Northern Europe during Pandemic -- Summers 2020 & 2021 & onwards

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

Tell that to those who died from it, and unless Big Pharma are grifters who injected you with a placebo, those who did not inject themselves pose no threat to those that did.

... so you can't answer the questions, and we get a bonus antivax flourish.
I guess that's an answer after all.

I would bet that for every person who actually died from being vaccinated (and not from comorbidities), I could find a HUGE number of unvaccinated people who died in hospital KNOWING that if they'd only gotten vaccinated, they would not be dying. People like you who spread misinformation helped kill them.

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

People like you who spread misinformation.

I haven't spread any misinformation. How about you quote me.

[sv_pelagia]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

I haven't spread any misinformation. How about you quote me.

Feb 14: "vaccinations and 'boosters' are not effective, nor do they prevent the spread of the virus"

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by sv_pelagia

Feb 14: "vaccinations and 'boosters' are not effective, nor do they prevent the spread of the virus"

Which is accurate.

Riddle me this: How many vaxx and boosters have you had? At best it is a treatment, at best.

How is this misinformed IE misinformation?

Even IF it was, I do not have the reach of the MSM, therefore I'm in no position to "help killing" people either. It is an asinine accusation, completely retarded.

Ninja
The average vaccine is tested for 10-15 years before it is approved for use on human beings, for how long have the COVID vaxx (and rolled out boosters) been tested?

[sv_pelagia]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

Which is accurate.

How is this misinformed IE misinformation?

Even IF it was, I do not have the reach of the MSM, therefore I'm in no position to "help killing" people either. It is an asinine accusation, completely retarded.

Because it IS misinformation!

From: https://yourlocalepidemiologist.subs...d-boosters?s=r

Cue Kaiser Permanente. They published a study this week in Nature. (Note that the study was funded by Moderna). Kaiser has an incredibly extensive database because of their closed health system, making this sort of study among a huge population feasible. The scientists leveraged a sample of over 26,000 patients to assess VE against infections and severe disease. What did they find?

Protection against infection waned, regardless of booster status. This is no surprise and another indicator that we really need to shift our focus away from infection to severe disease.

During Delta, VE of 2 and 3 doses against hospitalization was ≥99%.

During Omicron, VE of 2 and 3 doses against hospitalization was 84.5% and 99.2%, respectfully.

The 4 people hospitalized with Omicron despite three mRNA doses were more than 60 years of age with chronic diseases, and one was also immunocompromised. (Immunocompromised people really need to get their fourth dose!)

The number of boosted hospitalizations in this study was so low researchers were not able to measure any possible waning.

AND

recent U.S. study published in MMWR. This study analyzed data from a network of hospitals across 10 states during August 26, 2021–January 22, 2022. The scientists wanted to evaluate mRNA vaccine effectiveness (VE) against hospitalizations over time. What did they find?

Two doses: VE for hospitalizations was 93% <2 months of a booster → VE was 80% >4 months after a booster

Three doses: VE for hospitalizations was 95% <2 months of a booster → VE was 81% >4 months after a booster

Of course, perhaps you have your own personal definition of effectiveness....

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

I haven't spread any misinformation ...

You, certainly, haven’t provided any evidence, to support your radically sweeping & negative opinions, typically delivered in a caustic manner,
If extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence*, you’ve failed, totally, to offer anything but opinions.

* “Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence” was a phrase, made popular by Carl Sagan, who reworded Laplace's principle, which says that: “the weight of evidence for an extraordinary claim must be proportioned to its strangeness”

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by sv_pelagia

Because it IS misinformation!

From: https://yourlocalepidemiologist.subs...d-boosters?s=r

Cue Kaiser Permanente. They published a study this week in Nature. (Note that the study was funded by Moderna). Kaiser has an incredibly extensive database because of their closed health system, making this sort of study among a huge population feasible. The scientists leveraged a sample of over 26,000 patients to assess VE against infections and severe disease. What did they find?

Protection against infection waned, regardless of booster status. This is no surprise and another indicator that we really need to shift our focus away from infection to severe disease.

During Delta, VE of 2 and 3 doses against hospitalization was ≥99%.

During Omicron, VE of 2 and 3 doses against hospitalization was 84.5% and 99.2%, respectfully.

The 4 people hospitalized with Omicron despite three mRNA doses were more than 60 years of age with chronic diseases, and one was also immunocompromised. (Immunocompromised people really need to get their fourth dose!)

The number of boosted hospitalizations in this study was so low researchers were not able to measure any possible waning.

AND

recent U.S. study published in MMWR. This study analyzed data from a network of hospitals across 10 states during August 26, 2021–January 22, 2022. The scientists wanted to evaluate mRNA vaccine effectiveness (VE) against hospitalizations over time. What did they find?

Two doses: VE for hospitalizations was 93% <2 months of a booster → VE was 80% >4 months after a booster

Three doses: VE for hospitalizations was 95% <2 months of a booster → VE was 81% >4 months after a booster

Of course, perhaps you have your own personal definition of effectiveness....

Even IF that would be accurate, the (IFR) is 0.26% to 0.27%, that hardly justifies vaxx and boosters, or to mandate them, or shutting down society for 2+ years.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....13.20101253v2

Recent COVID deaths in Ireland. Over 63% fully vaccinated.
https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/...0Week%2048.pdf

In Israel, nearly 60% of hospitalizations, fully vaccinated.
https://www.beckershospitalreview.co...udy-finds.html

According to the UK government’s own stats, people who are triple vaxxed are 4,5 times more likely to be infected with Omricon than people who are unvaccinated.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulat...tiveforcovid19

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

Which is accurate.

