Surveyor needed in Cuba

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

Nothing to loose at all if he needs a bunker survey, onload/offload or cargo survey

Still worth contacting them. They may know someone etc.

[sanibel sailor]

email? When I was there a few years ago, no internet generally available. Had to go to a small open public park which had WiFi.
Silly me, I looked up address on Google maps and thought I would get street view.

[Montanan]

If travel involves an American there is the complexity of US laws restrictions which may require obtaining a license to be permitted by the US Office of Foreign Asset Control [OFAC]. Permissions to travel to purchase a good or service in Cuba, e.g., a boat, will be denied. Ditto as to entering the country to tour, hence why American yachts stay away from the country.

And there is the issue of ban of doing business with some of the specific entities included in the Cuba Restricted List, including many of the primary commercial marinas [which are in fact owned by the military].

Reference links:

https://cu.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen...eling-to-cuba/

Entry Requirements
Travel to Cuba for tourist activities remains prohibited by statute. However, the Department of Treasury’s Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC) has issued general licenses for 12 categories of travel. Individuals who meet the regulatory conditions of the general license they seek to travel under do not need to apply for an additional license from OFAC to travel to Cuba. The 12 categories of authorized travel to Cuba are: family visits; official business of the U.S. government, foreign governments, and certain intergovernmental organizations; journalistic activity; professional research and professional meetings; educational activities; religious activities; public performances, clinics, workshops, athletic and other competitions, and exhibitions; support for the Cuban people; humanitarian projects; activities of private foundations or research or educational institutes; exportation, importation, or transmission of information or informational materials; and certain authorized export transactions.

For details on Cuba sanctions regulations, including fact sheets on recent changes and information about applying for an OFAC license, please visit this Department of Treasury webpage on Cuba sanctions. The Department of State also provides information on Cuba sanctions and travel restrictions on its webpage on Cuba sanctions.

In accordance with the National Security Presidential Memorandum on Strengthening the Policy of the United States Toward Cuba of June 2017, the State Department also publishes a list of entities and subentities that are under the control of, or act for or on behalf of, the Cuban military, intelligence, or security services or personnel and with which direct financial transactions would disproportionately benefit the Cuban military, intelligence, or security services or personnel at the expense of the Cuban people or private enterprise in Cuba – the State Department’s List of Restricted Entities and Subentities Associated with Cuba (“Cuba Restricted List”). Persons subject to U.S. jurisdiction will now be prohibited from engaging in certain direct financial transactions with entities and subentities identified by the State Department on the Cuba Restricted List. Certain transactions will be excluded from this prohibition pursuant to exceptions detailed in the NSPM.

[sanibel sailor]

Hemingway Marina does not seem to be on the exclusion list, unless I missed it.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by sanibel sailor

Hemingway Marina does not seem to be on the exclusion list, unless I missed it.

Of key issue is to qualify under one of the general license basis for visitation to Cuba, secondarily if one is allowed by the USA government to enter Cuba then one needs to simply avoid any dealings with the Restricted List.

Useful reference:

https://www.waterwayguide.com/latest...t%20restricted.

Snipet:

"But what about the five excluded marinas? The good news for American boaters is that if a marina is not on the list it is still permissible to use the facility. Marlin Group, the largest operator of marinas in Cuba is not on the list and therefore Marina Hemingway in Havana, Marina Tarara, Marina Darsena in Varadero, Marina Cayo Guillermo, Marina Punta Gorda in Santiago de Cuba, Marina Marlin Trinidad, Marina Marlin Cienfuegos, Marina Marlin Cayo Largo del Sur and Marina Siguanea in Isla de la Juventud are not restricted.

Now let’s look at the five marinas that are not permitted and how that will affect American boaters. Marina Gaviota Cayo Coco and Marina Gaviota Las Brujas are essentially bases for deep sea fishing and snorkeling adventure cruises that are frequented by resort guests. Transient boaters are not permitted entry, so their inclusion on the restricted list has no impact. The other 3 marinas are ports of entry and are strategically located on the north Cuban coast, so their inclusion is problematic for those boaters who prefer to use marinas. These marinas are restricted, but that designation does not impact them as ports of entry or as fuel stops. Americans just can’t stay to enjoy the facilities.

To understand the paradox, you need only to examine the details of the Federal Register and untie the knots of legal language. I would encourage American boaters considering a trip to Cuba to familiarize themselves with the regulations in Part 515 of the Federal Register. Here is the quick version.

