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Old 22-05-2020, 12:03   #76
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Re: List of boats with skeg and sugar scoop

Quote:
Originally Posted by OneHullPaul View Post
Your first example isn't encapsulated, your second isn't a fin keel. I'm an owner of a Perry design FYI.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fin%20keel

I'm asking for an example of an encapsulated keel with a swim platform. I don't believe one exists.

No, the first boat, Sliver, is a double-ender with a fin keel (and spade rudder!), in response to your challenge: "Care to provide a pic or name to those fin keel canoe stern boats?"

And Valiant is a bolt-on lead fin keel, another counter-example. Perry prefers bolt-on keels, although he did design some full keel, internal ballast boats.

"By modern standards she [Valiant 39] is a straightforward vessel characterized by a subtle sheer, considerable tumblehome, deep-V sections beneath the waterline forward, a fin keel and a skeg-hung rudder.. .

"The keel consists of 7,000 pounds of external lead bedded to the bottom of the sump with 3M 5200, and secured by no fewer than 11 3/4-inch stainless J bolts topped with 1/4-inch stainless backing plates and stainless nuts. "

https://www.cruisingworld.com/sailboats/valiant-39/




As to encapsulated keels and swim platforms, here ya go:

Le Kraken:

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Lovely swim platform cum swim ladder, perfect for that morning dip. Long encapsulated keel.

And Island Packets have swim platforms, and full, encapsulated keels:

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  • "Fully encapsulated lead ballast forms double bottom over length of keel. No keel bolts to maintain, loosen or leak.. . .
  • "Integral swim platform with molded steps, emergency boarding ladder with pull strap."https://ipy.com/yachts/ip-349/

You said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneHullPaul View Post
. . .keel design requires compromise in swimming options. . .
This is demonstrably false. You can have whatever form of transom you want, with whatever keel.
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Old 22-05-2020, 19:20   #77
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Re: List of boats with skeg and sugar scoop

The Royal Passport SV by Perry meat your requirement.
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Old 24-05-2020, 13:30   #78
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Re: List of boats with skeg and sugar scoop

Of production today all these have both a rudder skeg and a sugar scoop transom:
• Hallberg-Rassy
• Amel
• Contest
Najad
• Malo (not sure if still in production)

• few of the latest Freedom 45’ (sadly, no longer in business)

There are definitely few more but I can’t recall right now. These were on my list when purchased my cruising boat, also, for the same reason.


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Originally Posted by deCarabas View Post
Good day all,

I have been searching far and wide for a list of boats that have a skeg rudder and a sugar scoop with no luck. Anyone know where I might find such as list or if one even exists? Perhaps a site with an extensive advanced search?
Thanks for taking the time.
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Old 24-05-2020, 14:00   #79
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Re: List of boats with skeg and sugar scoop

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Originally Posted by deCarabas View Post
Good day all,

I have been searching far and wide for a list of boats that have a skeg rudder and a sugar scoop with no luck. Anyone know where I might find such as list or if one even exists? Perhaps a site with an extensive advanced search?
Thanks for taking the time.
Well, my steel Spray has a skeg. There are 1000's more out there and you could get someone to weld on a sugar scoop if you have to have one :P
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Old 24-05-2020, 16:19   #80
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Re: List of boats with skeg and sugar scoop

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Originally Posted by Captn_Black View Post
Well, my steel Spray has a skeg. There are 1000's more out there and you could get someone to weld on a sugar scoop if you have to have one :P
With all respect, all the Roberts Spray "replicas" that I've seen have a long keel with an attached rudder, not a skeg rudder. So that means that not only would the OP need to add the sugar scoop to meet his design requirements, he would need to redesign the hull and appendages. A big ask, IMO.

Or perhaps your Spray is unique?

Jim
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Old 24-05-2020, 16:25   #81
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Re: List of boats with skeg and sugar scoop

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
With all respect, all the Roberts Spray "replicas" that I've seen have a long keel with an attached rudder, not a skeg rudder. So that means that not only would the OP need to add the sugar scoop to meet his design requirements, he would need to redesign the hull and appendages. A big ask, IMO.

Or perhaps your Spray is unique?

Jim
The rudder is attached by means of a skeg. I didn't know there was a different definition for a "skeg-rudder" or that he had specified that.

Edit - I understand what you mean, but I remember enough from the books i have read to know that the actual manner in which mine is attached is called a skeg, despite it being attached to a long keel.
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Old 24-05-2020, 16:40   #82
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Re: List of boats with skeg and sugar scoop

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Originally Posted by Captn_Black View Post
The rudder is attached by means of a skeg. I didn't know there was a different definition for a "skeg-rudder" or that he had specified that.

Edit - I understand what you mean, but I remember enough from the books i have read to know that the actual manner in which mine is attached is called a skeg, despite it being attached to a long keel.
Well, that surely is not common usage of the term "skeg" these days. I'd be interested in a reference for the book that you mention using that description.

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Old 24-05-2020, 16:49   #83
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Re: List of boats with skeg and sugar scoop

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
Well, that surely is not common usage of the term "skeg" these days. I'd be interested in a reference for the book that you mention using that description.

Jim
Almost certainly Bruce Roberts book, the free one on boat building he has available online, although I have others by him. Yes, I realised halfway through that comment that the term is not used for the actual part anymore, but rather the design of a non-free standing rudder. True, but not strictly the definition of the part.
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