Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 21-02-2017, 14:32   #91
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Winter Germany, Summer Med
Boat: Lagoon 380 S2
Posts: 1,916
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

The last time we had that kind of weather I was wet and miserable at the helm and wife & kids were enjoying a nice warm salon and playing cards.
rabbi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 16:18   #92
Registered User
 
Bigjim's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Waukegan, IL
Boat: Columbia 10.7
Posts: 670
Images: 120
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
If he and his family have fun with a trailer sailer (easily portable to different destinations, no berthing fees, at home on the trailer for maintenance, low initial cost), then the road is paved with their pleasure and their learning to go bigger and farther.

That is why I suggested Jarsy break it down into more, but more easily attainable goals, so that they will have useable experience in back of them when they strike the PNW gales on their way south.

Ann
I agree. But the comment was to get a dingy. My suggestion is to make it a slightly larger model; one you could actually sleep on. That's all I'm saying. There are lots of used 20 footers out there that come with a cuddy cabin big enough for a night or two. I had a centerboard O'Day Mariner which I used all over the midwest and even on Lake Michigan. We slept on it frequently.

My concern is that a dingy or similar type is very tippy. Dumping the kids and the wife in the water may be counterproductive.
Bigjim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 16:24   #93
Moderator
 
JPA Cate's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: aboard, cruising in Australia
Boat: Sayer 46' Solent rig sloop
Posts: 28,400
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

We're probably just nibbling at details, here. Jim and his first family (2 adults, 2 kids) did
sleep on their boat during their two week holiday having sailed the Cat 22 from Pt. Townsend to Canada. My post that you quoted said "a trailer sailer", and I failed to specify what I had in mind until a later post. My bad.

I completely agree that 'dumping the kids and the wife in the water may be counter productive', especially in the far north in winter!

Ann
__________________
Who scorns the calm has forgotten the storm.
JPA Cate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 16:54   #94
Registered User
 
Bigjim's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Waukegan, IL
Boat: Columbia 10.7
Posts: 670
Images: 120
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
I completely agree that 'dumping the kids and the wife in the water may be counter productive', especially in the far north in winter!

Ann
Actually, dumping them in the winter would be so bad. All the water is ice right now. :big grin:

Once it melts, definitely bad.

I like the idea of starting somewhere close and warm. Lots of boats for sale in Florida. Lots of islands nearby.
Bigjim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 19:29   #95
Moderator

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,174
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

I've hesitated to come in on this one, but - yes - the point cannot be made too strongly that one man's "fun" is another (wo)man's agony!

For a very high proportion families I've had aboard, doing "crooz'n'lerns" for an accredited sailing school, the woman was only there to jollify the man. She had no particular interest in sailing, but saw her presence and grudging participation in the course work, as something she "owed to her man" - for whatever reason that I was never crass enuff to ask about, or even to allude to.

Once the maternal instinct gets prodded by the need to protect little ones from harm, real or imaginary, the on-board psychology becomes very problematic indeed. Once the little ones begin to vomit and soil their nickers, the psychology becomes impossible. And then it is all, conclusively and irremediably, the man's fault for having subjected the family to such agony and danger just to gratify his own incomprehensible ego. Yet, whether the man is the skipper or merely a student he is at where he is at, geographically, and skipper has to carry on. Or turn back. Conditions notwithstanding. Either way you are hours or even days from terra firma and the safety and surcease she offers.

I have related before that MyBeloved is "unteachable" in a formal sense because she reacts very strongly to any imposition of formal authority. But as we all know, formal, autocratic authority is the ONLY way to handle it when the fit hits the shan at sea. I've had to adapt my teaching style and my skippering style in the recognition that, ultimately, MyBeloved matters more to me than the boat or any fun I (moi, moi-même) can have with it.

If the adaptations I've made to ME are good, purposeful and successful, I can keep them both :-)

All the best to all of you, but particularly to those newbs who come here asking for counsel.

TrentePieds
TrentePieds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 20:13   #96
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Port Phillip Bay
Boat: Etap 37 S
Posts: 183
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Update from someone with 5 weeks left until we cast off.

The Venn diagram of conditions that make me happy to sail in, and conditions that make my family happy to sail in has a very small area of overlap. This means that for all of us there is an expectation that we will only enjoy a minority of the actual sailing experience.
Moli really powers up in the 15 to 25 knot range with full sails up - So this is the range where no. 1 son (10 YO) gets happiest.
At 8 knots we ghost along at 4 knots and keep her pretty flat - This is where the 8 YO daughter is happiest.
10 to 15 knots we are sailing comfortably, especially downwind, and this is where my wife actually enjoys the sailing. Especially if it's sunny.
All of the above has been inside a big bay with no swell. I can't wait to get out into the long ocean swells - That will make me happy. Except if I'm worried about others getting seasick / nervous / not having fun.

So we are all moving to the view that the sailing periods are going to be mostly work, with the odd period of enjoyment thrown in. It also means accepting that we are going to be lots more cautious with the weather than I'm used to, and that we will probably motor more than I'd like. (I LOVE the moment when we turn the engine off and have the relative silence).

We have all developed a mistrust in our Delta anchor - it seems to only set well in bottoms that are so soft that it drags at full throttle reverse. So we're buying more chain and a third (Bigger, newer anchor).
We have got better at handling the boat - my wife can comfortably sail, tack, gybe in 15 to 20 knots without me, put in first and second reefs etc. But that has only moved the nervousness along a step. Stuff that goes wrong still mostly depends on me, and my wife is still worried that she could not get back to me if I fall overboard in more than 15 ish knots. I need to learn to wear a harness and slow down, break the habits of being fore deck crew on racing boats.

