Bavaria vs Jeanneau vs Beneteau

[lifeofreilly57]

In that price range I'd be looking for a Catalina of similar size and set up. But I can see that it'd be hard to find one there.
Better build quality and customer support. Never had a satisfactory result dealing with Bene support, especially boats more than 10 years old. Weren't interested enough in my business.

[Cold_sailing]

Hi Everyone,

Thanks all for the comments. Your insights help me a lot, and I agree with most of you.

Just giving some updates here:

1—We decided to go to a smaller boat (50ish) but a newer 2019+, so just like you mentioned, most of the running costs will be lower. Ultimately, a newer boat may give us a little wiggle room to replace things. I really thank you for the help.

2—My wife has a Portuguese passport, and I'm working to get mine as well, so this may help us stay longer in the EU. I'm not talking about the VAT, which is a different beast.

3 - The initial budget (250k-300k) is because I know I'll have to add another 20% to update the boat (batteries, solar, inverter, sails, etc..). That is why I don't want to go over this amount.

4 -Private vs Charter, that is something that I am still not sure about. I heard people saying that a lot of private owners sometimes don't maintain the boat as it should be, and sometimes the charter company, besides the abuse of the boat, keeps the maintenance on time; once they need the boat to sell the service

5 - All the insights about AC, Watermaker, Generator, anchors, etc.., I do have a pretty comprehensive list of what we must have, nice to have or like to have, and they are in my 20% over the budget

I don't really think this boat will be "the boat will be the forever one", bit I want to make sure that we will be comfortable and safe.

Again thanks everyone for the insights, I really appreciate.

[more]

Originally Posted by Cold_sailing

Hi Everyone,

Thanks all for the comments. Your insights help me a lot, and I agree with most of you.

Just giving some updates here:

1—We decided to go to a smaller boat (50ish) but a newer 2019+, so just like you mentioned, most of the running costs will be lower. Ultimately, a newer boat may give us a little wiggle room to replace things. I really thank you for the help.

Again thanks everyone for the insights, I really appreciate.

this is for you
https://www.ncp-charter.com/yachts-f...524700089.html

convert front cabin in 1 huge cabin,bunk bed is god for storage, right front toilet easy convert for shower(this is normal) shalow draft,my is 2,45 but also over 120000€ difference in price.
but you must pick couple model,visit in Canada,USA this model see is good for your need .and later drill to find couple model.
also my sugestion huge recesion is in Germany and Italy. wery soon this spil also in Croatia,greec and rest EU.

this boat what i find close to my house after travel 10000 km with car,is simply lucky find , fight between partner. wife find underwear what belong misterius women you can imagine rest story. now after 4 year boat siting divorce is soon over.

[Rohan]

Originally Posted by X Fernandez

Consider the Jeanneau 469. It’s the best layout I’ve seen for a liveaboard. Can sleep three couples, but when it’s just you and your spouse one of the aft berths makes for excellent storage.

Not disagreeing, but I had to chuckle - isn't that pretty much the standard layout of production/chartering monohulls everywhere? Owner's cabin forward, two smaller cabins aft under the cockpit, with most people using at least one for storage instead of sleeping.

Even my 36' boat had that layout as an option, but I'm glad I have the dedicated storage locker aft instead of a 3rd cabin. Because that means I can open a large lid in the cockpit and lift things in or out. Otherwise, I would have to walk the extra fenders, spinnaker, portable genny, etc up and down the companionway which would be a huge hassle.

Getting back to the OP, good storage and good access to storage is not something a lot of new owners think about when they buy a boat, but it's something you will be grateful for later on.

[Cold_sailing]

Originally Posted by more

this is for you
https://www.ncp-charter.com/yachts-f...524700089.html

That is a nice boat; I'll take a look at it.

Originally Posted by more

but you must pick couple model,visit in Canada,USA this model see is good for your need .and later drill to find couple model.

That was my initial idea, but most of the boats that I have on my list are not for sale in the US; to give an idea, there are 3 boats listed on YachtWorld in the US and 14 in Croatia (48-58 range, up to $300k).

So I believe it would be better if I take a 10-day vacation in Croatia and look for as many boats as possible.

Originally Posted by more

also my sugestion huge recesion is in Germany and Italy. wery soon this spil also in Croatia,greec and rest EU.

That is another factor. I'm planning to do my trip around October, which is the end of the season. We will be close to the US election, which will definitely impact a lot of markets.

