Over and out

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

"Roger" is a holdover from the phonetic alphabet used by English speaking forces during WW2. It began Able, Baker, Charlie, Dog, Easy, ... and included Roger for R.

Us old farts who began using such back in the dark ages (got my first ham license in 1949 iirc) just can't get our heads around this Romeo guy trying to replace our old pal Roger!

Jim

Hey, we are multicultural these days!
OUT.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

"Roger" is a holdover from the phonetic alphabet used by English speaking forces during WW2. It began Able, Baker, Charlie, Dog, Easy, ... and included Roger for R.

Us old farts who began using such back in the dark ages (got my first ham license in 1949 iirc) just can't get our heads around this Romeo guy trying to replace our old pal Roger!

Jim

Guess I'm an old fart too. I still automatically say Roger.

[Sojourner]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

I also use "going clear".

Ann

NO WAY!!! I won't be taken for a scientologist...

[CaptTom]

"Roger" is still a valid pro word, at least in the US CG and Navy. They do use "Romeo" for the phonetic alphabet.

BTW, "Roger" stands alone. "Roger that" is technically incorrect, although widely used.

I'm not saying I'm NOT an old fart. Just that this isn't proof of it

[cyan]

Originally Posted by CatNewBee

OVER AND OUT is somehow offending and rude. It says translated "f××k you, you can continue talking as long as you want to (OVER), but I am not listenig anymore (OUT)."

I've never met anyone who actually considered that phrase offending and rude. Maybe I need to get out more?

Not sure how some think the phrase is contradictory if OVER marks the end of my sentence(s) and OUT marks the end of our conversation. Sometimes you need a carriage-return and sometimes you need a page-break right afterwards. Logically different and very useful when used together, no?

[DnA9413]

This was accurate for the US Army as of when I retired in 2010. I have no idea if it applies to COLREGS, USCG or Ham radio or any other country.

For non-vets, I've removed a lot of the other jargon you'd really say over the radio before you begin an operation.

You - Black 6 (Infantry Company Commander)
Me - White 1 (2nd Platoon Leader)

Me - "Black 6 this is White 1, over"
You - "White 1 this is Black 6, over"
Me - "Black 6 this is White 1, {at the} LD (line of departure), over"
You - "White 1 this is Black 6, roger. When you reach objective A, move to objective C instead of Objective B as planned, over"
Me - Black 6 this is White 1, wilco, over"
You - White 1 this is Black 6, roger, out"

[Stu Jackson]

like fingernails on a blackboard to me.


oh, wait, what's a blackboard???

[a64pilot]

Anyone that has placed a phone call over SSB by using a Marine Operator or MARS knows you say over when your done talking and I believe the operator who is interfacing a simplex communications device (radio) with a full duplex device (telephone) switches who is going to talk.
So over doesn’t mean this conversation is over, it means I’m done talking, it’s your turn.

I’ve not made a phone call via a Marine Operator in well over 20 urs, so it may only be MARS that I’m thinking about.
MARS is Military Affiliated Radio Service, a service that I think Civilian HAMS supplied for us Military guys back before the internet etc to call home.
I think it was Civilian HAMS, I don’t remember having to pay for it.

[ianmkent]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I Thought that Wilco was actually proper radio usage?

what bothers me is the incessant requests for radio checks on Ch 16, or kids on the radio.Im sure parents think it's cute

I always get my children to do radio checks that way if they need to use it in an emergency situation it will be easier for them.

[a64pilot]

Why do you do radio checks? How often?

[StuM]

Originally Posted by cyan

Not sure how some think the phrase is contradictory if OVER marks the end of my sentence(s) and OUT marks the end of our conversation. Sometimes you need a carriage-return and sometimes you need a page-break right afterwards. Logically different and very useful when used together, no?

OVER is not the "end of my sentence(s)." Both Over and Out mean that, but in two different situations.


Over means, I have finished talking for now and am waiting for your response to continue this conversation (i.e. "I'm handing over to you").
Out mean I have finished this conversation and do not expect a reply from you.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by DnA9413

This was accurate for the US Army as of when I retired in 2010. I have no idea if it applies to COLREGS, USCG or Ham radio or any other country.

That's exactly the way we did it in the NZ army 30-45 years ago too


That's also still the way it's taught in every course that I am familiar with today (with the exception or Roger/Romeo in some instances).

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by StuM

OVER is not the "end of my sentence(s)." Both Over and Out mean that, but in two different situations.


Over means, I have finished talking for now and am waiting for your response to continue this conversation (i.e. "I'm handing over to you").
Out mean I have finished this conversation and do not expect a reply from you.

Exactly correct IMO, Stu, and why Over and out is self contradictory.

Bad practice for sure, but in reality, this has little effect upon good radio communications. Can't see it causing enough confusion to hinder an operaton.

So, why get upset about it? Plenty of better things to obsess about!

Jim

[Paul Elliott]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

So, why get upset about it? Plenty of better things to obsess about!

OK, I get upset when I hear the USCG radio operators reciting a long notice to mariners or Sécurité message, and read the "BREAK" but don't pause and take their finger off the transmit button.

I'm not finding this specified anywhere, but that's sure how I was taught -- you don't transmit continuously for an extended period, but stop occasionally (like a paragraph break) to give any emergency traffic a chance to cut in, saying "BREAK" to let everyone you are pausing for a couple of seconds.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Paul Elliott

OK, I get upset when I hear the USCG radio operators reciting a long notice to mariners or Sécurité message, and read the "BREAK" but don't pause and take their finger off the transmit button.

I'm not finding this specified anywhere, but that's sure how I was taught -- you don't transmit continuously for an extended period, but stop occasionally (like a paragraph break) to give any emergency traffic a chance to cut in, saying "BREAK" to let everyone you are pausing for a couple of seconds.

I have never understood BREAK to have that meaning. I have always understood it to indicate the next portion of my transmission is about a new subject (or new audience)and is not related to the last portion.

Long transmissions should rarely (never?) occur on emergency / calling channels so pausing long transmissions shouldn't be an issue for emergency traffic.

Unless of course you are listening to long haul truckers saying "Breaker breaker come on back" :big grin:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04T9-X3NCa0