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Old 16-03-2016, 19:28   #91
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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The only oversized anchor, is the one which won't fit in your bow roller, or which your windlass won't lift 25kg sounds about right for a boat that size. It was what we had on my Dad's boat, 37 feet and 10 tonnes. The bigger the better. For some reason, anchor performance seems to go up disproportionately with size.


Concerning double anchoring -- the problem is when the rodes get tangled, which they WILL, if you are swinging in tidal waters. If you need to bug out, you may be faced with jettisoning both anchors, which is a massive PITA and big risk of losing both anchors, even if you have a fender to hand. I can imagine a situation where you might need to despite all this, but it's certainly to be avoided where possible.
The time I have double anchored I used just one rode, not two. Thought I guess you could call it a rode from the first anchor to the second anchor of 3 meters. But, whether these get tangled is really not a hassle as the entire lot comes up.

I guess the problem I could face one day is if one anchor get's snagged, Ill loose both of them
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Old 16-03-2016, 19:35   #92
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pirate Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post
The time I have double anchored I used just one rode, not two. Thought I guess you could call it a rode from the first anchor to the second anchor of 3 meters. But, whether these get tangled is really not a hassle as the entire lot comes up.

I guess the problem I could face one day is if one anchor get's snagged, Ill loose both of them
The problem comes if your solo and get caught unawares.. unshackling and handballing that 3metres plus second anchor on board and stowing could lose you valuable time as you blow onto a lee shore..
Some folk like to take chances.. some don't
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Old 16-03-2016, 19:50   #93
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

I came across this video of an anchoring that appears very poor to me. The snubber is far too short to be of any good. These people are very lucky they didn't end up on rocks. I hope they learn better how to anchor.

http://youtu.be/9lyypubKVrU

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/9lyypubKVrU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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Old 16-03-2016, 20:12   #94
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pirate Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Only reason I use a snubber is to transfer the load from the windlass to a deck cleat.. and stop the noise off the chain.
Bugger all to do with the holding.
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Old 16-03-2016, 20:42   #95
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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The problem comes if your solo and get caught unawares.. unshackling and handballing that 3metres plus second anchor on board and stowing could lose you valuable time as you blow onto a lee shore..
Some folk like to take chances.. some don't
Yes, fair enough. I'll have to be conscious of that in such a situation. I had plenty of time to prepare when I did this last time on Badger Island.
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Old 17-03-2016, 03:25   #96
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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I came across this video of an anchoring that appears very poor to me. The snubber is far too short to be of any good. These people are very lucky they didn't end up on rocks. I hope they learn better how to anchor.
Didn't look to me as if there was even that much strain on the snubber as there didn't look to be much stretch in the compensator or movement to indicate any stretch.

Besides a snubber is only there to reduce shock loading to the topside anchoring equipment and, hopefully, reduce the chain noise in the fore cabin. It doesn't help holding as such.

So how long would you have a snubber if that is too short? It's about the same length I use and have used on several other boats

Keiron
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Old 17-03-2016, 03:32   #97
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

I can understand the purpose of a longer snubber in the conditions of a swell that changes the tension on the rode with the wave period, but in a protected anchorage like this with just the wind blown ripples on the surface and a constant tension on the rode, there would be no reason for me to choose a longer snubber.
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Old 17-03-2016, 04:41   #98
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

I am for the put the biggest anchor you can afford and handle and as much chain as you can afford and handle on the bow. Hence I have he Rocna 44 and 250' chain on my Catalina 350 and the bow roller handles it (oversized from the from the factory from the get go) and I still have a 33' bruce back up anchor on the other bow roller and and 50' of chain and 150' of rode as a back up.

Stern anchor wise I've done it once in 35 years and that was on the ICW here in Texas when we lost an engine and had to anchor parallel to the ICW and had to keep the boat straight. No dink so we had to swim out (with 10 life jackets on it) a 40+ pound CQR (it was a 46' motorsailer) off the stern a ways to set the stern anchor. Not easy nor was it easy to retrieve the next day. Not to mention I was 25 years younger then!

To me, without a dink and unless you have a ton of stern rode to set out first and let a ton out then set your bow anchor and then pull the stern in and set it, it's really tough to do. I have kept one of the reel style webbing stern anchor (Quickline Flat Rope and Reel – Ultra Marine West / Quickline) on the boat for just that reason but have never used it.
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Old 17-03-2016, 05:33   #99
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

As the wind increases, the chain loses most of its catenary. It is important to add some stretch to the system and a reasonably long (think 10m+) nylon snubber is the best way to do this. In mild winds a short snubber is fine.

Without some elasticity in the system the peak loads are directly transferred to the anchor. The snubber reduces the peak loads considerably.

There was a recent test in Practical Sailor that showed in strong wind the maximium force with a decent snubber was about 1/4 that of all chain with no snubber.

Here is a theoretical analysis:
Rode - Dynamic Behavior
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Old 17-03-2016, 05:51   #100
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Noelex, I don't doubt your figures and I agree that a good snubber is an essential part of anchoring equipment but I'm intrigued as to how you rig up a 10m snubber?

I think mine is about 3.5m if you include the purpose made stretchy compensator gizmo I have between my line and the chain. I use a long length of 14mm as a bridle between my bow cleats but as my cleats are as far forward as you can get there is not a hug distance between them.

Be great to hear how you rig up your snubber

Cheers

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Old 17-03-2016, 05:51   #101
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

You are correct you need a snubber of some sort especially with all chain rose and I forgot to add in my comment I have the Mantus anchor snubber they build and sell. I've found it to be the best one I've found granted you can build it yourself if desired. It works perfect on my Rocna 44 and all chain rode
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Old 17-03-2016, 06:14   #102
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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Be great to hear how you rig up your snubber
My snubber is attached to one of the stern cleats. It passes over the second bow roller extending a metre or so (a lot more when it stretches), where it is attached to the chain with a soft shackle.

I also have a couple of soft shackles that are used as "blocks" or fairleads to keep the snubber away from anything that will cause chafe.

The length is about 13m.
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Old 17-03-2016, 06:25   #103
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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My snubber is attached to one of the stern cleats.
Wow, stern cleats. Never heard of that nor thought of using them. I admit I have heard of people using the midship cleats which I have considered more for trying to control the dancing our boat does. We don't have a second bow roller so would have to run the line(s) direct to the chain/compensator which might complicate matters.

Could you confirm what you mean by "soft shackles"

Anyway, something to think about and thanks for sharing

Keiron
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Old 17-03-2016, 06:51   #104
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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Originally Posted by kas_1611 View Post
Could you confirm what you mean by "soft shackles"
This is an example:



See this thread:
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...le-155714.html

I have one on the amidships cleat that keeps the snubber away from the jib track. And another near the bow. This leads the snubber directly through the bow roller without any chafe. Soft shackles don't make any noise or abrade the deck, but allow the snubber line to slide back and forth as it stretches and contracts.
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Old 17-03-2016, 07:01   #105
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Noelex

Many thanks

Keiron
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