Questionable Marine Policies Part 2

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

The yard we're in doesn't require owners to be present, but if you're not there, they expect to have keys so they can get aboard and check bilges, etc. before the boat leaves the slings.

Twice over the last two decades my boat had a significant leak around a thru-hull right after launch. In one case, it would have been virtually impossible to spot without knowing the boat well. I'd be a nervous wreck knowing my boat was being launched without me present (or at very least, someone I knew well, and who knew my boat well).


Come to think of it, this all seems very odd given the whole insurance demand from marinas. Or maybe this is why they demand it; so when they screw up, the owner's insurance pays...?

[KelseyB]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

I am pretty sure that every haulout/land storage contact I have ever seen has had something that says they can move my boat as they want to.

Our contract says that they have the right to move the boat if fees go delinquent for 30 days, or if it poses a risk to other boats or their property, both of which are perfectly appropriate rules that I agree should be in place to help avoid the yard queen issue. But I haven't seen a contract that says they can move it as they please, and ours certainly didn't, but if it did I'd blame myself for not reading the contract!

[KelseyB]

Originally Posted by S/V Illusion

Our marina doesn’t hesitate to evict troublesome boaters. Far more boat owners wanting choice locations than slip availability. While they work as best they can with individual requests, some simply think they are the only customer and are oblivious to other considerations.

Oh yea individual evictions for troublemakers would seem pretty standard to me... the eviction situation in this yard is that it is both a service yard and a staging ground for dredging equipment, and they recently decided to do away with the service yard part of their business and transfer fully to the dredging industry. Which they're also allowed to do as it's their business, but given that they likely knew that transition was coming well in advance and also that many of the boats there were doing lengthy refits (some derelicts, but also many people actively working), I feel like some more notice could have been in order.

[KelseyB]

Originally Posted by PippaB

Wow, I can't imagine a yard launching the boat without me present. Every yard I've been in expects me to go through the "is water coming in check" before they lower the last few inches and removes the straps. Does the yard really know how to access every hull penetration from inside the boat, check all the seacocks, instruments, and shaft seals for leaks? I know where I've been they expect me to do all those things before they actually remove the ability to lift the boat out again.

100% agree. As someone who had thru-hull issues for both of this boat's previous launches, I am adamant about this. I also feel like it would be in the marina's best interest, unless they want to potentially deal with a sunken boat in their travelift well!

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by KelseyB

Oh yea individual evictions for troublemakers would seem pretty standard to me...

Not as easy as it sounds. There is boat here I have seen for 3+ years that the marina hasn't been paid in years. Plus there is an ex sunk boat been here over 3 years that no works on. Another that has been here less than a year that looks like it has been sunk and no one ever works on.

The marina would like these gone, but .............

[Tellie]

One side of the story first of all. But times are a changin in the Marina industry, especially in the last year and a half or more. Here in S. Florida the schedules are so tight the work is coming in faster than most of it can be done. Any help is hard to find. Really good help is Slim and none to find right now and Slim left town. Though it might be frustrating to a point, my best advice is to be always flexible with the yard. They are over worked, understaffed, and customers are lined up behind you in some instances for months. These are not Harvard educated people operating these lifts. They are the hard-working average Joe's in blazing heat right now, and the last thing they are interested in is time complaints and anyone's sailing schedules and weather windows. If they can scoot you in a few hours early I'd try my best to accommodate. Bad business practice? Perhaps. I know we have had to institute a new policy about schedules and weather windows as well. I'm not saying the OP is a pain. I'm sure he is a great person. But I can't see a few hours earlier than scheduled a hill to die on.

[Captain Bill]

Originally Posted by KelseyB

Our contract says that they have the right to move the boat if fees go delinquent for 30 days, or if it poses a risk to other boats or their property, both of which are perfectly appropriate rules that I agree should be in place to help avoid the yard queen issue. But I haven't seen a contract that says they can move it as they please, and ours certainly didn't, but if it did I'd blame myself for not reading the contract!

I was recently shopping for a boatyard and they sent me a copy of their contract. Not only did it give them permission to move it when ever they wanted, but they also got to charge you for it! Needless to say I didn't go to that yard.

[boat driver]

Originally Posted by KelseyB

Thought I'd throw another marina policy out to see what people think.

The service yard I am currently at seems to have no care for when they lift and move people's boats. When Little Wing was hauled, we brought her around to the alongside the night before and had agreed to a noon lift the next day. At 8 AM I called to make sure we were still on for noon, and they said that she had already been lifted and was on the stands. We rushed over and besides several long streaks down the sides from scraping her way into the well, when we asked the people around the yard how they lifted her, the consensus was that they had used very incorrect lift points and we were lucky she didn't slip out of the straps. We went to the office and demanded not to pay the full price, but they said to either pay the full price or they'd put us back in the water and we could leave so we ended up paying full price.

A few months later we needed a reblock to get to some problem spots on the bottom of the keel. It was scheduled for 1 PM. At 11 AM, they drove the lift up and said they just wanted to place the straps, not lift the boat—I said we wouldn't be ready for the reblock until 1 but they could position the straps. They then proceeded to position the straps, lift the boat, and complete the reblock while I vehemently told them to stop at every step after positioning the straps.