Explicit in the first part of the rules is that direct dealings with entities on the list are prohibited. Therefore, there is no doubt that Marina Gaviota Varadero, Marina Puerto Vita and Marina Cabo de San Antonio are prohibited for marina stays. Another section of the rules states that transactions for visas and transportation to and from Cuba, and within Cuba, are permitted and may be conducted with the restricted entities unless there is a specific prohibition to do so as defined by the class of general license under which travel is conducted. There appear to be no such prohibitions in any of the other license categories. Therefore, if you are in Cuba for a legitimate reason you can still use the facilities on the restricted list for the purposes of obtaining clearances in and out of the country and fuel, but you cannot stay for a sunset mojito.

It is vitally important, however, that your receipt for payment very clearly itemizes the permitted items and nothing else. If one is using the prohibited marinas simply for clearing out of the country, there is no transaction that is conducted with the marina so, for example, stopping at Marina Los Morros in Cabo de San Antonio to surrender your visa en route to Mexico is a non-event as no financial transaction needs to take place. It has also been suggested by admiralty lawyers familiar with Cuban travel that when using the marinas for permitted transactions that a receipt not bearing the marina’s name and logo will provide a further degree of distance from any misunderstanding if you are challenged in the future. Do not throw out any receipts that are issued to you because to do so will put you in violation of the law."

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by sanibel sailor

email? When I was there a few years ago, no internet generally available. Had to go to a small open public park which had WiFi.
Silly me, I looked up address on Google maps and thought I would get street view.

It’s changed a lot

[Capt Clark]

I think I would look for a surveyor in Miami with Cuban roots who can go to visit family and take a look at the boat.

Capt Clark

[Montanan]

some music for your voyage:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCjNJDNzw8Y

[trevorl]

Originally Posted by Capt Clark

I think I would look for a surveyor in Miami with Cuban roots who can go to visit family and take a look at the boat.

Capt Clark

Don't suppose you happen to know one? ��

[Fore and Aft]

Trevorl pre-Covid I would have been keen to go through the hassle of getting to Cuba for a survey. It would have been a good excuse to come over from Australia and visit my brother in South Carolina afterwards.
Surely there's a Caribbean surveyor who could visit Cuba?
Cheers

[Montanan]

Obtaining insurance for personal property located in Cuba will likely be very hard to have underwritten. I suspect you will need to first transport the vessel to a jurisdiction in which insurance companies can provide coverage and, in the meantime, accept exposure to uninsured risk.

Then there is the issue of financing as similarly a financial institution will be constrained as to lending on a collateral located in Cuba.

If you can pay cash and accept the risk exposure then certainly one can proceed.


Clever idea about seeking out a surveyor from outside Cuba but with Cuban nationality, albeit that person will face the same need to obtain a license from the US OFAC if they are a resident of the USA and that isn't going to be forthcoming what with the trade and travel restrictions. Although finding one is a bit a needle in a haystack.

If the intent is to import the vessel into the USA, there is the very significant issue of Customs and Border Patrol restrictions of importation by trade in goods to contend with and even if the subject good is allowed there will the imposition of a tariff under column 2 of the Harmonized Tariff Schedule [Cuba is a column 2 country]

Goods and Services Eligible for Importation
In accordance with the policy changes announced by the President on December 17, 2014, to further engage and empower the Cuban people, Section 515.582 of the Cuban Assets Control Regulations (31 CFR Part 515 – the CACR) authorizes the importation into the United States of certain goods and services produced by independent Cuban entrepreneurs [i.e., the boat was manufactured by a Cuban person or company] as determined by the State Department as set forth on the Section 515.582 List, below.

Persons subject to U.S. jurisdiction engaging in import transactions involving goods produced by an independent Cuban entrepreneur pursuant to § 515.582 must obtain documentary evidence that demonstrates the entrepreneur’s independent status, such as a copy of a license to be self-employed issued by the Cuban government or, in the case of an entity, evidence that demonstrates that the entrepreneur is a private entity that is not owned or controlled by the Cuban government.

This list does not supersede or excuse compliance with any additional requirements in U.S. law or regulation, including the relevant duties as set forth on the HTS.

. . .

Pertinent part of the CACR list -

Section XVII: Vehicles, Aircraft, Vessels, and Associated Transportation Equipment

All chapters

FYI - Link to the 31 CFR Section 515 Cuban Assets Control Regulations:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text...5ee577fdcc18ae


Such as:

§ 515.204 Importation of and dealings in certain merchandise.

