Smartgauge vs Mastervolt Easyview-5 vs Simarine Pico

[ReneJK]

Originally Posted by john61ct

SmartGauge bypasses all these issues.

assuming the smartgauge has the SOC correct 99% of the time , and people seem to think it has that accuracy, how does it display how many Ah's you have left to draw from your bank ?


you say the nominal value was 400Ah but now you think its either 350 or 250 , does the smartgauge somehow tell you what the real value is of the bank or just it 'just' show SOC which goes down quicker as the Ah's of the bank deteriorate over time ?



I understand that the Ah's & SOC of the bank are a moving targets , based on a lot of factors but isnt it as important , or even more important , to know how many Ah's you can draw as opposed to 'just' knowing the SOC ?

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by OceanPlanet

Nope...have been swamped here, and the screen shipped was DOA. Rough shipping trip? Anyhow, hopefully replacement will arrive soon.

Today half of the Simarine shipment arrived; one box was missing, hopefully wasn't lost by FedEx...grrr....

So the score is currently tied at 0:0. Awesome.....

[OceanPlanet]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

So the score is currently tied at 0:0. Awesome.....

Exactly...

[john61ct]

Voltage has very rough accuracy, high amp loads drop V way lower than low current ones, both at exactly the same SoC.

Originally Posted by ReneJK

assuming the smartgauge has the SOC correct 99% of the time , and people seem to think it has that accuracy

Nothing on the planet has that level of accuracy, except in a lab with equipment more expensive than most boats.

Originally Posted by ReneJK

how does it display how many Ah's you have left to draw from your bank?

It doesn't, just shows SoC %.

For AH numbers get a coulomb counter, the two work together very well as outlined above or in the other thread referenced there.

[ReneJK]

btw , if that smartgauge really is correct in stating SOC and remaining capacity in % I may fork out the $150 , and test it alongside the Simarine (if it fits in the BEP 600 hole or covers the hole that would be great)

[ReneJK]

Next month I am planning on going to the Amsterdam tradeshow , Simarine and possibly others are there as well


Do we have any specific technical questions we'd like to ask them ?


https://www.metstrade.com/

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by ReneJK

Next month I am planning on going to the Amsterdam tradeshow , Simarine and possibly others are there as well


Do we have any specific technical questions we'd like to ask them ?


https://www.metstrade.com/

Yes, Does the Mastervolt Smartview system count up and down AH and then auto reset when it reaches 100% charge? That would be huge, and a major advantage over the Smartgauge.

Thanks

Ken

[ReneJK]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Yes, Does the Mastervolt Smartview system count up and down AH and then auto reset when it reaches 100% charge? That would be huge, and a major advantage over the Smartgauge.

Thanks

Ken

(since they're right next door I am on the phone with them now and its easy to talk to them in their own language)

Answer: if you have a master shunt it shows both Ah's in and out
Answer: it does auto resets , no manual reset needed anymore the system is intelligent enough to do this automatically

[Kenomac]

EXCELLENT!!!

Exactly what I've been looking for. Why doesn't Mastervolt put that in their sales or owner's information? This would in effect render my Smartgauge obsolete.

Thank you.

Ken

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by ReneJK

Answer: it does auto resets , no manual reset needed anymore the system is intelligent enough to do this automatically

I think all the AHr counting marine battery monitors will perform an auto reset. They could not function otherwise with users that did not know when to manualy reset the counter (which is the vast majority of owners).

However, the accuracy and adjustability of the auto reset function is quite variable between models. The better models when adusted correctly will reset correctly and this is one of the keys to the performance.

It also helps to have a charging system that reaches close to a 100% SOC frequently, as this is when the auto reset occurs. A large solar array or frequent connections to shore power is much better than boats that rely primarily on generator or main engine charging where the charging is often stopped around 80% so the parameters for auto reset are not reached.

The really smart way to perform an "auto reset" is to continually look at the battery voltage, temperature and amps in and use this information to estimate the SOC. In this way the meter does not only reset at 100% but performs multiple adjustments as the charging progresses. Unfortunately instantaneous reading of the above parameters are not enough, the meter has take into account the recent history. Some of the new meters like the Pico hint at this sort of capability but the manufacturers are reluctant to explain exactly how they function.

[OceanPlanet]

We will be looking at the adjustability of those "auto reset" parameters, on both MV & Simarine. These are all adjustable on the Victron BMV (and some others), which allows some flexibility as to when you want the monitor to sync to "100%".


In applications where we want to minimize fuel use (absorption time, especially with Li batteries), we often set the charged parameters somewhat "wider", to sync the monitor sooner. Better to reset to "100%" even if really only at 95-98%, rather than 1) not reset and the monitor gets farther and farther off with each cycle and the % is meaningless, or 2) have to charge for a longer time, wasting fuel, to reach a rather persnickety low current in an effort to sync a reluctant monitor.


