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Old 13-08-2014, 17:25   #46
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

Quote:
Originally Posted by Broken-Sailor View Post
I guess I will be doing good on repairing the boat since most likely I will be building the boat unless I find one that I can afford that is in turn key shape for lest than what it is going to cost m to build.
Let me say this quite clearly and simply

BUILDING A BOAT WILL COST YOU WAY, WAY, WAY MORE THAN BUYING A GOOD 2nd-HAND BOAT

Even if you do not factor in any labor cost, just the materials to build a new boat will cost a lot more than a good second hand boat. And a boat that you are going to live aboard will take a long time to build - years if you do it yourself.

There are literally thousands of potential live aboard boats, with price tags to match their age, condition and size. Do yourself a favor and research the 2nd hand market before you even start to consider the first inkling of a thought about building...
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Old 13-08-2014, 17:47   #47
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

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Originally Posted by Broken-Sailor View Post
As the title says, I want to know is it possible to live aboard on $800 a month or less. I am just getting into learning to sail but I am not new to boats or the water. Being ex-U.S. Navy I even know what it is like being on the water for long periods of time. But this is different than being on a ship. I am disabled and get a disability check each month. My disability limits my mobility somewhat but I can walk and stand up on a boat. Right now it is just me but later I hope to have someone special to travel and live aboard with me and to share the cost. Can you reasonably live on the hook for $800 or less a month? That way I can leave everything I get over that in the kitty for emergences. I'll be mostly traveling the ICW and staying along the Gulf and Eastern coast of the U.S. Nothing blue water till I can get a boat that will do it and I have enough training and experience for blue water sailing. Besides I need to keep myself close enough to where ever I make my home port that I can see my Doctor once every three months. Let me hear form you frugal live aboard types please.
$800.00/month would not be fun for us. More like $12/1500.00 a month works for us. Once, we were anchored out with about $100.00 in the till and 2 weeks to another injection of $$$. Well, a sailboat gets pretty boring at a time like this. We survived, but it wasn't fun. What if something was broke on the boat? Then what? With $800.00/month income, how much will be in savings? I think Mark J once said "it costs whatever you have, to cruise". We eat out on the rare occasion, and I do like my beer and rum. My wife, her wine. Sorry not giving up what I like to go cruising.

I think you are pretty smart. Your posts seem intelligent, and no doubt, you *could* probably survive for a while on $800.00/mo. while cruising if the boat doesn't break.

Most of the questions I had for you have already been asked, and answered. You seem to have a pretty good grip on what will be involved. If you get someone to help kick in a little, that would help.

I do have a question or two for you.

What does it cost you to live month to month now? How will that be different if you are on a boat?
What do you do to pass your time right now? Hobbies? Travel? Can you do what you like on a sailboat?

I think the biggest is about your disability. You do know cruising can be pretty physical? No one has mentioned anything about jugging water/fuel to the boat. Walking a mile or two for provisions, then returning with bags full of what you bought at Publix. Getting into and out of a dinghy when it's blowing 25 knots out (how about going up a ladder to get in the cockpit)? You will need a windlass for sure, because you'll definitely wreck your back anchoring. BTW, if you have an outboard, you can winch it up, or let it down with your main halyard. Same if you want to put the dink on the foredeck, using the jib halyard. My wife is on the winch and we're getting older, so it isn't that hard.

How well will you sleep when it's blowing 30 Knots out while at anchor, when a cold front blows through (usually at 2 AM). Where will you go if a hurricane is heading toward you? What about those thunderstorms that Florida is known for with winds that will try to beach you on a lee shore? The lightning is crashing down all around you? (have some friends that just got hit in Marathon, doing many thousands of $ damage to their boat). My point is, these are things fulltime cruisers deal with, and not what you are probably thinking about. Just so you know....as one of my dear friends used to say before he died - "sailing isn't always a slick magazine cover". (RIP i2f)

I'm not trying to discourage you. I just hope you know what is in store, if you do pursue this. It's all worth it, but some days and nights can be challenging, sometimes even making you think to yourself "why am I doing this"? Really no different than living on land, but perhaps a little more risky at times.

