Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 05-08-2015, 20:23   #211
Registered User
 
gamayun's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Oakland, CA
Boat: Freedom 38
Posts: 915
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Quote:
Originally Posted by SqPeg View Post
More pics
It looks like the jib is self tending and on a traveler. Is this right? Curious how it works for you.

The jib is really the only frustrating thing about the Freedom boats. It has a cambar spar (or "widow maker" as my friends call it) inside the pocket to keep its shape, but the whole thing is a bit touchy. It just has a mind of its own.
__________________

__________________
gamayun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 07:35   #212
Registered User
 
micah719's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Somewhere in Germany
Boat: Modifying Steel Junk-rig Schooner - Tom Thumb 26
Posts: 1,404
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Here's an interesting blog!

Sail Twist | Sailing AUKLET

That post is about sail twist in a Reddish-style JR, on a Bolger Glasshouse Chebacco (spritsail mizzen); originally a gaff, then a Matt Layden-style roller furl balanced lug. Very interesting to see their learning curve, and their approach to solving typical boat-problems.

Of particular interest to me were the sheet spans, another way of adjusting twist in the JR. Also, the Reddish-style JR appeals to me the most, setting the greatest area on a short mast, and imho looking beautiful while doing it, kind of like an owl's wing.

Here's a pic from the link, showing the sheet span dangling below the sheet itself:

__________________

__________________
Ps 139:9-10 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
micah719 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 09:52   #213
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 575
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Panope, thanks for sharing a picture of your Witch. She is lovely and so cool. I also admire deeply the old rig styles and their practical nature.
__________________
alansmith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 10:07   #214
Registered User
 
Greatketch33's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 148
Quote:
Originally Posted by micah719
Here's an interesting blog! Sail Twist | Sailing AUKLET That post is about sail twist in a Reddish-style JR, on a Bolger Glasshouse Chebacco (spritsail mizzen); originally a gaff, then a Matt Layden-style roller furl balanced lug. Very interesting to see their learning curve, and their approach to solving typical boat-problems. Of particular interest to me were the sheet spans, another way of adjusting twist in the JR. Also, the Reddish-style JR appeals to me the most, setting the greatest area on a short mast, and imho looking beautiful while doing it, kind of like an owl's wing. Here's a pic from the link, showing the sheet span dangling below the sheet itself:
I love the color of the sail; nice!
__________________
Greatketch33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 10:09   #215
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 575
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Micah, thanks for this link. I am in Heaven...smile
__________________
alansmith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 11:26   #216
Registered User
 
Steady Hand's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Crewing 2016-2017 Available Globally
Boat: OPB = Still Searching for Her
Posts: 3,769
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

It is the LITTLE things that can get you!

Yesterday, I came across a mention of a very expensive stayed rig on a boat that had failed, causing the mast to break. Apparently the dismasting of the boat was in winds that were typical racing winds (nothing extreme) and the boat did not appear old (I am guessing 2010 or so).

The culprit?
A small fitting that connected one of the wire shrouds to the top of the mast broke, and the mast (with sail up) went over the side and snapped off about 4 feet above the deck.

This was on an expensive mast.

It serves as another example that the smallest (and likely the least expensive) of parts of a conventionally stayed rig can cause the catastrophic failure of the entire rig even when the conditions are not extreme.

Consequently, that little part, which may be inexpensive to purchase, relative to the cost of the boat or rig, may prove to cause a very expensive failure (of the entire rig) and even more expensive loss of the boat.

Something to think about.
__________________
Ahoy All Sailors! Do you need experienced crew for a long voyage either Atlantic, Pacific, Caribbean, PNW, ICW, coastal or across an ocean in 2016-2017? I am available on short notice. See my CF Profile "About Me" page for details. Happy to lend a hand!
Steady Hand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 11:57   #217
Registered User
 
micah719's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Somewhere in Germany
Boat: Modifying Steel Junk-rig Schooner - Tom Thumb 26
Posts: 1,404
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

That prompts me to another subject.....who here has already sketched out possible jury rigs if the main rig does fail? Which materials are to hand that might survive such an event? Spinnaker poles, sweeps, yulohs, dinghy masts & oars, popsicle sticks, etc? What form would the rig take? What backups do you have for aerials that might also have gone by the board?
__________________
Ps 139:9-10 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
micah719 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 13:51   #218
Registered User
 
Steady Hand's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Crewing 2016-2017 Available Globally
Boat: OPB = Still Searching for Her
Posts: 3,769
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Quote:
Originally Posted by micah719 View Post
That prompts me to another subject.....who here has already sketched out possible jury rigs if the main rig does fail? Which materials are to hand that might survive such an event? Spinnaker poles, sweeps, yulohs, dinghy masts & oars, popsicle sticks, etc? What form would the rig take? What backups do you have for aerials that might also have gone by the board?
Dismasting? Jury Rig?

That's why they invented a schooner!

Why?
With same size masts, they are redundant rigs, if one breaks you still have a duplicate mast. :big grin:

See the photo below for a really redundant system.
_____________

I think it is a good subject too, when one considers seamanship, and usually a good book on storms or seamanship will contain some illustrations of jury rigged masts.

But...Seems that nowadays with the prevalence of almost global air-sea rescue via EPIRB that fewer sailors attempt to jury rig (to sail the damaged boat to a port).

A few comments (which many here will possibly already know):

If you are a "trade winds" circumnavigator and use two poles to pole out your foresails, then use one of those or both (to be held to original mast stump or lashed together for more height).

