Rod Rigging and Insurance

[GoleenHarbour]

Hi I'm aware that most insurance companies insist on standing rigging being replaced every 10 years at a minimum. Would this be the same for Rod Rigging?

[Rucksta]

Most of my rod is over 10 years old

Done dye testing with re-heading or replacement where required.
Some items have wire (dyform forestay) or textile (dyneema backstay, runners, inner forestay check stays) substitutes.

Insurance company wants a riggers report at every renewal and will continue until every piece of rod is less than 10 years old.

Rigger comes each year does or helps me with couple of jobs makes some suggestions shows me a new splice signs the report.

Result is the rig is well maintained, rigger gets "money for old rope" , insurance agent has a piece of paper to justify the renewal and I get ripped off on premiums.


Every one is happy.

[Polux]

No, rod rigging should have the terminals replaced every 4 years and be substituted every 8 years.

Insurance companies base their demands on what rig manufacturers recommend. On the brand I use the recommendation for complete replacement on rod it's 8 years, cable 12 years, both with an intermediate full inspection.

[Joli]

Originally Posted by Polux

rod rigging should have the terminals replaced every 4 years

I've never heard this before? What terminals are you suggesting be replaced every 4 years? What manufacturer?

[GoleenHarbour]

Thanks all, I'm looking at First 45's or J&J Grand Soleil 46.3's for extended med cruising, I think as both don't carry too much beam aft they should sail well on all points of sail rather than mainly down wind. Polux, I'm sure you'd have a view on this? The First's have rod rigging and in my price range maybe around 10 years old. The GS's are older but likely a heavier build and wire rigged.

[42Possibilities]

Similar to Rucksta, in addition to my own inspection and maintenance, I have a professional rigger inspect, repair as necessary and certify my rod rigging and every 4 years. My insurance company seems to be happy with that.

[thunderhoof]

I am told to have my rod rigging inspected every two years.
BTW at the last inspection there were 2 failures at my spreader end fittings where the ends of the discontinuous sections are captured. Rig had to come down to replace the "cups" that failed and the mates on the opposite spreaders.

[Paul L]

For many insurers, you will incur significant on going rig inspection costs if you have older rod onboard. I was able to negotiate with one insurer who initially said no coverage for older than 10 years. They then agreeded to a biannual rigging inspection by a Navtec qualified rigger. This is not something that is all that practical if you are cruising remotely for an extended period of time -finding a rigger acceptable to the insurer while not spending excessive amounts is not easy.
One way to deal with it is to self insure the rig.

[psk125]

Our insurance company has never asked us about the rod rigging on our 1981 J/boat, which we race and cruise extensively. We replaced it on our own about five years ago - when it was more than 30 years old. When we did, we found out that the headstay, hidden by the tuffluff foil, had a kink in it. Have no idea how long we - or the previous owners - had been sailing with it like that. Rod is tough stuff. Almost seems like if you let your scairdy-cat insurance company drive the boat, you'll never leave the dock.

[maine50]

I have rod rigging about 30 y/o. The rigging was taken off and inspected at the riggers shop by a well respected Ct. rigger. He replaced a few ends but overall he said in great shape. He said he has never seen rod itself (not the ends) break and he has been in business 40 or 50 yrs. Insurance co only insures the rig if rigging is newer than 15 yrs. No problem with annual ins and premiums are reasonable (less than 2% of agreed value.).

[GoleenHarbour]

Thanks all, really useful info!

[Joli]

BSI's recommended service interval.

https://www.bsidk.com/rigging-service-program/

[Rucksta]

Originally Posted by Joli

BSI's recommended service interval.

https://www.bsidk.com/rigging-service-program/

You do realise it's a sales program?

At least they acknowledge there are more factors besides age that effect the life span of rod rigging.

The programs look very well packaged and I'm sure it makes the owners and underwriters sleep better at night.

[Joli]

Originally Posted by Rucksta

You realise it's a sales program.

At least they acknowledge there are more factors besides age that effect the life span of rod rigging.

The programs look very well packaged and I'm sure it makes the owners and underwriters sleep better at night.

If the rig comes down the carrier will probably ask if the factory recommended service interval was followed. Joe/Jane sailor ends up between a rock and a hard spot because most of us don't pull the spar every 5 years or die inspect rod ends.

[boat driver]

what exactly are you trying to insure and to what amount (%).
Insurance companies may request /require inspections for their customers, but it is not a standard requirement nor all inclusive.
1) what is a "certified inspection" definition? What is a "certified rigger"?
careful on this definition as training, equipment, responsibility, liability all are either spelled out in writing or possibly an assumed independent observation.

2) Without potential destructive testing, suggest to me how to to certify a rod rigging and terminals for strength? To "certify" commercial cables and dock lines they are stretched and measured by manufacturing representatives at specific locations offsite.

The reality- Insurance companies want a " recognized certified" independent risk analysis of your vessel which may include a specialized inspection of the rigging (or engine, or keel bolts etc.). This test, at standard industry specified intervals, may include but not be limited to dye testing, visual testing, possible disassembly, and in places of high loads or exposure, preventive replacement. The eye of the surveyor , the vessel, the anticipated use, all play into this discussion.

But to suggest a standard replacement ten years is scuttlebutt. Dyneme and exotic materials have degrade due to sun, poor stainless has corrosion, carbon fiber is temperamental to stress, etc.

Simply put, if you are prepping your vessel for a trans pacific 45 day crossing, the rig and vessel should have more detailed inspections based on the anticipated exposure. If you are a coastal cruiser avoiding severe weather, then the risk is less.
I can example vessels with high latitude circumnavigations and 1/2 million miles on them that have original equipment and I can example brand new vessels that loss rigs in SF Bay.
look closely at your requested policy and insurance company. Understand they are mitigating risk-simply put- the rig inspection is secondary to a rudder post or stuffing box.