We just got back to Texas after 19 1/2 months and 5000 miles of cruising. We've had a blast and can't wait to get going again next year, after we add more equipment and improve our boat. I'm adding SS income to our cruising budget next month, and it will really help. Especially with keeping the boat in good condition.

Best wishes,
Ralph
Enjoying Texas | sailing away with R & B
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Old 13-08-2014, 17:51   #48
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

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Originally Posted by Weyalan View Post
Let me say this quite clearly and simply

BUILDING A BOAT WILL COST YOU WAY, WAY, WAY MORE THAN BUYING A GOOD 2nd-HAND BOAT

Even if you do not factor in any labor cost, just the materials to build a new boat will cost a lot more than a good second hand boat. And a boat that you are going to live aboard will take a long time to build - years if you do it yourself.

There are literally thousands of potential live aboard boats, with price tags to match their age, condition and size. Do yourself a favor and research the 2nd hand market before you even start to consider the first inkling of a thought about building...
Listen to what Weyalan said......Start looking around at stuff you have and sell it....get the money together for a cheap sailboat. I wont post examples but there are thousands around for sale under 3000.....best of luck.
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Old 13-08-2014, 18:28   #49
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weyalan View Post
Let me say this quite clearly and simply

BUILDING A BOAT WILL COST YOU WAY, WAY, WAY MORE THAN BUYING A GOOD 2nd-HAND BOAT

Even if you do not factor in any labor cost, just the materials to build a new boat will cost a lot more than a good second hand boat. And a boat that you are going to live aboard will take a long time to build - years if you do it yourself.

There are literally thousands of potential live aboard boats, with price tags to match their age, condition and size. Do yourself a favor and research the 2nd hand market before you even start to consider the first inkling of a thought about building...

Second that most emphatically.
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Old 13-08-2014, 18:33   #50
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

You are kidding right....you are on a BUDGET and are thinking of building a boat...ha ha ha...put down the crack pipe and get that crazy idea completly out of you head! Sheesh...might as well buy a ski resort as a way to live aboard on $800/mo.
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Old 13-08-2014, 19:52   #51
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weyalan View Post
Let me say this quite clearly and simply

BUILDING A BOAT WILL COST YOU WAY, WAY, WAY MORE THAN BUYING A GOOD 2nd-HAND BOAT

Even if you do not factor in any labor cost, just the materials to build a new boat will cost a lot more than a good second hand boat. And a boat that you are going to live aboard will take a long time to build - years if you do it yourself.

There are literally thousands of potential live aboard boats, with price tags to match their age, condition and size. Do yourself a favor and research the 2nd hand market before you even start to consider the first inkling of a thought about building...
I am doing that, I am looking at used boats as well as different boat designs. I am looking at home built designs as well. I am trying to get a feel for the best design that will work for me, do what I want it to do while keeping the cost once of living an running the boat to a minimum per month. I was even just playing with my own transom design and wondering one, how stable it would be, two where would the water line come too, three, how would it do in rough deep water in a storm, and four, what would be the minimum safe height of the transom from the bottom of the hull to the top of the transom be. With my 3D modeling program not working on this version of windows I am limited on what I can do playing around with designs. If it works on here I could not only make a scale 3D model of the design in my head, I could add reactors and forces to the scene and see how the design would react on the water and in different types of conditions. Right now all I can do is use the paint program and do simple shapes to see what it would kind of look like. What I was thinking would have the bottom of the hull 32 foot long and the top would be 36 feet long at the top deck. The main bottom would be 8 feet wide. Now the over all beam would depend on how wide I had the sides at the 45 degree angles. Using 2 feet side plates at the 45's would put the beam at the wides point at about 10 feet and the transom would only be about 3.5 feet form the bottom of the hull to the highest point on the transom. This seems to low to me for a boat that would be in the ocean. Using 4 foot pieces for the sides at the 45's on the hull would put the max beam at around 12 feet and the transom would be about 7 feet from top to bottom of the hull if I am figuring right. Here is the shape of the hull I was thinking about. The triangles and the 45's are just kind of place holders where you might attach the keels to, and the one on the bottom serves a few purposes, one to shield the Rutter and prop, and also help protect and strengthen the middle of the hulls flat bottom. The bow would be a V shape side to side for the first 4 feet, the 32 to the 36 feet part of the hull, the bow would also have a curved slope from the same 36-32 feet mark where the hulls beam is the widest. Just something I am playing with that has nothing to do with the topic of keeping the budget under $800 a month. Here I am derailing my own thread.

