Beneteau Excess Catamarans Launched

[Training Wheels]

Good catch! That would make it about 26.

[mikedefieslife]

Took another look at the photos of this.

The fridge is in a very strange place, half over the steps down into the hull, so you have to lean over to get access to it.

The cooker seems to half foul the area you'd want to use to get at the sink.

The good thing is at least it doesn't seem to have one of those tiny sinks made even smaller by being split into two. Nor does it have the daft curved seating that many catamarans have.

I'd definitely want it to come with built in motorised blinds/shutters. Dealing with all that window area would be a real everyday pain otherwise. Especially as some aren't easy to reach.

That retractable roof feature like on the Moody 54DS limits area available for solar. In any sunny cruising area it's going to permanently closed anyhow.

The rear helm stations are no different from a mono. Again very similar to a Moody 54DS. In my limited experience catamaran owners aren't interested in the feel of nature on their faces. Especially long term cruisers and liveaboards.

Otherwise, I can't see it being worse, better than the larger offerings from Lagoon. I'm sure it will charter very well.

[KayZee]

Originally Posted by Gin-N-Sonic

They do, but only 50 ft+ I'm trying to see if there is a sub 50 footer being offered with galley down.

Worst case scenario, I'll just have to go 50+ or perhaps a tear down and refit on a good hull.

Antares 44 has galley down but you have to go to Argentina to get one or have it shipped.


Kurt

[sv Stella Maris]

Lagoon 450F owner here. Just had my first real ‘heavy’ squall up in the flybridge in the middle of the night.

Not sure how it would have been so close to the waves and no good protection.

Lagoon (Excess) used to make these stern helms. I just sailed with one in the Taboago Cays. A Lagoon 57; about 4 generations old I think. Beautiful strong boat.

Whoever thinks Lagoon/Excess can’t do performance haven’t spent much time aboard. I’m sailing with 5 other boats and take them all with my ‘fat’ floating house.

Just the other day though I craved an outboard chair and tiller for a bit of sport like the Outremer; by far my favorite performance production cat I have been aboard...but not plausible with my six kids and under a million budget.

I’m very eager for this line to do well and continue to push high strength and quality boats to new limits...and safely too.

Oh, and very happy they opted against dagger boards.

I can’t wait to buy a 2 year old 15 from a de-romanticized owner or finished cruiser! Take no options please future owner: more simple equals more better!!!

[CatNewBee]

Hi Stella Maris,

Thank you for the many anchorage comments and reviews on the navionics community charts in the Med, I assume they are from you and not another Stella Maris, there are so many out there.

We had our squall on the Lagoon 400S2 recently too including ripped out batten holders when trying to reef...

Even with the half bridge / sport bridge behind the salon you get salty and wet from all sides in the right weather and sea state. Even douched across the salon hardtop. But I am happy, the fat heavy girl stays firm in the seas and makes her way through with not much drama.

[Sand crab]

Originally Posted by Zzmeyer

That was replaced by the 40 in 2018.

The Lagoon 39 was replaced by the 40 but they are both still about the same length which is 38' 6".

They say the 40 is a new boat but it's still looks mostly like a 39 to me.

[Tupaia]

Originally Posted by Training Wheels

Good catch! That would make it about 26.

The SA/D doesn't work well for cats. Derek Kelsall developed a formula that is used for the basis of most multihull racing rules.

0.5 x SQRT ((LWL ft x SA sqft)/Disp lbs)

Times the result by 10 and you will get the approximate boat speed in knots in 10 knots of wind.

Running the figures the

Outremer 45 (light ship) = 8.1 knots
Outremer 45 (max disp) = 7.1 knots
Lagoon 39 (unloaded ?) = 5.4 knots
Excess 15 (light ship) = 5.9 knots

[Zzmeyer]

Makes sense. The added factor is lwl which should impact expected performance. In comparing with actual results (Outremer versus Lagoon) in the ARC the difference is not that large, but still significant. Interestingly, the TCF rating system used in the ARC includes the variables you mention plus hull shape (rather subjective definition) taking into effect such things as whether the boat has daggerboards or not.

[Gin-N-Sonic]

Originally Posted by CatNewBee

Hi Stella Maris,

Thank you for the many anchorage comments and reviews on the navionics community charts in the Med, I assume they are from you and not another Stella Maris, there are so many out there.

