ASA vs RYA

[DMF Sailing]

Hello, friends!

I will preface this by saying I'm not here to prove anything or show off. I'm not trying to have a competition. There's no jingoism here. I'm merely looking for practical information that might help me down the road.

Truly I appreciate all your opinions and input. Please be kind. But if you feel like flambéing me, go ahead.

Boatman recently posted this fabulous link.

https://pacificsailingschool.com.au/...ualifications/

It piqued my interest. I can't think of a better thing post-pandemic to do than take some time off, go to Australia, and up-skill my qualifications, and achieve the coveted RYA yacht master in the process!

The trouble is, I'm not sure where I would fit in.

I have taken ASA-106. Our final on-paper exam was a lot of theory and navigation for passage-making. Our final on-the-water exam was a 200 nm cruise that included night sailing and negotiating all manner of treacherous situations in the very place that the ASA courses are based upon: the fickle waters of Pollock Rip, Nantucket Sound, and the Elizabeth Islands. It was topped off by a 100 nm passage in the North Atlantic, outside Cape Cod, over the route that persuaded the Pilgrims to turn around. Struth.

Just on paper, that puts me somewhere between RYA coastal skipper and RYA yacht master.

In reality, what I do on boats reflects that I have the "knowledge and ability to skipper a yacht on coastal cruises but not necessarily the experience needed to undertake longer passages."

De l'audace, encore de l'audace, et toujours de l'audace!

But a very well-informed source on this forum tells me my ASA classes don't hold a candle to RYA. And I believe her.

So, what is it? Should I go back and take all the RYA courses from the beginning? Should I start at Day Skipper? Can I qualify out of any of them?

Damn. While I was typing, I absentmindedly poured two fingers of Old Forrester 1920 Prohibition Style into a glass that still had the remnants of a dram of Arbeg Uegeidail in it.

The horror. The horror.

(Kira, in my signature, is looking up at this missive and wondering when I will STFU and let you speak)

[Hanksy]

I'm an RYA instructor so might be able to help you figure this out.
A Day Skipper should be able to take a group of beginners out for a day sail in familiar waters, keep them safe and lead effectively.
Questions you need to ask yourself: Can you safely lead a couple of beginners through a reefing evolution?
Can you deal with basic engine problems? Think blocked fuel filter, snapped alternator belt etc.
Bring the boat alongside and spring off with any wind/tide direction?
Pick up a mooring?
Are your man overboard drills up to scratch?Day Skipper should be able to pick up an MOB under engine on the first pass in reasonable conditins. Needing 4 or 5 passes is not good enough but 2 it OK.
How's your chartwork? Dead reckoning and estimated positions, 3 point fix, course to steer.
Do you have a working understanding of Col Regs, weather, sea survival etc?

This list is not exhaustive but if you can answer yes to all of these you are probably at Day Skipper level or above. The next step would be to do the Yachtmaster Theory course followed by a 5 day YM prep course and then the exam.
The Yachtmarter exam is hard but it is worthwhile in my opinion. The examiner will push you to find your weaknesses. It's not about being a perfect sailor with flawless skills. It's about seamanship and good decision making under pressure.

[Hanksy]

Here is a link to the Day Skipper Practical syllabus, this doesn't cover the theory syllabus. It is a assumed the theory is completed beforehand as a 5 day classroom course or online in 40 hours.

https://www.irishoffshoresailing.com...ourse-syllabus

[boatman61]

I would say do the Coastal Skipper Theory and if you breeze it and have confidence in your boat handling skills take the Practical Exam skipping the course..
When I took mine back in '87 I did both solo on my boat with an examiner I paid 85 pounds for.. he fired questions at me between drills and maneuvers.
I would not recommend going straight into the Offshore YM course.

[LittleWing77]

Hiya DMF,

I second Boatie's and Hanksy's info.

Here are a couple of links from "the source" - the Royal Yachting Association (www.rya.org.uk).

If you scroll to the bottom of each description, the prerequisites are listed in order for you to sign up/take the stated course. Those will help you place yourself.

If you don't have a record of the time/passages/vessels in a sailing log, get yourself an RYA personal sailing log and record them. (There's a place for past miles/history which you can complete and then start this summer recording everything going forward.) The RYA requirement is that the requisite seatime must have been within 6 months of taking the course.

Day Skipper
https://www.rya.org.uk/courses-train...y-skipper.aspx

Coastal Skipper
https://www.rya.org.uk/courses-train...l-skipper.aspx

Yachtmaster Offshore
https://www.rya.org.uk/courses-train...chtmaster.aspx

Fair winds!
LittleWing77

[Hanksy]

Just a quick correct Little Wing. Sea time is valid for 10 years.