Today, we're set to get picked up and hang in the straps overnight before we splash tomorrow morning. The lift has been scheduled and confirmed multiple times for 2 PM. At 11 AM, they drove the lift over and said they just wanted to position the straps. I said no, we'll be ready at 2 PM. The lift operator threw a fit and stormed off, saying he wasn't going to stay until 2 PM and that if we didn't lift now then he wouldn't lift us today and to take it up with the office. I had to physically block the lift with my car. After the first lift operator stormed off, a second one came up and said that he would stay until 2 PM to do the lift as scheduled, so my car remains parked in front of the boat and I am camped out aboard finishing the final checks I intended to do in the first place.

Of course the added bonus is a few weeks ago they served everyone with a 30-day eviction notice, which was not enough time for most people to finish the work they were doing to be able to move their boats. Luckily we were able to, but it's clearly been a major hassle for others.

We will definitely never be returning to this yard (not that we could with the eviction)- the only reason we were here in the first place is it's the only full service yard in the area that allows DIY. But has anyone else ever had an experience like this??

what part of the Chesapeake? northern? name of yard?

[JasonS]

There are great, good, and not so good yards. Leave a review to help others decide if it’s the type of yard that suits their needs. More and more yards and marinas are being bought for expensive high rise condos. The more difficult we make it as boaters the more yards will disappear. That’s not to say we shouldn’t complain about sloppy hauls, but we do try to be flexible with our marina and yard staff. There are more boats than spaces to put them, at least in S Florida and the Bahamas.

[Scorpius]

Wow, what a horror story! I've never heard of anything so bad! Pretty well everybody here has a lovely relationship with the family who own and run the place - and they are EXTREMELY accommodating - even giving me the same place in the yard every winter and allowing me to build a two hundred square foot workshop on the site in front of Scorpius.

If they are evicting everybody it certainly sounds like they've sold the property for development.

[guyrj33]

If the yard damaged your boat that should an issue for your insurance company to pursue with the yard.
With the changes you’ve described in the yards business plan I suspect the employees are also upset and disoriented. That’s not an excuse for some of the things that of happened but it could be part of understanding what’s going on.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Twice over the last two decades my boat had a significant leak around a thru-hull right after launch. In one case, it would have been virtually impossible to spot without knowing the boat well. I'd be a nervous wreck knowing my boat was being launched without me present (or at very least, someone I knew well, and who knew my boat well).


Come to think of it, this all seems very odd given the whole insurance demand from marinas. Or maybe this is why they demand it; so when they screw up, the owner's insurance pays...?

I wouldn't be happy with my boat being launched without me. But plenty of people let the yard just take care of it. At the same time, if something were leaking significantly it wouldn't take long for water to show up in the engine room bilge or the pumps to start running even if you didn't look directly at the leak source.

[GreenWave]

Originally Posted by Tellie

One side of the story first of all. But times are a changin in the Marina industry, especially in the last year and a half or more. Here in S. Florida the schedules are so tight the work is coming in faster than most of it can be done. Any help is hard to find. Really good help is Slim and none to find right now and Slim left town. Though it might be frustrating to a point, my best advice is to be always flexible with the yard. They are over worked, understaffed, and customers are lined up behind you in some instances for months. These are not Harvard educated people operating these lifts. They are the hard-working average Joe's in blazing heat right now, and the last thing they are interested in is time complaints and anyone's sailing schedules and weather windows. If they can scoot you in a few hours early I'd try my best to accommodate. Bad business practice? Perhaps. I know we have had to institute a new policy about schedules and weather windows as well. I'm not saying the OP is a pain. I'm sure he is a great person. But I can't see a few hours earlier than scheduled a hill to die on.

I don’t disagree with you but this story and experience is so far off the weird and wild spectrum it isn’t funny. Yes you have to be flexible. But hauling a boat when owner isn’t present - that is just wrong. And I don’t care what the contract says… what they did regarding flat out lying about placing slings and then lifting. Do that in Texas and you might have a barrel in your face.

KelseyB - had you paid the marina fee before they splashed you ( or will you)? I sure wouldn’t be paying full price.

[Tetepare]

Ok, not OPs marina, but some stories from my marina, which is generally good.

1. Marina sold. New owner decides, with no notice, to pave the dirt parking lot. A couple who’d been cruising returned to find that the yard had used a forklift to move their Subaru. Yard paid for repairs.

2. When we sign up for haul and indoor storage we select a launch period. You know, first boats to get launched next year are the last to get hauled and put in the front. In theory. One spring I returned from overseas to find that my boat had been pulled out of the barn the last day of my launch block so they could launch boats behind me. They charged me $185 to move my boat. I was livid. But “god knows best” and since then anytime a boat is holding up my launch I remind the marina and tell them to move boats and charge them. Best $185 I’ve ever spent.

[Jamme]

My suggestion is to always read your policy carefully; see example below of high deductible in connection with hauling/splashing maneuvers:

Lift Deductible: We will apply a separate property damage Deductible Amount to a covered loss that occurs while your Insured Property is on or attempting to get on or off a lift designed to hoist or lower your Insured Property to or from the water, and the loss or damage occurs as a result of the collapse or failure of the lift, or from either partial or complete inundation of rising or surging water from any source, etc etc