[Cold_sailing]

Originally Posted by Rohan

Getting back to the OP, good storage and good access to storage is not something a lot of new owners think about when they buy a boat, but it's something you will be grateful for later on.

That is one of the reasons that I'm looking for a 50-55 boat, I do have a lot of toys (boards, wings, etc..)..

[carstenb]

Only you can decide what boat is right for you. Twin rudders are not an advantage unless you have a shoal keel. If 1 rudder fails they both fail

Sailing in the med is either no wind or too much wind get the bigger engine

Generally the build wuality of these boats started going downhill after the builders concentrated on the charter market. You will find many finish issues and that a lot of equipment is undersized
Expect to replace the sails immediately on a charter boat

The bigger the boat the more expensive everything, maintanence, insurance, slip fees, etc et will be. You might be better off spending more up front for a grand soliel and not have so many repairs right off. Get a good survey done before buying

Cheers

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by carstenb

Only you can decide what boat is right for you. Twin rudders are not an advantage unless you have a shoal keel. If 1 rudder fails they both fail

I don't see twin rudders or twin helms as a "bonus" in any fashion. They (both) are simply a solution to a design problem, and they show up when the design makes it necessary (and not before).

Twin helms were the first to show up. As boats got wider, the wheel had to get bigger to allow the helmsman to sit on the side (pick you preferred side) and still reach the wheel. It's a simple ergonomic thing. As the wheel got bigger, the first answer was to dig a trench in the cockpit floor. Then, give up and put in two smaller wheels. They aren't a "design" thing. They aren't a "style" thing. They aren't "cool like racers." It's simply a solution to a problem. And this also demonstrates that big wheels aren't done for style or leverage or anything like that -- but to reach the edge (I can design a 12" diameter wheel with enough leverage to twist off a 6" carbon fiber rudder post). As soon as they went to twin helms, the wheels got smaller.

Then the boats got not only wider, but thicker. Hard chines, all that, to make the aft cabins bigger (or on super high performance boats, a wide flat bottom to support those 20-30-40kt planing situations) That made the boats lift on the quarter. As the boat lifts on the quarter, the centerline starts to come out of the water. Suddenly, your rudder isn't working 'cause it doesn't work well in air. The solution was to put in two rudders, such that the leeward one still drives. They actually need to be even larger in total, because the weather one is flying dry. Again, this wasn't done for style, or redundancy, or aesthetics -- it's pure and simple a solution to a problem.

If you for any reason "want" either of these, you only need to (and you have to) look for a boat with a fat stern. The fat stern requires both. And since a thin stern doesn't need them, they aren't there.

[TrentePieds]

Thank you, sailingharry :-)

What a refreshingly sober comment!

If you were closer by, I'd buy you a beer. Or two :-)

TrentePieds

[Bowdrie]

^^ This.
When you design/build a boat with basically a fixed/weighted daggerboard for a keel and dangle a couple of helicopter blades in the water for "rudders", and then call that a good "cruising" boat you've just become insane.

[Cold_sailing]

Originally Posted by TrentePieds

Thank you, sailingharry :-)

What a refreshingly sober comment!

If you were closer by, I'd buy you a beer. Or two :-)

TrentePieds

Totally agree..

[Cold_sailing]

Originally Posted by carstenb

The bigger the boat the more expensive everything, maintanence, insurance, slip fees, etc et will be. You might be better off spending more up front for a grand soliel and not have so many repairs right off. Get a good survey done before buying

Cheers

Yeah, I don't want a big boat, but I know that my admiral will be miserable in a small one, so I'll go in between, around 50 feet.

[s/v Jedi]

So why not an Ovni? i guess it costs much more?

[carstenb]

You could also look at an Amel. Great cruising boat

[more]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

So why not an Ovni? i guess it costs much more?

also you try find 1 ovni 49ft + year bulding 2015-2021
only one and budget 300000€ i

Originally Posted by carstenb

You could also look at an Amel. Great cruising boat

only 1 on market his budget is 300000€ here is contact information try lower price to 300000€ max https://www.yachtworld.co.uk/yacht/2...el-50-9076809/




or order new design from Bill Tripp,find carbon fiber shipyard,find best yacht interior designer..
simply way money, if he have daily pasive income of +1000€ without work he order maybe this OVNI,Amel new from factory .who care couple year passive income .he have budget to 300000 $ with upgrade,repair,expense to come to MED.
he need 50 ft charter boat around 200000€ you guy know mayor if not all upgrade after 10 year is for recycling.