Cheap Multis and Projects

[2gr8escape]

Sea wind 24' for under $5000.


24' Seawind Catamaran - PRICE SLASHED - AGAIN

[brownoarsman]

Here's a 1976, outboard-powered Gemini in Alabama what needs a fair bit of work ... but the issues seem to be neglect on the hard rather than damage:

1976 Performance Cruising Gemini sailboat for sale in Alabama

[Cherise]

Gemini 3000 & 3200 - has anyone here owned one or inspected one? I posted a thread asking if anyone had and if they knew if the build quality was stronger/stouter than the 105s. Thicker hull, sole or bulkhead?
Thanks guys and gals!

Sent from my SGH-T999L using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Therapy]

Originally Posted by Cherise

Gemini 3000 & 3200 - has anyone here owned one or inspected one? I posted a thread asking if anyone had and if they knew if the build quality was stronger/stouter than the 105s. Thicker hull, sole or bulkhead?
Thanks guys and gals!

Sent from my SGH-T999L using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

Real help and information -
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Gemini_Cats/info

They used to allow non-owning interested parties to join. I have not participated since I sold my 105Mc so don't know current rules.
There is everything you could ever think to ask answered there. And then some.

[purvisgs]

searunner 40 in ca Trimaran - Searunner 40

podcat 36 project in ca 36' PODCAT Catamaran

50' house barge tri or? in bay area ** 1980 Trimaran 50 ft long by 26 ft wide Good Operating Condition

[snort]

Another trimaran: Horstman Tristar 27.9 Trimaran

Asking price=$5K

[clockwork orange]

Originally Posted by Cherise

Gemini 3000 & 3200 - has anyone here owned one or inspected one? I posted a thread asking if anyone had and if they knew if the build quality was stronger/stouter than the 105s. Thicker hull, sole or bulkhead?
Thanks guys and gals!

Sent from my SGH-T999L using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

I own a 1988 Gemini 3000 which I bought as a project which is ongoing. When I purchased it, it was missing its rig and had been sitting for many years. I did several trips to work on it to make it seaworthy and then,along with a group of friends we delivered it from CT to MN on its own bottom, a great 32 day 1500 mile trip with zero issues. I have since purchased a complete rig from a 3200 which I am installing. I am a boat builder by trade and have been further into the bowels of this thing than most typical boat owners so I feel I am more than qualified to comment on at least the 3000.
It is true that the 3000 has the most bridge deck clearance, I had the opportunity to spend some time in a yard in Florida where at least one of every model was hauled out so I measured the clearances from the bridge deck to the scum line, not the waterline but where the boat actually floats and
found that every model got less clearance to the point that one that we have in our marina, one of the last built by Hunter has only 5". The build quality is very poor, nothing is tabbed in properly, there are only 2 locations on the 3000 where you can block the boat on the hard and because the forward location is a long way forward they often get blocked in the wrong place an the boat is not strong enough for this, consequently they tend to get broken under the shower pan and the stbd stateroom sole and this was the case with mine which I had to repair. There was evidence of poorly repaired prior damage also and I have seen this same damage on several others. I have since repaired mine properly but the laminate was so resin rich that I actually had to chip out a lot of pooled resin to get to the glass to repair it. There are so many poorly built areas in this boat that you probably wonder why I bought it but I got it cheap and they do have some very good features as long as you don't expect too much, the biggest plus and the single reason why the are desirable is the 14ft beam. Its overall dimension just work well for a lot of people, they are a great platform to live and travel on. If you are in the market for one I personally like the 3200, I would not want the diesel, the outboard works very well on these boats, the diesel setup has been troublesome for a lot of folks, we only have a couple of 105s on lake superior, one has been converted to an outboard and the other hunter built one has been nothing but trouble. At some point in the early years of the 105s they switched from symmetrical plywood centerboards to asymmetrical foam/glass boards, the assymetrical boards are a bad idea on this type of cat and while the foam/ glass boards should be a big improvement but unfortunately they too are poorly built, we have the boards from the Hunter built boat in our shop right now cut open and its shocking how bad they are, they are very unfair and the foam is not proper structural foam but rather non structural, low density buoyancy foam which is of course wet and on one of them they didn't even mix enough so it didn't fill the whole space. Its going to cost a lot to fix and the owner is going after the builder. While the 105s are a lot nicer than the older boats many of the construction details are no better. An example would be the chainplates which are the same as the older boats where, notably they purchased off the shelf shaeffer strap chainplates which in themselves are properly engineered but then the builder, rather than buy the 1 1/2" straps with the 1/2" pin hole buy the 1/4" strap and then drill the 3/8" hole out, thereby reducing the safety factor down to almost zero.

Steve.

[clockwork orange]

Originally Posted by brownoarsman

Here's a 1976, outboard-powered Gemini in Alabama what needs a fair bit of work ... but the issues seem to be neglect on the hard rather than damage:

1976 Performance Cruising Gemini sailboat for sale in Alabama

Just so folks know, this is not a 1976 boat, it is a 3200. I own a 1988 Gemini 3000 and the 3200 was the next itteration, it is probably a 1989 - 1992 I think. Although the 3000 and 3200 look a lot the same the 3200 has a taller double spreader rig which you can see in the photos. I may have seen this boat if its in a yard in Demopolis.

Steve.