Minimum seatime
Documented minimum sea time1*completed on a seagoing sailing or motor yacht (as appropriate) in the last 10 years:

50 days at sea on yachts up to 500gt2;

5 days as skipper on vessels less than 24m LOA;

2500 miles on yachts up to 500gt2, half of which must be on vessels less than 24m LOA;

5 passages over 60 miles long, which must include 2 overnight passages and 2 as skipper.

[DMF Sailing]

Thanks for those awesome and very helpful responses! More people will chime in, I think, this forum being this forum, and hopefully they'll take part in my goofy poll

Sailing is all about humility before forces infinitely greater than you.

I can tell anyone who is reading this that I am certain that I have fulfilled the Day Skipper requirements, probably to the degree that would satisfy an instructor.

BUT I am also a pretty cautious guy. What I'll do if I ever get around to it is start with that one and fill in any holes between "definitely" and "probably."

Being in a class with people who don't know how to do 90 percent of what I know how to do isn't the most important thing; finishing that class knowing everything to the satisfaction of the instructor is.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYZlME0mQB8

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by DMF Sailing

Thanks for those awesome and very helpful responses! More people will chime in, I think, this forum being this forum, and hopefully they'll take part in my goofy poll

Sailing is all about humility before forces infinitely greater than you.

I can tell anyone who is reading this that I am certain that I have fulfilled the Day Skipper requirements, probably to the degree that would satisfy an instructor.

BUT I am also a pretty cautious guy. What I'll do if I ever get around to it is start with that one and fill in any holes between "definitely" and "probably."

Being in a class with people who don't know how to do 90 percent of what I know how to do isn't the most important thing; finishing that class knowing everything to the satisfaction of the instructor is.

My problem with the Theory Course was I kept pissing off the instructor because I knew too much.. he would for example set a Navigation problem and I would solve it from outside his box.. which annoyed him intensely when I argued my case.
Just remember.. Its Their Way or The Highway..

[DMF Sailing]

Originally Posted by boatman61

My problem with the Theory Course was I kept pissing off the instructor because I knew too much.. he would for example set a Navigation problem and I would solve it from outside his box.. which annoyed him intensely when I argued my case.
Just remember.. Its Their Way or The Highway..

Yeah, I'd have to tamp down my tendency to be annoying for sure.

But definitely it would be worth it.

[DMF Sailing]

Originally Posted by DMF Sailing

Yeah, I'd have to tamp down my tendency to be annoying for sure.

But definitely it would be worth it.

Oooh, found a place that teaches RYA Day Skipper in Middletown, Rhode Island (a.k.a. The Little Los Angeles.)

No need to go to Australia. This is less than an hour from my doorstep.

Once covid ends I'm there.

[LittleWing77]

Originally Posted by Hanksy

Just a quick correct, Little Wing:
Sea time is valid for 10 years.

Minimum Seatime
Documented minimum sea time
*completed on a seagoing sailing or motor yacht (as appropriate) in the last 10 years:

50 days at sea on yachts up to 500gt2;
5 days as skipper on vessels less than 24m LOA;
2500 miles on yachts up to 500gt2, half of which must be on vessels less than 24m LOA

Qualifying Passages: 5 passages over 60 miles long, which must include 2 overnight passages and 2 as skipper.

Now that's an interesting tidbit, Hanksy!

When I did my YM (Offshore), the Qualifying Passages had to have been completed within 6 months of one's exam application.

Didn't know about that change, so thanks for that pertinent extra bit.

Fair winds,
LittleWing77

[LittleWing77]

Originally Posted by boatman61

My problem with the Theory Course was I kept pissing off the instructor because I knew too much...

He would, for example, set a Navigation problem and I would solve it from outside his box.. which annoyed him intensely when I argued my case.

Just remember.. Its Their Way or The Highway..

You're just the original rabble-rouser, Boatie! Com'on, admit it!

[bensolomon]

I did RYA dayskipper and got my ICC as part of it. Used NauticEd.com for theory and studies, then on board exam with mark thompson at Yachting education.com. Fantastic experience with both. I had been sailing my whole life by then, but learned an immense amount and became a better mariner.

[ChrisJHC]

RYA Dayskipper is a very worthwhile course and it sounds like it’s the place for you to start.

The practical side is pretty much an attendance course - i.e. if you have the theory down pat it’s almost impossible to fail the practical course.

The assessments kick in at the Yachtmaster level - either Coastal or Offshore (and Ocean).

Note that there are two similar sounding levels: Coastal Skipper (next level up from Day Skipper) and Yachtmaster Coastal.
Yachtmaster Coastal is formally assessed and sits between Coastal Skipper and Yachtmaster Offshore.

One of the good things about the RYA approach is that you don’t have to do all the courses sequentially. You pick and choose which ones are appropriate for you.

In my case, I started with Day Skipper, then did Coastal Skipper and am attempting Yachtmaster Offshore in the next few months.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by LittleWing77

You're just the original rabble-rouser, Boatie! Com'on, admit it!

Moi.???