(a) Except as specifically authorized by the Secretary of the Treasury (or any person, agency, or instrumentality designated by him) by means of regulations, rulings, instructions, licenses, or otherwise, no person subject to the jurisdiction of the United States may purchase, transport, import, or otherwise deal in or engage in any transaction with respect to any merchandise outside the United States if such merchandise:

(1) Is of Cuban origin; or

(2) Is or has been located in or transported from or through Cuba; or

(3) Is made or derived in whole or in part of any article which is the growth, produce or manufacture of Cuba.

(b) [Reserved]

If you are an American or desire to import from Cuba a good [e.g., a vessel and its appurtenances] be knowledgeable about the restrictions as to travel and as to trade / importation as to any goods which have Cuban provenance at anytime of their existence. General Guidance: Don't.

[trevorl]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Obtaining insurance for personal property located in Cuba will likely be very hard to have underwritten. I suspect you will need to first transport the vessel to a jurisdiction in which insurance companies can provide coverage and, in the meantime, accept exposure to uninsured risk.

Then there is the issue of financing as similarly a financial institution will be constrained as to lending on a collateral located in Cuba.

If you can pay cash and accept the risk exposure then certainly one can proceed.


Clever idea about seeking out a surveyor from outside Cuba but with Cuban nationality, albeit that person will face the same need to obtain a license from the US OFAC if they are a resident of the USA and that isn't going to be forthcoming what with the trade and travel restrictions. Although finding one is a bit a needle in a haystack.

If the intent is to import the vessel into the USA, there is the very significant issue of Customs and Border Patrol restrictions of importation by trade in goods to contend with and even if the subject good is allowed there will the imposition of a tariff under column 2 of the Harmonized Tariff Schedule [Cuba is a column 2 country]

Goods and Services Eligible for Importation
In accordance with the policy changes announced by the President on December 17, 2014, to further engage and empower the Cuban people, Section 515.582 of the Cuban Assets Control Regulations (31 CFR Part 515 – the CACR) authorizes the importation into the United States of certain goods and services produced by independent Cuban entrepreneurs [i.e., the boat was manufactured by a Cuban person or company] as determined by the State Department as set forth on the Section 515.582 List, below.

Persons subject to U.S. jurisdiction engaging in import transactions involving goods produced by an independent Cuban entrepreneur pursuant to § 515.582 must obtain documentary evidence that demonstrates the entrepreneur’s independent status, such as a copy of a license to be self-employed issued by the Cuban government or, in the case of an entity, evidence that demonstrates that the entrepreneur is a private entity that is not owned or controlled by the Cuban government.

This list does not supersede or excuse compliance with any additional requirements in U.S. law or regulation, including the relevant duties as set forth on the HTS.

. . .

Pertinent part of the CACR list -

Section XVII: Vehicles, Aircraft, Vessels, and Associated Transportation Equipment

All chapters

FYI - Link to the 31 CFR Section 515 Cuban Assets Control Regulations:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text...5ee577fdcc18ae


Such as:

§ 515.204 Importation of and dealings in certain merchandise.

(a) Except as specifically authorized by the Secretary of the Treasury (or any person, agency, or instrumentality designated by him) by means of regulations, rulings, instructions, licenses, or otherwise, no person subject to the jurisdiction of the United States may purchase, transport, import, or otherwise deal in or engage in any transaction with respect to any merchandise outside the United States if such merchandise:

(1) Is of Cuban origin; or

(2) Is or has been located in or transported from or through Cuba; or

(3) Is made or derived in whole or in part of any article which is the growth, produce or manufacture of Cuba.

(b) [Reserved]

If you are an American or desire to import from Cuba a good [e.g., a vessel and its appurtenances] be knowledgeable about the restrictions as to travel and as to trade / importation as to any goods which have Cuban provenance at anytime of their existence. General Guidance: Don't.

Thanks for the info, wasn't intending to import it into the states though, I'm a Kiwi..
Anyhow, it looks like it's a bust, the seller had gone radio silent on us after we asked a few pertinent questions. Plus we found some online reviews of the charter company which is selling it which suggest they haven't been looking after their boats very well.


Thanks for all the replies, will probably be asking about a different country soon, as we are still looking and won't be buying in NZ (too expensive here).