New Boater - is it normal protocol for a marina to not cover damages from dock hand?

[SailSummerDaze]

Thank you for the continued feedback. Seems my best bet is to cross my fingers and hope the marina has some compassion.

Good news is the repair is complete and SummerDaze will be wet again soon.

Always an adventure and forever a learning experience.

Greatly appreciate this community already :-)

[CF32907]

Hi all, CaptVR here.
The pics are pretty small, but what enlarging I've done here, it appears to me. There is definite pink in the broken area as well as a very granulated looking appearance in the broken area. After surveying for 20+ years and around boats for 60+ years, I would say this strut broke because of stray current corrosion degradation. Not just from these visual observations but bronze is quite malleable and should have bent and not broke. I seen no bending at all before the break, indicating that the strut had appreciable degradation before the incident. I would say, suck it up and look at the bright side. It broke at the dock where your secure. It could have happened out where no assistance was available, it could have happened out under heavy power running from a bad storm, now your stuck in a bad situation with serious handicaps. Try and have a great day.
Capt. Vince Rakstis Ret. MS

[sailing_gal]

Don't trust dock hands to know how to do anything! I toss them lines and give explicit directions. You're the captain, don't let a dockhand control your boat.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by sailing_gal

Don't trust dock hands to know how to do anything! I toss them lines and give explicit directions. You're the captain, don't let a dockhand control your boat.

Agreed. And I've chewed a few out because they wouldn't listen and do as they were told, or started doing things without being asked and before I was ready. Last weekend I had one start pulling off lines while we were leaving the fuel dock after a pumpout before I even had both engines running... I told him to back off, we'll do it ourselves. And then when the first mate stepped down he was all freaked out about "but you're supposed to stay on the boat!" Next time we go, if one of them steps out of line one bit, they're getting a very angry speech about how they are not allowed to do anything they're not told, they're not allowed to think or make decisions, they're not allowed to tell me what to do because it's my boat, not theirs and I'm the captain.

[BlackHeron]

I think the best you could hope for out of this deal as far as compassion from the marina was a few free days comped staying there while you sorted your options and made plans to get somewhere on the hard to fix the issue. Perhaps the use of the marina shuttle car to run the errands and talk to yards in person. Tow insurance at this point comes in really handy here as well.

Things really would have gotten interesting if a mistake by the dockhand caused you to crash into another boat at the fuel dock. $900 doesn't go very far at all when it comes to gelcoat and paint repairs, much less deeper fiberglass work or bent/mangled stainless fittings, swim platforms, davits, crushed RIBS...

[Dave22q]

I would persue in small claims court if they refuse to settle. Businesses are responsible for their employees but you will need an expert to support that the dock hand caused the damage. Your log should distroy any claim of old damage.

[Cadence]

Pay for the repair out of pocket it will be cheaper in the long run than filling a claim. I would hazard a guess the strut was weak from electrolysis if it snapped from a line fouling the prop.. JMHO

[Capt Jerry]

As a practicing attorney, I will tell you that the employer is responsible for the negligence of its employees. So, yes, marina is legally responsible. Here is the problem, it is not clear (as some others have posted) that the strut was not ready to fail, and that the dock handler's actions are the "proximate cause of the damage." Meaning your claim is not cut and dried. Also when it comes to hiring attorneys, the claim is too small. Your lawyer is going to want more than $900 just to take the case. (as you already know)
One final note on the matter of contracts that disclaim responsibility, they must be clear otherwise the clause is enforced against the drafter (marina), and cannot disclaim gross negligence.

[FabioC]

I do not think there any standard, expected or offered, on dock hands' experience. Some are incredibly experienced and knowledgeable, some have no experience at all. Marinas that offer docking line assistance do so as a courtesy, not as a guaranteed services.

Since there is no way to know a priori how experienced the dock hand is (unless you know him/her from prior interactions), the skipper/crew must be prepared to give them clear directions and follow up on their actions.

