Perkins 4108 loosing coolant, another thread

[theglo]

I found a photo with the aft cap off. The heat exchanger, if equidistant front and back, extends this much from the coolant tank. Barely enough to attach it.

Ps, the new heat exchanger I put in is not pictured and is perfectly clean.

[theglo]

Originally Posted by theglo

I found a photo with the aft cap off. The heat exchanger, if equidistant front and back, extends this much from the coolant tank. Barely enough to attach it.

Ps, the new heat exchanger I put in is not pictured and is perfectly clean.

Consulting the Google & Youtube it appears thats the same protruding heat exchanger as its supposed to be. Manana I will make sure everything is pretty and smooth and reattach it, correctly.

THANK YOU!

[Scubaseas]

Based on the picture of the tube set you do not have it into the rear cap far enough. https://youtu.be/XgouW7vcJfY

Which would account for your coolant loss. Note on the tube set only one end looks like it's been in the boot clamp.

Thanks for the picture. It was Oh, you have one of THOSE moments.

[Scubaseas]

Originally Posted by theglo

I found a photo with the aft cap off. The heat exchanger, if equidistant front and back, extends this much from the coolant tank. Barely enough to attach it.

Ps, the new heat exchanger I put in is not pictured and is perfectly clean.

Good because that one while it looks like it was seated OK is about 50% clogged. Manana for me too. Have fun. I'm recovering from surgery so could use the entertainment of your labor. Happy to help if I can.

[Scubaseas]

Picture 2 of 4 doesn't look like the tube set is properly in the boot. Put the aft one together first, put it on the exchanger then do the front one.

[theglo]

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

Based on the picture of the tube set you do not have it into the rear cap far enough. https://youtu.be/XgouW7vcJfY

Which would account for your coolant loss. Note on the tube set only one end looks like it's been in the boot clamp.

Thanks for the picture. It was Oh, you have one of THOSE moments.

You are correct. Look at that wear on only one side where the hose clamp was!

Will check this out tomorrow. Good luck with the recovery.

[theglo]

What I did today. Cautiously optimistic. Pics to follow in next post or two.

1. I topped off the coolant with lime away and some radiator cleaner, water. Started it to a small puff of white smoke (very mild) but nothing after 2 seconds. Suds in exhaust immediately from lime away.

2. Ran for 15 minutes @ idle, with cap off, temp barely registered on gauge. Then shut down engine and drained coolant. It came out clear. Nothing in there.

3. Remove rubber end caps and heat exchanger. Definitely did not appear to be fully seated in the aft part of engine. Soaked bits and heat exchanger in descaler for a few hours and cleaned with 400 sand paper.

4. I have TWO heat exchangers on hand, one seems to pass coolant thru much easier than the other. I reinstalled this one. I say this as I was cleaning it and placed a hose in the holes where the coolant (not seawater) goes thru and one pushes the water easily out the holes on the opposite side of the heat exchanger. The other was sluggish about it. Likely due to my "radiator leak" debacle that started all this.

5. I tried to fully seat the aft boot onto the heat exchanger until it bottoms out first. When I do this there is definitely not enough tolerance on the front end cap to get a hose clamp on there. It literally will never work.

6. I got to the point where the aft one was at the limit of where the hose clamp would definitely catch the heat exchanger and then I was able to get the front one on here. A smaller hose clamp, thinner, would work great here. The tolerance is off as if the heat exchanger should be 1 or 2 inches longer. But, its made it at least a 1000 hours as such so its likely okay.

7. I did swap out my newer rubber end caps with some old vintage ones I have on hand as spares. THe old ones were the same part number, but were noticeable shorter, and easier to install with the tight tolerance.

8. I got everything back in there. Very frustrating trying to seat that heat exchanger with the tight tolerance and not being able to bottom it out on each side.

9. I then filled it back up with water and a bit more lime away and ran it.

10. It appears that there are no longer suds in the exhaust.

11. Also, the bubbling up out of the coolant cap hole I was having yesterday has dissapeared.


TOMORROW, I'm open to suggestion. I was not able to grab any block sealer today but will tomorrow.

BUT, I'm thinking maybe I should check and see if I've solved the problem, or at least put it back to where it was. I was going to drain this water and lime away and throw some coolant in there and then just throw her into cruising RPM here at the dock for an hour or two and see what happens.

What do you think? Should I continue with the block sealer or just test it now??

THanks again, photos to follow.

[theglo]

Trying to upload photos

[Scubaseas]

Do not put block sealer in yet. Test at dock first. Make sure you got all the lime away out of the cooling system. Good work. And good documentation. Note a part number does not an original part make. There are good quality thin band clamps. AWABS is one via Defender or West or someplace other than Antigua. Be mindful you may need to add coolant after the thermostat opens. Please stop mixing coolants. Buy extra if needed.

