives. And the transom gets fatter to prevent squatting under load (hence the lovely boat show steps). On the other hand, it puts the engines where they belong, in a dedicated engine compartment. It's a pretty reasonable compromise.
Actually mine have V drives with shaft logs and max props......

[s/v Jedi]

I like the one with the very big/long lower step best. This allows you to pull a (unconscious) MOB back aboard. The lower the better and the more room on it the better. Same for more fun things like cleaning fish, scuba diving etc.

For handholds... how about integrated in an arch? We have separate hand holds on the stern (mainly for MOB). You need to try climbing aboard to find out how and where you need handholds. Same for the person helping you out. You can't just look at the stern and decide, practical tests are needed.

cheers,
Nick.

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I like the one with the very big/long lower step best. This allows you to pull a (unconscious) MOB back aboard. The lower the better and the more room on it the better. Same for more fun things like cleaning fish, scuba diving etc.

Heres a nice set
Good spot to park a dinghy on the inside as well

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I like the one with the very big/long lower step best. This allows you to pull a (unconscious) MOB back aboard. The lower the better and the more room on it the better. Same for more fun things like cleaning fish, scuba diving etc.

For handholds... how about integrated in an arch? We have separate hand holds on the stern (mainly for MOB). You need to try climbing aboard to find out how and where you need handholds. Same for the person helping you out. You can't just look at the stern and decide, practical tests are needed.

cheers,
Nick.

Good point on the fish cleaning. Nothing better than those aft steps. Just hose off the blood when you're done!

[Southern Star]

Actually, I think there is still an argument to be made for having the diesels, charging systems, etc. accessed from the interior. Yes, access from the aft steps/deck is perfect in harbour (albeit the accessibility is generally less than from under an aft berth). However, I would not want to be bleeding or servicing diesels from the aft steps while underway in any conditions apart from a sunny day in the doldrums.

Why would you need to service the diesels when underway? Firstly, in boisterous conditions the motion of the boat is far more apt to stir up injector plugging sediment, or to create air locks in the fuel lines from fuel sloshing about in partially filled tanks. To suggest that this would only plague one of the diesels is just not so. Indeed, those who have needed to bleed a diesel when underway (hands up!) can tell you that even after an initial bleeding, it is not uncommon to have to repeat the procedure again almost immediately.

Secondly, if you do want to make use of your diesels in heavy conditions to assist in making harbour before a storm sets in, or to get away from a lee shore before it worsens, etc., you will obviously be better off with the thrust of both diesels, rather than one. Heck, even if you have just decided to use 'The Gentlemen's Guide' approach to the 'thorny path' in the Caribbean by motorsailing at night, you might still need to service/check fluid levels of the diesels etc. while underway.

Apart from the risk of losing tools, or worse - of being thrown or washed overboard, you must also consider the risk of spray, or rain soaking the starter motor, alternator, voltage regulators, etc. In addition, the increased motion of the boat towards the ends and the smaller access openings increase the risk of injury to the mechanic. Frankly, I think it is kind of hard to beat sitting down on the interior bridgedeck with your legs down by the diesel in the hull, assisted by overhead lighting and having complete 360 degree access to the diesel, saildrive, cooling system, exhaust system, fuel filters etc. I have no fear of servicing my diesels when underway, regardless of the conditions. It may be that I will never have to do it again in boisterous conditions, but if I do I will not have the safety concerns that I would with an aft exterior access.

Brad

[Southern Star]

Cat man do you are right - a brilliant looking arrangment. Not that it is in my current 'snack bracket', but what kind of boat is it?

Brad

[Southern Star]

Nick, my current boat was 13 years old when I bought it and yes, there was sediment in the tanks. After a flush I am hopeful that the problem is alleviated, but hey - I'm just a weekend warrior, right? Also, I don't need extensions? That is a different thread, but nevertheless, based upon your extensive experience in catamarans I appreciate your opinion, even if it is thread drift.

Cheers!

Brad

[44'cruisingcat]

Originally Posted by Southern Star

Nick, my current boat was 13 years old when I bought it and yes, there was sediment in the tanks. After a flush I am hopeful that the problem is alleviated, but hey - I'm just a weekend warrior, right? Also, I don't need extensions? That is a different thread, but nevertheless, based upon your extensive experience in catamarans I appreciate your opinion, even if it is thread drift.

Cheers!