The Antennae issue (dismasted, so lost VHF antennae) can probably be better solved by buying one of those cheap satellite texting gizmos so you can communicate via text messages even if you are in a raft or your dinghy etc. I would rather have a different system that does not depend on mast height or working electrical system (if boat is rolled it may be partially full of water). .
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Schooner Thomas Lawson 7 masts.jpg
Views:	90
Size:	42.0 KB
ID:	106827  
__________________
Ahoy All Sailors! Do you need experienced crew for a long voyage either Atlantic, Pacific, Caribbean, PNW, ICW, coastal or across an ocean in 2016-2017? I am available on short notice. See my CF Profile "About Me" page for details. Happy to lend a hand!
Steady Hand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 14:22   #219
Registered User
 
Steady Hand's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Crewing 2016-2017 Available Globally
Boat: OPB = Still Searching for Her
Posts: 3,769
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Here is another FSM boat I saw today for the first time.

Murray 33ft Cat Ketch

(50ft carbon fiber masts).

1998. Steel hull.
Specs:
LOA 33ft, Beam 10Ft 11in, LWL 27ft Depth 5ft10, Displ. 15 000 lbs,
Ballast 5200 lbs, Headroom 72.5

Currently listed on ebay for $75K

NOTE: I have no connection to the seller of this boat. I am merely posting this photo to illustrate the different types of FSM boats, some of which are for sale and to give us CF members an idea of the cost of different FSM boats today.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	FSM Murray 33 Cat Ketch Brewer design 50ft CF masts.jpg
Views:	116
Size:	171.1 KB
ID:	106829  
__________________
Ahoy All Sailors! Do you need experienced crew for a long voyage either Atlantic, Pacific, Caribbean, PNW, ICW, coastal or across an ocean in 2016-2017? I am available on short notice. See my CF Profile "About Me" page for details. Happy to lend a hand!
Steady Hand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 14:55   #220
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 171
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

I tried but failed to post a thumbnail or link to a JR currently for sale on Sailboat Listings - 36' Allied Princess - that ticks all the boxes for me, as she also has electric drive instead of diesel, composting head, Hydrovane self steering - all the eco-friendly bits and bobs to go with her low-tech hull and rig. A search by make and model doesn't find her; only by searching "JUNK" does she show up, very pretty yacht.

And that 7-masted schooner photo you posted, Steady - I think you'll find there is no redundancy there, as each mast will be stayed one to the other (triatic stays): when one goes, they all go. They seem too tall and close together to be individually stayed. That's one of the beauties of unstayed ketch or schooner rigs - no triatics .
__________________
NevisDog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 15:37   #221
Registered User
 
micah719's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Somewhere in Germany
Boat: Modifying Steel Junk-rig Schooner - Tom Thumb 26
Posts: 1,404
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Like the classics? Have a Beer! Lugger, that is.....I came across these when I was looking for a hot small boat rig. Apparently the dipping lug is the hottest, but has the drawback of being difficult to handle. The old fishermen and smugglers of Beer Beach get around that with an interesting tacking method:

Welcome to BeerLuggers.co.uk





Not sure if you can truly call it a free standing rig as they use shrouds, but there are other luggers that use the halyard as a kind-of running shroud that gets shifted to windward each tack. On a capable dinghy with FSM, one could have a lot of wet fun after a leisurely passage...
__________________
Ps 139:9-10 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
micah719 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2015, 17:30   #222
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 653
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

I really don't know anything about junks, but I think they look cool. Nothing to add but a picture that I took off Phuket of a glorious looking junk on a glorious day.

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	1438903743742.jpg
Views:	66
Size:	49.2 KB
ID:	106845   Click image for larger version

Name:	1438903770649.jpg
Views:	82
Size:	52.7 KB
ID:	106846  

__________________
daletournier is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2015, 04:55   #223
Registered User
 
Delancey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Gone Cruising
Boat: 40' sailboat
Posts: 2,996
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Wylie designed Ocean Planet for the Around Alone Race and the Vendee Globe with a free standing rotating mast. First two parts of a six part interview with the skipper Bruce Schwab. Nice tiller!



Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	P1050332.jpg
Views:	65
Size:	284.9 KB
ID:	106864   Click image for larger version

Name:	Ocean Planet SF Bay.jpg
Views:	63
Size:	21.2 KB
ID:	106865  

__________________
Delancey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2015, 05:04   #224
Registered User
 
Delancey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Gone Cruising
Boat: 40' sailboat
Posts: 2,996
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Omer wing sail on a Wally and a Bene

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	WOW-02-big.jpg
Views:	64
Size:	70.1 KB
ID:	106866   Click image for larger version

Name:	WingSail.jpg
Views:	75
Size:	146.1 KB
ID:	106867  

__________________
Delancey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2015, 07:11   #225
Registered User
 
Delancey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Gone Cruising
Boat: 40' sailboat
Posts: 2,996
Re: Sailboats with Free Standing Masts

Ill fated Team Phillips catamaran.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	imageResize.php.jpeg
Views:	68
Size:	79.2 KB
ID:	106870  
Attached Images
 
__________________

__________________
Delancey is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
mast, sailboat, sail

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Crew Available: FREE manpower for you! I just need experience on sailboats, will work for FREE rvisbal Crew Archives 7 22-10-2013 09:03
Catalina Free-Standing Mast? Dutchers Construction, Maintenance & Refit 3 02-06-2009 14:04
Morgan Out Islander 41' Standing Rigging for both Main & Mizzen masts worldstoreone Classifieds Archive 1 20-04-2009 14:17
Unstayed masts or stayed masts? Joli Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 29 22-07-2008 03:56
Origo 3000 Free Standing Double-burner Alcohol Stove Triton318 Classifieds Archive 3 26-05-2008 16:16


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:20.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.