Back on topic, I was looking at some of the gear I would need on board an ocean going boat, radios, navigation, and other things some of which are not required but I would want on "My" boat especially some type of radar system, and I was blown away at the prices of some of the normal gear that is already on most of the used boats of which I was looking.

Shoot one site listed the price for their boat plans, that I think they screwed up on and forgot to place the decimal point on the prices, if they really were that high you would have to be a billionaire just to afford to buy the plans much less having it built. No way on earth I would pay a total of $116,000 for the complete set of plans and NC cut files even if I was rich enough to afford it. I think it suppose to be $1,160.00 for everything though. But some of the gear need on the boat cost more new than what some of the used boats cost with the same gear already on it cost to buy the whole boat.

I know what ever boat I get it is going to have to be rigged in a way that will allow me to sail from inside the cabin in bad weather or the pilot box in better weather. I figure adding an electric conversion kit to the winches will allow me to keep allot of strain off my back when using the winches to raise and lower the sails and in the case of some unforeseen loss of power I could still use the crank handle and do it manually. Since I would be using electric anchor winches I will need to add some backup anchors on manual winches too or a way to switch out the winch types if the electric winch goes down.

For now I am going to take some sailing classes and also buy an inflatable dingy that has a sail kit on it to play with on the small local lake. I found a used one nearby on Craigslist with the sail kit on it for $500. This will give me a small boat to play with as well as a spare dingy for the larger boat when I get it.

I just finish paying off the dentist office for a bill the insurance should have paid but didn't, so I can now add that payment amount to my boat kitty. This will allow me to increase the amount per month to go towards my boat to $200 up from $150. This be somewhat lower on the months that I have to refill my medications and if I buy extra snacks which I am trying not to do by the way.
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Old 13-08-2014, 21:48   #52
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

Building a boat isn't just the making of the thing. You are going to have to teach yourself how to perform all the tasks as well. Buying a used boat is so much easier. Buy a the cheapest piece of junk you can find and restore it.

Fiberglass, about 35 feet long with shallow draft. Ditch the mast and just motor the thing. Make a great liveaboard.

$800 should be plenty. I spend the following:

$30 - Car insurance
$70 - Storage unit
$300 - Food
$100 - Gas
$130 - 20GB / month from ATT

So that's still $170 a month for a spot in the harbor left.

I have no idea why you would want to live out on a mooring, to each their own I guess, but that seems like such a hard life. At the harbor you have shower, fresh water, some kind of human interaction, shorepower, etc.

Well, good luck. I would just say go for a project boat and focus on restoring that and making a nice liveaboard out of it as opposed to trying to build something.

1980 Amateur Cotre Acier Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
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Old 13-08-2014, 22:38   #53
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

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Originally Posted by RTB View Post

I do have a question or two for you.

