Opinions on These New Monohull Cruising Scows?

[Bowdrie]

Looking at the above boats and a couple of other YouTube vids, (as much as I could stomach,) reinforces my views that, (at least in the size ranges that most on this forum would use for a cruising boat,) the high-water mark of the design of cruising yachts is past.
Those of us who are referred to as "Boomers" have lived along and seen the likes of Olin Stevens/Robert Perry/William Garden/Bill Crealock and a host of others who, whether the boat was 25' or 65' still embraced the characteristics that enable us to refer to a boat as "she".
I fear much, (if not most,) of that is gone now, replaced by a computer modeled "manikin", an affectation, something that floats, but has no real essence of a yacht.
The French? I've lost hope for them, each new crop of "floating condos" have more entrenched ugliness both above and below, downhill since Trafalger.
The English? They're hit-an-miss, trying to hang-on to some vestige of yachting decorum, but afraid of being left behind by the French.
The US? Wandering around, seeking, but not quite finding, except for a few expensive yards the reality of a "cruising sailboat" is limited.

[Don C L]

Bowdrie, perhaps some of us are dinosaurs. But at least we do have Marchaj to confirm we are not totally crazy in our beliefs about what makes a good cruising boat!
I, for one, am not buying that bit about a scow that is heeling does not slam.

[JPA Cate]

@ Don CL:

But of course, it will not slam, in under 10 kn. true.

[Franziska]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

Looking at the above boats and a couple of other YouTube vids, (as much as I could stomach,) reinforces my views that, (at least in the size ranges that most on this forum would use for a cruising boat,) the high-water mark of the design of cruising yachts is past.
Those of us who are referred to as "Boomers" have lived along and seen the likes of Olin Stevens/Robert Perry/William Garden/Bill Crealock and a host of others who, whether the boat was 25' or 65' still embraced the characteristics that enable us to refer to a boat as "she".
I fear much, (if not most,) of that is gone now, replaced by a computer modeled "manikin", an affectation, something that floats, but has no real essence of a yacht.
The French? I've lost hope for them, each new crop of "floating condos" have more entrenched ugliness both above and below, downhill since Trafalger.
The English? They're hit-an-miss, trying to hang-on to some vestige of yachting decorum, but afraid of being left behind by the French.
The US? Wandering around, seeking, but not quite finding, except for a few expensive yards the reality of a "cruising sailboat" is limited.

As much as these new plumb bows don't really please my eye (but seem to work when racing, especially in combination with foils) either, I think it's important to understand that Americans and European have, despite our common values of a western style of living, different cultural and social backgrounds when it comes to style and design.



While many US Americans hate the European style on boats, many Europeans love it and think the typical US yachts are rather boring and conservative.
Neither view is wrong, it's just a cultural difference.

[Drinky Crow]

A scow that is heeling does not slam.

[longjonsilver]

i had my dog heeling today, and she didn't slam.

[Kettlewell]

I can't imagine one of these scows would work offshore with any significant wave action. Wouldn't big waves with breaking tops just stop them in their tracks? I suppose then you would head off the wind more, and they might actually do quite well headed downwind in rought conditions. Less chance of burying your bow in a trough. There used to be a big Botter Jacht type of craft cruising out of Rhode Island that I would see on the water a lot. It seemed to move along surprisingly well. It had big leeboards too. I believe it even sailed across the pond on her own bottom. Not sure what happened to it. Here's an image of a Botter found via Google.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

Less chance of burying your bow in a trough. .

Hmmm, maybe, but I shudder to think what it would be like if you DO bury the bow in a trough.

I say we all meet up wherever these scows are and put one through its paces and see what happens.

[Bowdrie]

Originally Posted by Franziska

I think it's important to understand that Americans and European have, despite our common values of a western style of living, different cultural and social backgrounds when it comes to style and design.

