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Old 22-10-2010, 16:51   #16
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Have you guys got washing machines/jacuzzis and sunken baths on board...
Sorry for going off on a tangent, but I was ready an old Cruising World and amazingly there was this multi-hull with a near full size bath tub! How awesome is it after a hard day of winter diving or surfing to have a long hot tub? I suppose you just need to find and extremely sheltered anchorage before you use the thing and a water maker would be handy?

As they say in The Castle, “Tell him he's dreaming”?

Anyway, my flu seems to have cleared so I am walking out the front to check out conditions for a surf or dive. Catch you all later!
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Old 22-10-2010, 17:14   #17
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LMAO.... Shane... you should take a look at some of the custom built Jongerts that were built.... the height of luxury... and some were REAL SAILBOATS as well... usually 17metres+....
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Old 22-10-2010, 17:41   #18
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I have noticed that most of these boats do not have 'extras' such as solar, wind gene etc... any suggestions on absolute neccessities & costs on what would bring a boat up to scratch for the pacific?
Might be useful to establish more or less where your scratch is?

All you need to sail the pacific is a sound boat with sails, navigation ability, and a bit of experience. That's the starting point. You don't need an engine, you don't even need water tanks ... jerry cans would do... I wish we could get ol' Josh Slocum on this forum.
In this day and age that entry level scratch is totally unacceptable to virtually all but the Pardey types... (we need a salute icon)

All additions are raising the scratch bar to meet the level of cruising lifestyle your particular dream needs.

It amazes me how the mention of watermakers always polarizes members here into the haves vs the have nots. The cruisers who say you don't need one are right, but you don't need GPS either, and I'd bet dollars to donuts the nay sayers have got their handy little lifestyle improving GPSs firmly in their grip.

So, decide how much you want to enjoy the whole adventure and what your day to day standard of living needs to be like to achieve that. To me, having an endless supply of water for showers and washing is a big part of that, in your home for a number of years.
Being free to spend lengthy periods away from marinas may also be important, so battery and power generation could be a factor in determining what your scratch is.

Once you've got your life aboard clearly in your mind, you'll know where your scratch is, and if it's out of reach, you can at least work out what level of itch you're prepared to wear....

On your budget you may even find a boat coming out of an adventure you're about to start that will have most of the stuff you want anyway.
If you do..... I hope I get to it first!!!

Good luck

Vic
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Old 22-10-2010, 17:52   #19
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cruiser advice for pacific isls live aboard

Hi Seachange,

Do not be afraid to sail whichever yacht you buy back yourselves. There are many good boats available in your price range. Don't forget to allow for the 'extras' Australian Customs will add to the purchase price before applying the GST (see their website). We did this in 2008 (even though we are now moving to the dark side our website www.kekada.com has the trip details under previous voyages). The buying opportunities in the US are even better now than when we did it.

Cheers, Anja & Don
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Old 22-10-2010, 17:59   #20
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Have you guys got washing machines/jacuzzis and sunken baths on board...
Phil,
You're being way too modest... but you don't fool us...
We all know it's not only us.
You've got all those gizmos tucked inside your boat too, PLUS with your personal masseuse, wine cellar etc
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Old 22-10-2010, 18:07   #21
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my "semi-sister ship" (gaff rigged version) has been singled handed with some passages as long as 5 weeks between landfall with no water maker, no built in water tanks (just jugs), no engine, no self steering gear (balanced well enough to just lash the tiller), no electricity, etc.....just what really IS needed. Some things will make life alot more comfortable and will make up for other short comings in the ability of the boat and/or crew. After examining everything you can start to eliminate what is truly unnecessary and use the added space for things that are better needed. My boat when I got it was repetitively bare bones for a "blue water boat", what I am adding is *needed* but I am adding to make life alot more comfortable.
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Old 22-10-2010, 23:38   #22
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Hi All
wow, thankyou for all your feed back!!! ... controversial question I take it. We have made a few deductions from the answers & from further trawling of the forums.

1. we deffinitely want a water maker - we have no shame to admit & no desire to pretend that we are hardened sea farers. We have gone back to basics in our time (as a devoted climber I spent a year living in a tent) but now we are a little older & like a few creature comforts not 5 star but maybe 3.

2. despite the very reasonable suggestions to get a 30 something footer to start with we are just not keen to be on anything less than 40 something foot. Currently living on 60 acres in a remote rural part of Aus we are used to space & the idea of spending the next few years living in our bathroom just does not appeal. Neither does sleeping in a letter box slot. (it is all about personal choice of experience, non?)

We would prefer a 2 cabin / 2 bth & head owners version, light & airy and with a good galley (as a chef I like my kitchen). Not too fussy on interior design... retro can be beautiful can't it?

3. we are however listening at your voices of concern when it comes to boat selection & think that the suggestion is: Beneteau First are probably the strongest of these mass production models, with older (c.1991) Jeanneaus as a close second. We are now prepared to consider older model boats if they are truely better built, so long as they fit with our needs (see point 2)... don't know if there are other makes or models we should consider (i saw a 1988 H Rassy for sale for a bit more in Panama for example). What about a Freedom? Biggest problem with other non mass production boats it seems is there are only ever one of each, so shopping around is some what harder.

4. we wish that we could get one in Aus but given that the US has 10 times our population it wins hands down for choice & availability. Which means that we need to get it home Safely. Perhaps the Pacific run is "champagne" at the right time of year?!? we want to sail the Pacific but it seems that simply getting the boat there changes the requirements of 'needs'.