What does it cost you to live month to month now? How will that be different if you are on a boat?
What do you do to pass your time right now? Hobbies? Travel? Can you do what you like on a sailboat?
Right now I pay $450 a month including utils, for a small room 8 feet at the widest 6 feet at the smallest by 12 foot long room ( just measured it to be sure of the right size) with access to the kitchen and the bathroom.
I pay $92.12 per month for my Satellite internet and VOIP phone system.
I spend $125 a month in cash on food. The $81 a month I get on Snaps goes toward snacks like fresh fruits, sugar free sodas, and other food stuff I don't really need but get when I want them. My If they don't throw any new medications at me like they did this month because of a Colonsocopy I have to have on the Sept 2 and the antibiotics they threw at me this month, my normal medications cost me broke down per month cost would be $21.00 or $63.00 every three months.The shows I do watch I can get online and I have went years without even having a TV or watching TV before didn't have time for watching TV. Driving a truck the only time I watched a TV was while waiting for them to call my shower number after I had eaten. And when I worked special maintenance I was also doing pollution control, chemical pretreatment, as well as yard driver. I was putting in 15 to 16 hours a day in 6 and 7 days a week. I was lucky when I get a full day off. One week I put 76 hours in 4 days and was in the hospital having test done for the next two days before going back to my "normal" routine. Boy what I glad when I got the two guys trained to do the chemical pretreatment part of that job. That knock down my work time to 12 hours a day and I started getting weekends off though every other weekend I was on call. Back the the question. All total for everything I pay out right now including the $25 a month I put into a savings account/trust fund for my great niece that lives in the house here, with the medications broke down as a monthly amount instead of the full amount every three months is about $700.00 on average. I used $800 as my base amount though I get more than that per month. The amount that I get over that will go into the kitty for emergencies.

What do I do to pass the time and my hobbies? I read allot, I write music lyrics, poetry and short stories. I reload not only my own ammo but I reload for my brother and most of the time for my Dad too though he knows how too. He says mine comes out more accurate than his but I have seen him shoot both and they seem to shoot the same, I think he just gets lazy at times and gets me to do it so he doesn't have too. I like to hunt and fish though I do not hunt very often anymore. I shoot with my camera more than I do my rifles anymore. I love photography and have since I got my first camera at 12 years old. I do photo editing on my computer too. Until I upgraded my windows from XP to windows 7 I did allot of 3D modeling and animation. Basically about 90+ % of what I do here at home to pass time I can do just about anywhere. About the only thing I could really do on the water would be reloading an shooting. Though technically with a hand press kit I can load out in the field or anywhere I have my kit and supplies but, I wouldn't want to do it out on a boat for several reasons, first I'd end up with power everywhere in a rocking boat, and two, gunpowder that "missed" going where it was suppose to go because the boat is rocking and all your cases that you just filled but have not seated a bullet in yet got dumped and ended up on the deck in a wooden or fiberglass boat would be almost impossible to get it all up but would be a fire hazard in a half. Someone else might try it but I am not that guy.

Why do I want to live on a boat? I think I answered this before but here it is again. I love to travel and see the other parts of this big world. There is a total of 7 states I have not been in yet and all of them I can get to by boat though I would have to pick the right time of year to get to them. I love to fish and I used to scuba but I can't now because of my health, but I can still snorkel. I just love the freedom to go where ever I want within reason and have a new view when I look out around me. Since I don't own a car anymore I don't have to wait till someone has the time to go fishing to fish if I live on a boat I can go fishing when ever I feel like it. There is also the issue that when My parents are gone this property where I am living now is going to be sold and then split up five ways. The other properties will be sold and split up between myself, my sister, and my brother. So when that happens I want to already have a place to call my own and can live in. It will also be the first "Home" that I have ever owned. I have always rented the places I have lived since I have grown up, except, when I was in the Navy.
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Old 13-08-2014, 23:03   #54
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

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Originally Posted by robert644 View Post
Building a boat isn't just the making of the thing. You are going to have to teach yourself how to perform all the tasks as well. Buying a used boat is so much easier. Buy a the cheapest piece of junk you can find and restore it.

Fiberglass, about 35 feet long with shallow draft. Ditch the mast and just motor the thing. Make a great liveaboard.

$800 should be plenty. I spend the following:

$30 - Car insurance
$70 - Storage unit
$300 - Food
$100 - Gas
$130 - 20GB / month from ATT

So that's still $170 a month for a spot in the harbor left.

I have no idea why you would want to live out on a mooring, to each their own I guess, but that seems like such a hard life. At the harbor you have shower, fresh water, some kind of human interaction, shorepower, etc.

Well, good luck. I would just say go for a project boat and focus on restoring that and making a nice liveaboard out of it as opposed to trying to build something.