We had our squall on the Lagoon 400S2 recently too including ripped out batten holders when trying to reef...

Even with the half bridge / sport bridge behind the salon you get salty and wet from all sides in the right weather and sea state. Even douched across the salon hardtop. But I am happy, the fat heavy girl stays firm in the seas and makes her way through with not much drama.

To be quite honest, I'm trying to wrap my head on why some people outright deplore Lagoons, we do live in an age of modern technology so why not have the comforts of home when underway? I think the so called "condomarans" are not a bad thing. She floats and gets you there comfy with nice views, what's honestly not to love about the fat cats, I like them, I think they make more sense now (real estate values in Toronto are oh so fun) than ever before.

[Training Wheels]

Whatever floats your boat. There’s no right or wrong, just what makes YOU happy.

[Training Wheels]

Originally Posted by Tupaia

The SA/D doesn't work well for cats. Derek Kelsall developed a formula that is used for the basis of most multihull racing rules.



0.5 x SQRT ((LWL ft x SA sqft)/Disp lbs)



Times the result by 10 and you will get the approximate boat speed in knots in 10 knots of wind.



Running the figures the



Outremer 45 (light ship) = 8.1 knots

Outremer 45 (max disp) = 7.1 knots

Lagoon 39 (unloaded ?) = 5.4 knots

Excess 15 (light ship) = 5.9 knots

Good info, but offhand, I’d say the relative SA/D’s are pretty proportionate.

[RSH]

Originally Posted by sv Stella Maris

Lagoon 450F owner here. Just had my first real ‘heavy’ squall up in the flybridge in the middle of the night.

Not sure how it would have been so close to the waves and no good protection.



I can’t wait to buy a 2 year old 15 from a de-romanticized owner or finished cruiser! Take no options please future owner: more simple equals more better!!!

I love flybridges; they remind me of the helm of trawlers-high up with a good view. People have been saying it's not good for the open seas because of weight distribution, but I have to think that those flybridges are not really adding a lot of extra weight up there unless you're sailing with Andre the Giant.

I agree; I'm hoping in about 5 years we can upgrade from our wonderful and serviceable 380 s2 to something with a little more swagger

[FLLCatsailor]

Originally Posted by Zzmeyer

I'm not sure how much sail area/displacement means for cruising cat performance but a few comparisons
Excess 15 23.25
Saona 47 22.44
Leopard 48 22.20
Lagoon 45 22.06
Outremer 45 25.00

These numbers are based on published light displacement, which means two caveats; are the displacement numbers accurate and how do you load it up.

It's worth mentioning that all of these manufactures, other than Fountaine Pajot advertise in "light displacement." Under EU regulations its pretty clearly defined as light weight versus empty displacement.

The definition of light displacement is the weight of the boat, its equipment, half of fuel load, sails, rigging, etc.

Fountain Pajot advertises empty displacement, which under EU regulations allows them to have empty tanks, no sails, no running rigging required, etc etc... Basically anything that is not part of the structure of the boat can be removed.

You can look up the coding, but like I said its pretty well defined what light displacement and empty displacement are.

[Go Wildcats]

Outside of the Lagoon 450, SA/D and that speed calculation appear to keep the same order. All theoretical...

Originally Posted by Training Wheels

Good info, but offhand, I’d say the relative SA/D’s are pretty proportionate.

[LeeV]

Originally Posted by Gin-N-Sonic

To be quite honest, I'm trying to wrap my head on why some people outright deplore Lagoons, we do live in an age of modern technology so why not have the comforts of home when underway? I think the so called "condomarans" are not a bad thing. She floats and gets you there comfy with nice views, what's honestly not to love about the fat cats, I like them, I think they make more sense now (real estate values in Toronto are oh so fun) than ever before.

Until you get to Gunboats, Outremers, Dolphins, Catanas and a few others, they’re ALL condomarans and have their place; I’m looking forward to setting up a nice one (a la Leopard 46) lightly, with a sprit and doing the best we can. I just don’t like the look of the Lagoons. I hate the vertical windows and the chrome covered mast step support in the saloon of the newer ones. But that’s just my opinion; the next person will love them!