5. Is there any actual safety issues with sailing a production yacht across the Pacific or is it purely a comfort issue?

6. There seems to be no right or wrong answer for draft - rather choose the right boat to start with.

Any further suggestions on boat types are super welcome, super thanks
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Old 22-10-2010, 23:55   #23
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Where a water maker is truly needed is in the ditch bag, a hand pump version. For the boat itself the expense would better be put to extra water tanks (fewer things to go wrong than with a water maker).
On that subject I do recommend to make sure tanks can be separately filled and turned off and you have a good filtration system for the water you do get (I have a 2 stage filter, the second 0.2 micron ceramic filter that filters out 99.9% of all ecoli)
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Old 23-10-2010, 00:58   #24
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Thats the thing. Many times we have had these opionated debates here and they are just opinated debates. Usually from people who have not sailed where the poster intends sailing.

In the last 2 years 3 boats I know sunk in the Pacific. None were Hunters, Jeneaus or Beneteaus.


What were they?

Oz
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Old 23-10-2010, 01:22   #25
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5. Is there any actual safety issues with sailing a production yacht across the Pacific or is it purely a comfort issue?

There are no safety issues you need to consider. Well no more issues than you would expect crossing one of the longest point to point laylines on the planet.

Just to get started. The rigging on a production boat is designed for weekending, coastal passages and weekly charters. So, you will need to upgrade that.

The batteries wont cope with the electric autopilot so you will need to add a vane, more crew or more batteries and charging sources.

You will need an HF radio at minimum. You may as well buy a sat phone as well.

Obviously each crewmember will require a 406 epirb as well as one for the raft and one for the boat.

If the boat has a raft, its probably a coastal. It will need to be replaced with a solas (more emergency rations, tougher construction etc.)

You will need to stock up on engine parts. Its no good trying to buy a new oil filter, when your 300 miles from the nearest land let alone the nearest Yanmar dealer.

Thats just a few real basics. Real basics. I may cause some argument over the raft and rigging, but hey- thats my 2 cents. Most of Alan Lucas's books give you a good indication of the type of stuff you will need.
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Old 23-10-2010, 01:30   #26
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With little experience I believe the biggest safety concern might just be the first 5,000 km or so passage non-stop across the open Pacific Ocean? Without sounding like a pessimist there are a million and one things that could potentially go wrong. It really doesn’t matter what boat you end up with, if the sea wants it can be down-right cruel. Anything from a combination of lack of experience, chronic seasickness, mechanical/rigging/sail failure, madness and weather could really turn the trip ordinary to say the least.

Nevertheless, heaps of people have done it. I have lost the link to this totally inexperienced Scandinavian bloke who sailed with a mate from America to NZ in an Erickson 30 without having any major dramas. When buying my first “real” boat I was inspired by his success, but ended up buying a boat over here. I am glad I did as I learnt a lot of invaluable lessons. For the same reason I am sure most people will be recommending if you decide to go ahead with your plan spend a bit of time over there coastal cruising before doing the open sea?

Looking on the brighter side, I suppose another utterly horrible thing is that you might get stranded somewhere mid pacific and have to wait out the cyclone/hurricane season in a tropical paradise? Just make sure you have enough funds for these contingencies or you might end up like others who have made Australia without enough cash to pay the import duty.
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Old 23-10-2010, 02:39   #27
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As the design of my boat was commissioned in 1949 (when boats were much different), and a wooden boat builder spent 5 years of his life building this boat fitting it carefully and lovingly together (over building where possible) later being customized to my likes.....the experience is much different than that of production boat built around what marketing feels will be the "average user".
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Old 23-10-2010, 03:13   #28
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What were they?

Oz
One was an S&S 47footer; a McIntosh 47 cutter sloop; and a J44

s/v Elusive Sinks on Way to Fiji



For Seachange: Watermakers can cost $10,000 to $15,000 to install a new one with good water capacity to shower (properly) daily. But yes, one would be fantastic!!!!!!!!!!!!

By the way, for folks inexperienced with boats it would be a harder task to maintain on old boat, or get a fixer-upper ready for sea.
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Old 23-10-2010, 03:36   #29
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Might be useful to establish more or less where your scratch is?

I wish we could get ol' Josh Slocum on this forum.
In this day and age that entry level scratch is totally unacceptable to virtually all but the Pardey types... (we need a salute icon)...,,,,,

Good luck

Vic
Vic,

Glad to meet another Pardey fan. I have found there books totally indispensable. They kind of tell you about all that stuff the salesmen trying to sell you those production boats at the boat shows either don’t know or won’t tell you. I would totally recommend anyone who was going out to buy a cruiser to buy their books. Even if you don’t totally agree with their philosophy they definitely give a lot of sound advice.

Then Slocum’s “Sailing Around the World Alone” is one of the books of the passage maker’s New Testament? (Again, no blasphemy intended).

Sorry if it sounds like I am turning the thread into a personal conversation. To the contrary, the more of this type of literature you can read before your purchase and voyage the better prepared you will be for either.
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Old 23-10-2010, 03:43   #30
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As the design of my boat was commissioned in 1949 (when boats were much different), and a wooden boat builder spent 5 years of his life building this boat fitting it carefully and lovingly together (over building where possible) later being customized to my likes.....the experience is much different than that of production boat built around what marketing feels will be the "average user".
Sounds like a beautiful boat. Having a Herroshoff – another grand American design - I can also appreciate how well some of these classics handle the open ocean. I have had people laugh at my low free-board and an ex navy officer (ex) mate was even silly enough to seriously ask, “will this thing tip”. Seriously, for her size she is extremely seaworthy. This is really why I think it is great to get a variety of viewpoints from people on this forum.
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