Any Umbrella Liability Insurance for Expat Cruisers?

[Canibul]

No insurance of any kind is required here for any boat. But this is not about boats. It's about being sued once someone finds out you're worth suing.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Canibul

No insurance of any kind is required here for any boat. But this is not about boats. It's about being sued once someone finds out you're worth suing.

Change your Avatar back then.. who'd try to sue a Drongo who's gone Bush...

[BandB]

Originally Posted by Canibul

So, do any of the expats reading this carry large liability policies in case they get sued ?

Not an ex-pat but we do carry large liability policies, both business and personal supplemented with umbrellas.

Biggest fear requiring such a policy is death of anyone. That's from a slip and fall to an overboard to a kidnapping to natural causes or food poisoning or an infection. The chance of any of those things ever happening are very slim, but if it does, the cost can be huge.

[Canibul]

Not a big deal for a US resident to get the extra liability, I am finding, but so far I haven't been able to find a way to buy that type of policy once we moved to another country.

[boatman61]

See lots of Commercial Umbrella on a quick search..

[Canibul]

Originally Posted by boatman61

See lots of Commercial Umbrella on a quick search..

Yeah I found that early on. Geico, Nationwide (Soros!) etc. But digging into it, it's for US residents. US corporations. It typically does cover the insured when they travel overseas.

that doesn't apply in this case. We moved out of the USA 9 years ago.
With absolutely no plans to ever move back.

[cwyckham]

Originally Posted by Canibul

Not a big deal for a US resident to get the extra liability, I am finding, but so far I haven't been able to find a way to buy that type of policy once we moved to another country.

Any chance that's because there's no market for it?

[BandB]

Originally Posted by cwyckham

Any chance that's because there's no market for it?

Perhaps limited market where he is but in South America, Central America, Europe, there's a big market. Problem is US insurers don't offer it.

[cwyckham]

Originally Posted by BandB

Perhaps limited market where he is but in South America, Central America, Europe, there's a big market. Problem is US insurers don't offer it.

Of there's such a big market for it outside the US, why is it hard to find? I guess I just don't think people outside the US have much to fear from a lawsuit. Most don't need or want it.

[Canibul]

Originally Posted by cwyckham

Of there's such a big market for it outside the US, why is it hard to find? I guess I just don't think people outside the US have much to fear from a lawsuit. Most don't need or want it.

Try running your boat into an American.

[cwyckham]

Originally Posted by Canibul

Try running your boat into an American.

That's a good point. I believe that if I run my boat into an American in Canadian waters, they would need to take me to court in Canada. Same for any other country. I have no idea what would be the court in international waters, though the chances of such a collision in deep waters is pretty minimal.

Does anybody know if this is true? Or do all of us have to fear American flagged vessels because they might sue us (and win) in an American court for incidents outside the US?

If I ran my boat into an American and they sued me in a Canadian court, they'd be awarded actual damages, not millions in pain and suffering or whatever.

If an American was on my boat for cocktails and slipped on the way back over the rail to get to their dinghy, then they'd have to prove negligence on my part that allowed the injury to happen. Not likely to get too far in a Canadian court, I don't think.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Canibul

Yeah I found that early on. Geico, Nationwide (Soros!) etc. But digging into it, it's for US residents. US corporations. It typically does cover the insured when they travel overseas.

that doesn't apply in this case. We moved out of the USA 9 years ago.
With absolutely no plans to ever move back.

As long as you have not relinquished your USA passport, you have to send in a tax return for everything you have earned in another country.....
So you might as well use a USA address and get insurance.

[hellosailor]

"So you might as well use a USA address and get insurance. "

Insurers and other businesses can contractually define residency as "the place where you actually sleep". They don't have to go by the mythical residency on anyone else's paperwork. So "using a US address" ? Buys you nothing if the fine print requires actual physical residency.

[msponer]

I'm also interested in an umbrella policy that doesn't require either home owners or renters insurance (as Geico does).

An irrevocable trust would also solve this, but we aren't in a situation to do that.

[Canibul]

Okay, I have some answers. I contacted the Umbrella dept. at Geico. I also contacted a Personal Liability specialist in the south somewhere. I think it was Georgia or Alabama, one of them places up north.

And the answer has been consistent, and disappointing. Primary residence has to be in the USA. Citizenship not a factor, you can even get the liability with Home Renters insurance.

So that's that.