Brad

You're a weekend warrior because your 13 year old boat had sediment in it's fuel tanks, and I don't live aboard because nobody bought my lawn mower... I think that's logical to people who believe that several tonnes of lead will keep their boat afloat?

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by 44'cruisingcat

You're a weekend warrior because your 13 year old boat had sediment in it's fuel tanks, and I don't live aboard because nobody bought my lawn mower... I think that's logical to people who believe that several tonnes of lead will keep their boat afloat?

Difficult to let that go huh. But if I can, surely you can do too
I did not mean anything mean with the remark by the way... acting like if I did does not make it so

Now, this is the cruisers forum, so please pardon me when I make a little fun of weekend warriors now and then. I was one for 30 years myself, from age 8-38 to be exact.

What I mean is that I can find very little reason for weekend warriors to extend the hulls of their cats. You're not carrying that load of solar panels, the huge dinghy with large outboard, nor crossing oceans where you need extra waterline length etc. I might overlook some important reason so please let me know when that is the case.

For sediment: any -serious- -full- -time- cruiser who has had this trouble, make damn sure it never happens again. Fuel gets filtered before it enters the tanks or it gets polished regularly. Also, inspection lids are made or taps in sumps to check and drain any sediment, water etc. This is just the way it is, and it makes no sense at all for boat owners who also have a house and job and only sail at weekends and vacations.... because it is too much involved for that style of sailing.

For anybody seriously interested in solid fuel management, I have been involved with that more than I wished for, and designed a fuel system that meets almost every item on my wish list. The only thing I couldn't easily do is make a day tank with gravity feed. Here is the information: A new fuel system for Jedi (English) - s/v Jedi

ciao!
Nick.

[downunder]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

For anybody seriously interested in solid fuel management, I have been involved with that more than I wished for, and designed a fuel system that meets almost every item on my wish list. The only thing I couldn't easily do is make a day tank with gravity feed. Here is the information: A new fuel system for Jedi (English) - s/v Jedi

ciao!
Nick.

I had just been looking at your fuel system just yesterday. Getting it right together with electrical systems are two of the big ones regarding vessel systems.

This is a stern design I like with strategically placed handholds.



Cheers

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by downunder

I had just been looking at your fuel system just yesterday. Getting it right together with electrical systems are two of the big ones regarding vessel systems.

This is a stern design I like with strategically placed handholds.

Thank you, the system is still performing like the day I finished building it. I have not found one single thing I miss and everybody that used my design reports success I did understand that the type of pump I used isn't available anymore, but replacement should be easy to find. Make sure maximum pressure on it's output is 7 psi or so. Filters are mostly designed for vacuum operation instead of pressurized, but a Racor can take 15 psi so stay well under that.

I like your railing design. I see that often and it works well while keeping it elegant. I do not like walls along the steps like on an earlier photo posted in the thread. It takes away all the space too.

ciao!
Nick.

[Lagoon4us]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Difficult to let that go huh. But if I can, surely you can do too
I did not mean anything mean with the remark by the way... acting like if I did does not make it so

Now, this is the cruisers forum, so please pardon me when I make a little fun of weekend warriors now and then. I was one for 30 years myself, from age 8-38 to be exact.

What I mean is that I can find very little reason for weekend warriors to extend the hulls of their cats. You're not carrying that load of solar panels, the huge dinghy with large outboard, nor crossing oceans where you need extra waterline length etc. I might overlook some important reason so please let me know when that is the case.

For sediment: any -serious- -full- -time- cruiser who has had this trouble, make damn sure it never happens again. Fuel gets filtered before it enters the tanks or it gets polished regularly. Also, inspection lids are made or taps in sumps to check and drain any sediment, water etc. This is just the way it is, and it makes no sense at all for boat owners who also have a house and job and only sail at weekends and vacations.... because it is too much involved for that style of sailing.

For anybody seriously interested in solid fuel management, I have been involved with that more than I wished for, and designed a fuel system that meets almost every item on my wish list. The only thing I couldn't easily do is make a day tank with gravity feed. Here is the information: A new fuel system for Jedi (English) - s/v Jedi

ciao!
Nick.

Checked out your fuel system diagram, one possible improvement is to add a small pressure pump after the supply manifold, it can serve two purposes 1st a back up should the engines system fail and more importantly a method to bleed the system from the engine room without having to bump the engine over.
The pump has a switch in the engine room in a handy position.