[Scubaseas]

When you order parts get the two o-rings that are inside the Bowman manifold. New end cap boots would be good. Ideally you would have pictures of the finished product. As long as you get the tube set clamped inside the boot you should be OK. A ratcheting box wrench would be a good tool to own for this job. Depending on your clamp either 1/4", 7mm or 8mm=5/16"

[c.K.]

Originally Posted by theglo

Thanks for the answer. Answers to your questions:

1. Oil is fine. It does lose a fair amount of oil. I add about 1.5 liters of oil to the engine for every 100 hours of run time. More or less. Oil is not chocolate it. I do not think any coolant is getting into the oil. I’ve only put ten or so hours since my last oil change, which was only a week ago. I change the oil every 100 hours so currently that’s about every two months. I don’t think coolant is getting in there.

2. The bubbles seem to get a little LESS as it warms up. But I could be wrong on that, haven’t watched them for a while warm up.

3. It DOES lose coolant while resting. In fact I used to think it didn’t matter if I was running it or NOT, but, now it seems that it loses coolant much faster when it is HOT.

4. I just, yesterday, replaced the heat exchanger with a new one I had on board. My question with the end caps was that it was a very tight tolerance. The heat exchanger only sticks into the rubber boot on each end about as far as a hose clamp is wide. It seemed like it should be longer. In fact, I may diss assemble it and attach the aft rubber boot first, así think it’s “more” prone to leakage and the attach the forward one.

Thanks!!

And do check inside that boot whether thegrove inside at the end is free of build up these end caps almost snap on over the ridge at the end of the tank there will be no play for the tube stack once both caps are installed properly THIS IS YOUR ISSUE FORGET THE REST
Good luck

[Scubaseas]

Originally Posted by c.K.

And do check inside that boot whether thegrove inside at the end is free of build up these end caps almost snap on over the ridge at the end of the tank there will be no play for the tube stack once both caps are installed properly THIS IS YOUR ISSUE FORGET THE REST
Good luck

Quite possibly so but he could have a head gasket issue caused by low coolant/overheating. It's possible to have two problems at once. Hopefully it's just the end cap issue. He won't know until he proofs it.

[theglo]

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

When you order parts get the two o-rings that are inside the Bowman manifold. New end cap boots would be good. Ideally you would have pictures of the finished product. As long as you get the tube set clamped inside the boot you should be OK. A ratcheting box wrench would be a good tool to own for this job. Depending on your clamp either 1/4", 7mm or 8mm=5/16"

I have added them to the list! I have all those tools. I am a yacht electrician back in the real world but don't tinker much with engines outside the peripherals... which, hopefully this problem stays a peripheral problem.

[theglo]

Originally Posted by c.K.

And do check inside that boot whether thegrove inside at the end is free of build up these end caps almost snap on over the ridge at the end of the tank there will be no play for the tube stack once both caps are installed properly THIS IS YOUR ISSUE FORGET THE REST
Good luck

I (think) I get how these are supposed to install. There is a groove in the boot that the heat exchanger butts up against. The problem is that, at least with my engine and heat exchanger, if I line the aft side up with the groove, then the forward boot is nearly a full inch away from the groove and wheneevr I try to tighten the hose clamp it will just slide off.

It almost appears that the heat exchanger should be an inch or two longer, or I could get my metal cutting wheel and buzz a 1/2" off each side of the Bowman coolant tank. I'm not going to do either of those things and just hope that I lucked out and got it seated on there the same as its been the last 1,000 hours it worked.

I've had a 4.108 and a 4.236 in prior boats and don't remember this being such a chore.

Anywho, I agree, I think that was the issue. We shall see!

[theglo]

Update, looking good still.

1. I ran the engine for a little bit, and then drained all the lime cleaner water that I had in there. I then ran a gallon or two of water thru the block until everything was clear and not lime cleaner looking.

2. I removed the thermostat housing and filled the block with coolant at that location, then installed an extra thermostat I have on hand (not new, could not find any on island). Then put it all back together and topped off coolant on reservoir tank.

3. I then ran the engine for about 45 minutes at 1850 RPM which is my go to cruising RPM for the past few hundred hours.

4. The engine never reached operating temperature, which I've no idea what that might be, but I've used the center of the gauge as my measurement. It was always slightly BELOW that. I'm hoping this means with all the cleaning, etc, I may have made my situation better and I can get a bit more RPM out of my engine (And speed). Will test that later when traveling.

5. I shut it down after 45 minutes of 1850RPM here at the dock, the temp raised a bit (to right at the halfway point) when it was shut off for a few minutes and not circulating.

6. What's next?

Later today, once it cools off, I'll check the coolant level and see how much coolant was lost... a ballpark estimate. If the level looks good I think we're out of the woods and headed to Guadeloupe at the next weather window!

Thanks all, a few photos to follow.