Cultural and societal backgrounds of people have nothing to do with the how the oceans/seas operate.
In 1986, Marchaj, C. A. wrote a book, "Seaworthiness: The Forgotten Factor".
In 1987, Stephen Davis wrote a book, "Desirable and Undesirable Characteristics of Offshore Yachts".
In the decades since then I believe that too many designers have either forgotten what those books present or have never read them.
"The prophet is a pariah in his own land".

[NormanMartin]

Seaworthy boats are for going to sea. Boat-show boats are for going to marinas. Pick the right tool for the job.
Maybe I'm just grumpy today...

[DragonflyBob]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

Looking at the above boats and a couple of other YouTube vids, (as much as I could stomach,) reinforces my views that, (at least in the size ranges that most on this forum would use for a cruising boat,) the high-water mark of the design of cruising yachts is past.
Those of us who are referred to as "Boomers" have lived along and seen the likes of Olin Stevens/Robert Perry/William Garden/Bill Crealock and a host of others who, whether the boat was 25' or 65' still embraced the characteristics that enable us to refer to a boat as "she".
I fear much, (if not most,) of that is gone now, replaced by a computer modeled "manikin", an affectation, something that floats, but has no real essence of a yacht.
The French? I've lost hope for them, each new crop of "floating condos" have more entrenched ugliness both above and below, downhill since Trafalger.
The English? They're hit-an-miss, trying to hang-on to some vestige of yachting decorum, but afraid of being left behind by the French.
The US? Wandering around, seeking, but not quite finding, except for a few expensive yards the reality of a "cruising sailboat" is limited.

Nice post.

I think everyone agrees that probably 99.9% of the new cruising sailboat market is targeted towards coastal cruising applications which accurately fits most of the cruising sailor demographic.

The coastal cruiser may be balancing performance or room/comfort against blue water safety/capability/reliability so as others say get the right tool. That guided our choice in buying our Dragonfly 32 trimaran. We don’t plan to cross large oceans but we’d feel comfortable with the right season and weather window to do a crossing of the Gulf of Mexico (500-600 miles, 3-4 day passages). For my wife and I, the boat has plenty of room, we love the performance and ease of handling, the low heel angle and motion in lumpy/choppy sea state, and we can carry enough spare water and fuel in the float compartments to be very conservative for our longest passage. Our main focus will be to always reef early and often to stay safe if the weather changes for the worst.

I would not want to go offshore in a boat with huge window portholes in the topsides which seems to be a trend of the latest in both monohull and catamaran aesthetics. IMO it is not a question of if but a question of when that feature will start to leak and probably could get you in big trouble. The tall bridge decks on larger boats also looks unseaworthy for ocean passages as it raises the height of the CE/CG and makes the boom so high for any type of repair or maintenance access at sea.

Regarding the scow designs, the seaworthiness is being proven by the Class 40’s, IMOCA’s, and Mini’s. Not sure if they will be a smooth ride but they look fast. But they are all to my eye BUTT UGLY! The only cool looking scows to my eye are the longer inland racing scows like the E-Scow and the A-Scow.

[sandy stone]

I could be wrong, but I think the reason for the sudden popularity of scow bows is that the scow-bowed Minis started kicking everyone's butts. So, speed and seaworthiness don't seem to be a concern. Comfort and looks, well...

[sailcrazy]

We sailed a scow, an MC Scow, on lakes, for a number of years. One experience comes to mind, when sailing on a blustery, windy day, with whitecap waves, we buried the bow in a wave running downwind.....and the bow just kept going down! My wife (crew) had the presence of mind to immediately move back to the stern, and the bow did come back up. But how do you relocate enough weight on aa cruising boat, once the bow buries itself in a trough, to get it coming back up??? Yes, a scow is fast, but think I'll stick with our conventional monohull, a Taswell 43, for ocean cruising.

[sandy stone]

Well, a cruising boat probably has more reserve buoyancy forward than an MC scow. And there are Youtube videos of conventional monohulls burying their bows when pressed hard under spinnaker.

[Bill_Giles]

I don’t like faddy designs, they look ugly now and will continue to look ugly.