[mkriley]

Originally Posted by snort

Another trimaran: Horstman Tristar 27.9 Trimaran

Asking price=$5K

have any more info as listing is gone
thanks
mike

[Cherise]

Originally Posted by clockwork orange

I own a 1988 Gemini 3000 which I bought as a project which is ongoing. When I purchased it, it was missing its rig and had been sitting for many years. I did several trips to work on it to make it seaworthy and then,along with a group of friends we delivered it from CT to MN on its own bottom, a great 32 day 1500 mile trip with zero issues. I have since purchased a complete rig from a 3200 which I am installing. I am a boat builder by trade and have been further into the bowels of this thing than most typical boat owners so I feel I am more than qualified to comment on at least the 3000.
It is true that the 3000 has the most bridge deck clearance, I had the opportunity to spend some time in a yard in Florida where at least one of every model was hauled out so I measured the clearances from the bridge deck to the scum line, not the waterline but where the boat actually floats and
found that every model got less clearance to the point that one that we have in our marina, one of the last built by Hunter has only 5". The build quality is very poor, nothing is tabbed in properly, there are only 2 locations on the 3000 where you can block the boat on the hard and because the forward location is a long way forward they often get blocked in the wrong place an the boat is not strong enough for this, consequently they tend to get broken under the shower pan and the stbd stateroom sole and this was the case with mine which I had to repair. There was evidence of poorly repaired prior damage also and I have seen this same damage on several others. I have since repaired mine properly but the laminate was so resin rich that I actually had to chip out a lot of pooled resin to get to the glass to repair it. There are so many poorly built areas in this boat that you probably wonder why I bought it but I got it cheap and they do have some very good features as long as you don't expect too much, the biggest plus and the single reason why the are desirable is the 14ft beam. Its overall dimension just work well for a lot of people, they are a great platform to live and travel on. If you are in the market for one I personally like the 3200, I would not want the diesel, the outboard works very well on these boats, the diesel setup has been troublesome for a lot of folks, we only have a couple of 105s on lake superior, one has been converted to an outboard and the other hunter built one has been nothing but trouble. At some point in the early years of the 105s they switched from symmetrical plywood centerboards to asymmetrical foam/glass boards, the assymetrical boards are a bad idea on this type of cat and while the foam/ glass boards should be a big improvement but unfortunately they too are poorly built, we have the boards from the Hunter built boat in our shop right now cut open and its shocking how bad they are, they are very unfair and the foam is not proper structural foam but rather non structural, low density buoyancy foam which is of course wet and on one of them they didn't even mix enough so it didn't fill the whole space. Its going to cost a lot to fix and the owner is going after the builder. While the 105s are a lot nicer than the older boats many of the construction details are no better. An example would be the chainplates which are the same as the older boats where, notably they purchased off the shelf shaeffer strap chainplates which in themselves are properly engineered but then the builder, rather than buy the 1 1/2" straps with the 1/2" pin hole buy the 1/4" strap and then drill the 3/8" hole out, thereby reducing the safety factor down to almost zero.

Steve.

Steve, thank you, this is just what I was looking for!
My partner is in the same trade. This might be why you bought the boat, knowing you could strengthen a weakly built project?

We know how one can properly rebuild or reinforce but there is a line there where it just doesn't make sense. No doubt different for each restorer. It definitely sounds like you are doing an excellent job.

We agree with you about ob's. That 3200 for sale on the hard with two side by side looks ideal to me.
That passage you did surely had some nasty weather, what kind of wx did you have and did you and your crew feel safe as well as comfortable?
Do you think all gem models have the same hull thickness?
I totally believe the shotty quality of the boards. That Hunter for ya!
Speaking of them, that is the case I am hoping for with the Gems. Everyone knows the 80's hunters were of better build quality versus 90's to now. Would you say that is a good comparison go the 3000/3200s versus new model?
Oh and when we saw the Legacy we laughed so hard, that bridgedeck clearance, what were they thinking really???!!!

Thanks for sharing about the chainplates. This is exactly the kind of example we are looking for to help our friend beef up his 105.

Last question, you touched on it at the end. If I walked on a 3000's deck, cockpit, below, it would feel as flimsy (movement beneath) as a 105?

Again, Muchos Gracias!

Sent from my SGH-T999L using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Therapy]

Originally Posted by Cherise

That Hunter for ya!
Speaking of them, that is the case I am hoping for with the Gems. Everyone knows the 80's hunters were of better build quality versus 90's to now.


Sent from my SGH-T999L using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

Hunter only recently got rights to build the Gemini. Somewhere around hull 1060 something I think.
It was always a "price point" boat. Always.
But how many other builders built 1000 boats?

[clockwork orange]

Originally Posted by Therapy

Hunter only recently got rights to build the Gemini. Somewhere around hull 1060 something I think.
It was always a "price point" boat. Always.
But how many other builders built 1000 boats?

I don't know how many 105s were built by Hunter, not many I expect as I believe they are now built by Catalina. To be honest I was fully expecting the hunter built one to be a lot better than the original builder but its not. Hopefully Catalina will do a better job. Geminis have always had lots of gelcoat cracking in the deck moldings while Catalina has a better than average record in this area so lets hope.
!000 + boats is a fantastic production run, the single reason for getting there is the dimensions, there are a few other cats in this under 35ft length class but most don't fit in a regular slip so cost of ownership is higher.The Gem hits the sweet spot.

[snort]

Originally Posted by mkriley

have any more info as listing is gone
thanks
mike

I could only find this: Trimaran california For sale - Yakaz

A site that tracks deals on other sites such as craigslist.

[paxfish]

Originally Posted by Cherise

That Hunter for ya!
Speaking of them, that is the case I am hoping for with the Gems. Everyone knows the 80's hunters were of better build quality versus 90's to now.

Everybody was bitchin' about Hunters back in the 80's also....

[Cherise]

Originally Posted by paxfish

Everybody was bitchin' about Hunters back in the 80's also....

I bet. I am simply stating the facts that the build quality was better, to Hunters standards, in the 80s vs later decades.

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