We have also spent / and are spending a lot more than expected in setting up the 'house' side of the boat. Upgrading solar / batteries / holding tank / boat covers is taking a heap of time, and doesn't tick the 'fun' button for me. Luckily money isn't a big problem, but I like doing stuff myself so I can fix it later, which takes time.

So what have I learnt?
Just learning how to sail is only a very small part of the overall work - but it is also a massive hurdle for someone new to sailing to get over.
Learning how to cruise, and how to set the boat up as a house is a lot of work for someone used to hot bunking in a race for a few days, then getting drunk on land. (I'd say my learning curve in this area has been at least as great as my wife's learn to sail journey.)
There is no substitute to getting out and doing stuff, then coming back and talking and reading about what went on. "Why did you put more backstay on?" "Why did we accidentally gybe?" "How do you know how high to point" "How do you tell if the anchor is set" "Why can't we watch TV if the battery voltage is at 12.0?" "Why won't the toilet flush"

Mike
MLOI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 21:56   #97
Registered User
 
SV Windrush II's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Somewhere in the Philippines
Boat: Mariner 40 Ketch
Posts: 531
Images: 18
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Quote:
Originally Posted by MLOI View Post
Update from someone with 5 weeks left until we cast off.

The Venn diagram of conditions that make me happy to sail in, and conditions that make my family happy to sail in has a very small area of overlap. This means that for all of us there is an expectation that we will only enjoy a minority of the actual sailing experience.
Moli really powers up in the 15 to 25 knot range with full sails up - So this is the range where no. 1 son (10 YO) gets happiest.
Mike
Mike, sounds like you are off to a great start. Just a few things I will add

Anything over about 21 knots offshore equals building seas and the nice rolling swell turns more steep and usually not the same direction as the wind waves or wind.
Anything over 24 knots usually starts tossing my full keel 40 footer around especially down wind in a confused sea.

So what may be fun in the bay with the same wind offshore could be just hanging on so you don't get thrown around.

Just my 2 pennies
__________________
Fair Winds to all
SV Windrush II is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 22:23   #98
Registered User

Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 673
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

I sail a 38 footer in the Med and a 12 foot dinghy back home. Two very different experiences. OK they both have sails and tell tales on the sails but that's about where it stops. tacking a dinghy is a scrambling, crawling, grunting thing and can lead to a tipover. Tacking the big boat is textbook classic and an exciting challenge. On the dinghy you hold the sheets with two fingers on the big boat, it's hauling, winching and trimming, great stuff. On the big boat I sit on the rail when the autopilot's on, but on the dinghy I've yet to manage the heeling by planking over the side as I try to manage the tiller and mainsheet. Both boats are a heck of a lot of fun but are not the same experience. I wonder whether dinghy sailing is the best way to start. Maybe some skippered charters then bareboat might be a better way to start.
dlymn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 23:14   #99
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Port Phillip Bay
Boat: Etap 37 S
Posts: 183
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Quote:
Originally Posted by SV Windrush II View Post

So what may be fun in the bay with the same wind offshore could be just hanging on so you don't get thrown around.

Just my 2 pennies
Agree completely.

I've joked with a few mates that conditions I find fun on a race boat with full crew where someone else is paying the bills suddenly are not fun at all with the family. I've had a couple of moments of having a ball surfing with spray flying around, only to realise that the family is huddled together looking unhappy. Not good management on my part. (But it did motivate us to practice reefing the main downwind.)

We won't be heading out into Bass Strait if there is anything more than 20 knots forecast, probably 10 or less. Back of a low with wind and seas dropping.

Mike
MLOI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 23:21   #100
Registered User
 
markpierce's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Central California
Boat: M/V Carquinez Coot
Posts: 3,782
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Lah dee dah!

__________________
Kar-KEEN-ez Koot
markpierce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2017, 23:24   #101
Registered User
 
markpierce's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Central California
Boat: M/V Carquinez Coot
Posts: 3,782
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Quote:
Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
Lah dee dah!

Ran across the above sculpture after berthing on Treasure Island.

(Sorry for the almost duplicate post.)
__________________
Kar-KEEN-ez Koot
markpierce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-08-2017, 15:37   #102
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 13
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
Welcome Aboard CF Jarsy!

Every person here has a dream or did. Yours is not uncommon, so you will find lots of company and help here.

Good luck pursuing your dream and I hope you enjoy your time in CF too.

I will send you (or anyone who asks) a Private Message with some of my favorite tips on quickly finding some answers in CF.
I would really
and tips/advise you can share Thanks Much
Chubs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-08-2017, 16:03   #103
Registered User

Join Date: May 2017
Location: Scotland
Posts: 873
Re: To live a dream? No experience sailing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarsy View Post
Wow, of course she is onboard, sounds like someone has been a victim of a midlife crisis. Save your negativity
I think it would have been prudent to at least ask the question and then wait for the reply before assuming that the wife has not been consulted and / or is not fully supportive of this planed venture or to assume some sort of deep lying reason that the guy wants away or out of anything .
Cherod is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
enc, sail, sailing

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
a dream within a dream about sailboat SURV69 Flotsam & Sailing Miscellany 2 23-02-2015 15:20
I Want to Live the Sailing Dream AreMS Meets & Greets 2 02-03-2012 17:01
Living the Dream . . . Sad, Sad Dream ! otherthan General Sailing Forum 10 30-07-2011 15:08
Beginning to Live the Dream Gadagirl Meets & Greets 36 22-07-2010 15:11
Ready to live the dream lizzieandfrank Meets & Greets 5 16-12-2008 20:43

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 19:20.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.