Damage resulting from a situation in which the skipper is expecting the dock hand to throw the line on the boat correctly and does not follow up on the result, is responsibility of the skipper, not of the dock hand.

This principle is true in general, not just with the dock hand, but with any crew who may be involved in docking. It is always the skipper's fault.

We all screw up with docking/undocking occasionally. Sometimes, it is because the crew fumbles with one of the dock lines, or releases the wrong lines, or does not release a line when supposed to, etc. Invariably, if something happens, as skippers, we have to swallow it, it is our fault and move on.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by SailSummerDaze

Agreed. Solo handing and the current was ripping through. Thought the dock hand would understand how to let out a line and/or notify the captain that the he threw the line in the water under the boat?
Lesson learned, never ASSume dockhands know what they are doing.

When I leave a dock I run the last line(s) from the boat, around the cleat or whatever, and back to the boat where I cleat it off.



That way they can be eased out and released without relying on dockside help.

[Woodland Hills]

It’s quite an eye opener to learn that $900 and rising is small change, not worth bothering about, isn’t it? Welcome to the world of boating!

It wasn’t your fault, but it was your responsibility. Isn’t it great to now be a “Captain”?

[ferrailleur]

Very interesting post:
Great points:
1- dock hand and captain's ultimate responsibility
2- strut integrity on older boats

[MCOS]

The damage does not appear to have been caused by a fouled prop by a line. It appears the strut was already broken and the line fouling was not the cause. It takes a lot of force to snap the support strut as shown, most likely from your boat taking a heavy wave from the side causing the motor to shift in the mounts. Check your motor mounts. It is highly likely the the motor shifted during a side swell and the strut snapped due to the combined effect of the torque effect of the spinning shaft added to the side force of the off centered engine on the drive line which also causes excessive drag on the cutlass bearing in the strut. You can travel extensive miles with this damage without noticeable vibration or other problems since the broken piece of the strut will turn with the shaft until it contacts the portion on the keel. It will then ride on the keel portion with support being taken up by the thru hull shaft seal. Check the sides of the broken pieces. If there is a slight wear spot indicating the two pieces have rubbed together, then you do have a motor mount problem. I had a similar experience and took the two pieces off and brazed back together. Worked fine but I did have to reinforce the existing motor mounts. Also invested in a bunting flexible coupling for the prop shaft.

[taxwizz]

Originally Posted by Woodland Hills

It wasn’t your fault, but it was your responsibility. Isn’t it great to now be a “Captain”?

You are going to eat the $900
But ask the marina, nicely, if they will haul you for free to fix their damage.
It will cost them nothing, and keep you happy,
And keep theit name out of social media.

[IslandInfedel]

It’s the capt fault.

Dock hands are there to..give a hand, ultimately it’s your responsibility

I’ve had folks “help” docking before, I told them to let lose my line because they were pivoting my boat in a way I didn’t want, they didn’t listen, both times I had to let lose the line from the boat.

Had I just kept repeating myself as the boat pivoted into the dock, or worse another boat, it would have been 100% on me.


Sucks about your prop, but the take away here is it will always be the captains responsibility, and work on situational awareness, always know how many lines etc are out and know their positions/stowed status.

Typically I dont like having anyone I don’t know touch a line for my boat unless the boat is at the point of near zero energy and I’m about to jump off too with a line. Normally I’ll run my bow and stern lines to one point, come along side dead slow, hop off and tie both, engine from neutral to off, and finish securing the boat. If someone is there to help I’ll toss the bow line to them and just step off the boat with the stern, most times you’d really have to try to mess that up as the boat is going max 1/4 of a kt and I’m arresting that with the stern line.

Originally Posted by taxwizz

You are going to eat the $900
But ask the marina, nicely, if they will haul you for free to fix their damage.
It will cost them nothing, and keep you happy,
And keep theit name out of social media.

That sounds like a semi fair idea

However I think if you tried to give them a bad review on social media, if you were honest with how it happened, it would look worse for you than the marina.