1980 Amateur Cotre Acier Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
I have never said even once that I want to live on board and stay in one area or just motor around. I want to sail and see other places.
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Old 14-08-2014, 04:38   #55
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

G'Day Broken,

Building your own boat is a folly. Building your own boat of your own design is madness.

Get serious, mate! Good yacht designers go to NA school for some years, then usually apprentice with an established designer before setting out on their own. Mere shipwrights, the guys who actually build yachts professionally, go through long periods of training before building a boat on their own.

Why in the world would you flaunt these well known truths to design and build your own boat when there are countless professionally designed and built boats available for a fraction of what it would cost you to do your own half-assed design?

We're trying, I think as a group, to lead you down a reasonable path. I'd like to see you succeed, and I believe, as do most of the other experienced posters here, that what you seem to be considering is a really bad idea.

There are folks who have responded who have actually done what you hope to do: live and sail on a small yacht on a limited budget. Sailorchick34 is a really good example of what can be done. She's smart, has a good grasp of the realities of low budget living, and is generous with advice. Listen up! (And in case you didn't catch it, she didn't build or design her own boat, but bought an 'elderly' production boat and made it hers).

I haven't had to live on a budget like yours since my immediate post divorce days, long ago, so I can't advise you on the monetary aspects of your budget. But I do know a bit about boats and stand ready to give advise and opinion on any boat related issues you have... IF you will get off this design and build caper!

Cheers,

Jim
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Old 14-08-2014, 05:18   #56
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

worth looking here for some real world costs of a modest homemade boat. These guys know what they are doing and have done it before.
http://abargeinthemaking.blogspot.co...st-of-diy.html

Even without the copper and woodstove the materials alone will cost more than a modest older GRP, that can get you sailing now.

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Old 14-08-2014, 05:31   #57
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

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.......................... ..................................
I'm reminded of the chariot race in the movie, "Ben Hur", where the axle of a competing chariot had spikes like these to disable others. I can imagine some disappointed neighbors in an anchorage.

With a careful and patient search you can find a ca. 30' liveaboard with a small diesel and a functional rig for +/- $10,000 and begin cruising. As others have suggested, it's as much hard work as play and it requires some time of learning and developing skills before you make a full departure!
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Old 14-08-2014, 05:43   #58
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

Guy's
Most of this is just fantasy, dreaming, at least the part of building his own boat, He knows that I'm sure.
Before you start beating on me, there is absolutely nothing wrong with dreaming or fantasizing, we all do it.
Some people buy lottery tickets and sit around and talk and dream of what it's going to be like when the hit it big, I see that as a waste of money. I see Broken's dream of building his own boat as being a lot more healthy than buying lottery tickets.

Hell I dream of cruising the South Pacific, I hope I make it, but until then, I'm going to dream about it
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Old 14-08-2014, 07:56   #59
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

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I am doing that, I am looking at used boats as well as different boat designs. I am looking at home built designs as well. I am trying to get a feel for the best design that will work for me, do what I want it to do while keeping the cost once of living an running the boat to a minimum per month. I was even just playing with my own transom design and wondering one, how stable it would be, two where would the water line come too, three, how would it do in rough deep water in a storm, and four, what would be the minimum safe height of the transom from the bottom of the hull to the top of the transom be. With my 3D modeling program not working on this version of windows I am limited on what I can do playing around with designs. If it works on here I could not only make a scale 3D model of the design in my head, I could add reactors and forces to the scene and see how the design would react on the water and in different types of conditions. Right now all I can do is use the paint program and do simple shapes to see what it would kind of look like. What I was thinking would have the bottom of the hull 32 foot long and the top would be 36 feet long at the top deck. The main bottom would be 8 feet wide. Now the over all beam would depend on how wide I had the sides at the 45 degree angles. Using 2 feet side plates at the 45's would put the beam at the wides point at about 10 feet and the transom would only be about 3.5 feet form the bottom of the hull to the highest point on the transom. This seems to low to me for a boat that would be in the ocean. Using 4 foot pieces for the sides at the 45's on the hull would put the max beam at around 12 feet and the transom would be about 7 feet from top to bottom of the hull if I am figuring right. Here is the shape of the hull I was thinking about. The triangles and the 45's are just kind of place holders where you might attach the keels to, and the one on the bottom serves a few purposes, one to shield the Rutter and prop, and also help protect and strengthen the middle of the hulls flat bottom. The bow would be a V shape side to side for the first 4 feet, the 32 to the 36 feet part of the hull, the bow would also have a curved slope from the same 36-32 feet mark where the hulls beam is the widest. Just something I am playing with that has nothing to do with the topic of keeping the budget under $800 a month. Here I am derailing my own thread.