The Philippi PSM (an otherwise great system) doesn't have adjustable charged settings, so this has been a bit frustrating with some Li banks, trying to get the PSM to sync. As Noelex points out above, solar or shore are better for syncing such monitors than fuel (espcially with Li).

[Mainebristol]

This has been an entertaining thread. For a lot of us though, that's all it has been.

I have a simple system, consisting of two LA batteries, an alternator, an autopilot, radar, GPS, and various lights. A portable inverter satisfies my laptop/cell phone charging needs.

When my ancient Blue Sky voltmeter died, I replaced it with a Smart Gauge purchased from Maine Sail. State of charge is more valuable to me than voltage, and with that info I believe that I can keep my batteries healthy.

Simple system. Simple solution. The Smart Gauge won't cook my dinner, but that doesn't mean that it isn't great at doing the one simple thing that it was designed to do.

[Kenomac]

Indeed....

But for some of us.... we need more. I live on the hook 100% of the time in anchorages six months per year, so it's important to me to know when I need to run the generator and for how long. I also want to know what's using the power, how much and where I might be able to cut back. The goal is to reach 100% SOC as often as possible and not burn any more fuel than necessary.

This year we covered 1200nm and used only 275 gallons of diesel for motoring and electrical power generation along with solar. So having a monitoring system that gives adequate feedback is working; money spent on improving the system pays dividends over the years.

I may not look too bright, but I'm like the Borg on Star Trek.... I assimilate knowledge and put it to good use.

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by noelex 77

The **better models when adusted correctly** will reset correctly and this is one of the keys to the performance.

It also helps to have a charging system that reaches close to a 100% SOC frequently, as this is when the auto reset occurs.

All three caveats are required for ongoing SoC% accuracy.

Plus the accurate AH capacity issue as that walks down.

[CatNewBee]

I am in negotiations for buying an used boat and there is a Mastershunt 500 from Mastervolt (that only supports 300A continous current according to the manual) besides an almost unreadable LCD display MasterView Easy and a MassSine 12-2000 Inverter.

I downloaded the most recent cataogue and asked some questions to the contact guys of Mastervolt about their MPPT controllers and the MassCombi Pro Iverters regarding parallel operations and interoperability with Lithium Batteries (OVP / UVP signals and options to shut down the load or the charger remotely in case this signals are generated by the BMS without using large solenoids to drop the load), because I am intending to install a parallel Mastershunt to increase the current and a pair of MassCombi 12-3000/150 inverters to replace the MassSine 2000 and attach a 1.000Ah Winston Thundersky LiFeYPO4 bank with an appropriate BMS to it, I also want to install a 1500Wp Solar Array (5x330Wp) and have it managed by the Masterbus too (shut down on OVP signal).

The response was "awesome", the guy responsible for the sales in my country told me, they do not supply the PV MPPT controllers listed in the catalogue, also they will not give any information about integration of LiFeYPO4 batteries / BMS systems of other manufacturers into the Mastervolt system for "liability" reasons. They only support their own products and they are "plug & play".

Well, guess what, I will rip out all Mastervolt components and sell them via eBay. I do not want to have anything on board from such a company, that is reluctant to provide information about integration with other systems and is so arrogant - once I have my boat. Even the remote management by a PC in the Mastervolt World requires a 1000€ hardware dongle for the connection with an integrated software key.

I think, the Victron Energy product range is the way to go, even their MPPT controllers are much better to integrate (master - slave options for larger arrays) and the software is free for the products.

Sorry Mastervolt, this was a MEGA-FAIL.

I planned to get rid of propane in the galley and replace it by all-electric appliances, there is an Onan 9kW gen set on board for the AC's too, that can be used to quick-charge the LiFeYPO4 in less than 2 hours from 10% to 90% (300A from the MassComby + 150A from the solar chargers - 450Wp + 1500Wp + the allready installed regular 80A charger = charging current of 530A) The solar set-up will be powerful enough to run anything on board, including the water maker, the galley appliances, washer, water heater fridges etc. in combination with the Lithium Battery bank (usable 10kWh) and the generator will be used only in weeks of very bad weather. Even decent AC usage (2-3h/day) of one of the four AC units can be done by solar I guess.

Well now I will go for the Victron Quattro 12/5000/220-100/100 and will charge with 450A. I guess 5000W will be enough for the induction cook top / oven - they usually do not run in parallel, the maximum load will then be 400A - that is "nothing" for 1000Ah Lithium bank, also the BMV shunt and the solenoid relay will be OK, they both can handle 500A. Optionally I could connect a second Quattro unit in master-slave mode - but this will not be necessary.