Back on topic, I was looking at some of the gear I would need on board an ocean going boat, radios, navigation, and other things some of which are not required but I would want on "My" boat especially some type of radar system, and I was blown away at the prices of some of the normal gear that is already on most of the used boats of which I was looking.

Shoot one site listed the price for their boat plans, that I think they screwed up on and forgot to place the decimal point on the prices, if they really were that high you would have to be a billionaire just to afford to buy the plans much less having it built. No way on earth I would pay a total of $116,000 for the complete set of plans and NC cut files even if I was rich enough to afford it. I think it suppose to be $1,160.00 for everything though. But some of the gear need on the boat cost more new than what some of the used boats cost with the same gear already on it cost to buy the whole boat.

I know what ever boat I get it is going to have to be rigged in a way that will allow me to sail from inside the cabin in bad weather or the pilot box in better weather. I figure adding an electric conversion kit to the winches will allow me to keep allot of strain off my back when using the winches to raise and lower the sails and in the case of some unforeseen loss of power I could still use the crank handle and do it manually. Since I would be using electric anchor winches I will need to add some backup anchors on manual winches too or a way to switch out the winch types if the electric winch goes down.

For now I am going to take some sailing classes and also buy an inflatable dingy that has a sail kit on it to play with on the small local lake. I found a used one nearby on Craigslist with the sail kit on it for $500. This will give me a small boat to play with as well as a spare dingy for the larger boat when I get it.

I just finish paying off the dentist office for a bill the insurance should have paid but didn't, so I can now add that payment amount to my boat kitty. This will allow me to increase the amount per month to go towards my boat to $200 up from $150. This be somewhat lower on the months that I have to refill my medications and if I buy extra snacks which I am trying not to do by the way.
Sorry Pal.... but you've just crossed over into fantasy La La land.

Before you dream any more about boating land, let me tell you about my day today here at anchor in Sardegna. Put yourself in our shoes and be realistic regarding your ability to do the necessary tasks with your list of disabilities.

Anchored mid day yesterday in a somewhat protected cove 25-30 knot expected winds today. Let out 200 ft heavy chain, 100 pound anchor with snubber. Even with the windlass it required bending over and some running around on deck.... The two of us.

Today, went snorkeling to check the anchor set in 25 knot winds... Got waterlogged swimming the 200 yards into the wind and wind-blown 18 inch chop. Anchor was fine.

Secured everything on deck and tensioned the dodger and Bimini in anticipation of 35-40 knot sustained winds. Pulled the stern toilet, dismantled it and replaced a leaking gasket (one hour squatting in a room with 20 inches x 20 inches of floor space)

Now we have sustained winds of 35 knots with 40-42 knot gusts which have been predicted to remain for the next three days. Just went out to check on the snubbers and anti Chaff gear. No way we can get to shore in a dinghy for a while.

This on a day where everything is working out just fine. Do you really think you can do this sort of stuff?? It comes up all the time. If you can.... I really question your level of physical disability.

Ken
Over and out... from reality.
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Old 14-08-2014, 14:26   #60
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Re: Possibilities Of Living Aboard On $800 Or Less

Yes, building...

It is neither sailing nor living aboard. Another modality, another thread perhaps.

STAY CLEAR OF BUILDING.

Unless you are filthy rich, or filthy skilled.

b.
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