Riddle me this: How many vaxx and boosters have you had? At best it is a treatment, at best.

How is this misinformed IE misinformation?

Even IF it was, I do not have the reach of the MSM, therefore I'm in no position to "help killing" people either. It is an asinine accusation, completely retarded.

Still more misinformation. And I made you uncomfortable... good. It proves that you still have a conscience in there somewhere.

CF is media. Facebook is media.

The average vaccine is tested for 10-15 years before it is approved for use on human beings, for how long have the COVID vaxx (and rolled out boosters) been tested?

They compressed the vaccine development timeline by doing many steps in parallel. Ie developing manufacturing capability while waiting for trials to complete. Was this accelerated development more risky? ... maybe. But there was a pandemic. And we now have more than enough data to confirm that the vaccines are safe and effective... so the accelerated development paid off.

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

Even IF that would be accurate, the (IFR) is 0.26% to 0.27%, that hardly justifies vaxx and boosters, or to mandate them, or shutting down society for 2+ years.

You're wrong about IFR, but anyway there isn't one number that accurately protrays the risks that the world faced from the pandemic. It's more complex than that.

Society wasn't shut down. Vaccination has absolutely worked to limit illness and death, and to help bring the pandemic to its apparent end now. Global stats show how higher vaccination rates result in fewer deaths. Period.

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Still more misinformation.

Nothing in that quote was misinformation either.

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

CF is media. Facebook is media.

As for CF and Facebook it is not MSM, and most people do not seek out medical advice here or on Facebook, anymore they seek out medical advice from politicians.

Most people seek out medical advice from their doctor, with whom they have a doctor patient relationship.


Added.

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

You're wrong about IFR, but anyway there isn't one number that accurately protrays the risks that the world faced from the pandemic. It's more complex than that.

I'm not the source and neither is the IFR wrong, I have also pointed out in the past that overweight, fat and obese people are more receptive to both infection and to succumb to the virus. This was known early on.

Which is why the US has the highest mortality rate.

[Montanan]

Almost a third of people report lingering symptom 6-12 months after COVID-19 -study

https://www.yahoo.com/news/almost-th...162711214.html


Almost a third of people report at least one ongoing symptom between 6 and 12 months after their coronavirus infection, a survey of 152,000 people in Denmark has found. The study includes one of the largest groups yet of people who were not hospitalised with COVID, and followed them for longer than other major studies, the researchers from Denmark's State Serum Institute (SSI) said.

The questionnaire-based study suggested that the most commonly reported long-term symptoms were changes in sense of smell and taste, as well as fatigue.

Conducted between September 2020 and April 2021, well before the recent Omicron variant surge, the survey compared the responses of 61,002 people who had tested positive for the coronavirus six, nine or 12 months before with those of 91,878 people who had tested negative. In total, 29.6% of the respondents who had tested positive reported at least one ongoing physical symptom 6 to 12 months after infection, compared to 13% in the control group. Just over half (53.1%) of those with positive tests said they had experienced either mental or physical exhaustion, sleep problems or cognitive problems within the 6 to 12 months after infection. That compared to 11.5% in the control group.

. . .

the results are another sign that the long tail of COVID-19 should be considered by policy makers. "It's something you should take into account when you are weighing up the risks and benefits of... the interventions you are making, and vaccinations,"


Estimates on the prevalence of what is known as long COVID vary. The World Health Organization (WHO) calls the syndrome Post-COVID-19 condition and defines it as ongoing symptoms - including fatigue or shortness of breath, among others - three months after the initial infection that last at least two months. The WHO estimates that between 10% and 20% of people are affected

. . .

“If Omicron is causing long Covid at the same rate as these earlier variants, we could be looking at a major crisis over the next 12 months given the number of people who have been exposed to this virus,”

For sure there is much more to this disease than just weathering through and recovering from the acute infection stage. There is lingering harm.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

Nothing in that quote was misinformation either.

As for CF and Facebook it is not MSM, and most people do not seek out medical advice here or on Facebook, anymore they seek out medical advice from politicians.

Most people seek out medical advice from their doctor, with whom they have a doctor patient relationship with.

Do better.

You should quit posting. Your desperate floundering makes your current discomfort obvious. Well, you earned it. Antivax misinformation has killed people.

[Montanan]

COVID infected patients at risk for 20 types of heart and vascular disease: Study
https://www.yahoo.com/news/covid-inf...021805538.html

Long-term cardiovascular outcomes of COVID-19
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-022-01689-3

People infected with COVID-19 are at risk of having a cardiovascular disease-related incident 30 days after having been infected by the virus, researchers showed in a recent report in the journal Nature Medicine.

The report found those with COVID-19 are potentially susceptible to developing 20 different heart and vascular diseases including among others: heart failure, pericarditis, myocarditis, stroke, cerebrovascular disorders, and dysrhythmias. Even individuals who were not hospitalized with the infection were found to have developed more cardiovascular disease than those who were never infected, the study said.

"There were 20 cardiac disorders that were diagnosed for those patients that are suffering from long haul COVID. The most common is the shortness of breath and fatigue," Dr. Evelina Grayver, MD, the Director of women’s heart health program at Northwell Health in NY . "The new arrhythmias, or the abnormal heart rhythms that people experience, are significant as well and can become incredibly handicapping for a lot of patients,"

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

You should quit posting. Your desperate floundering makes your current discomfort obvious. Well, you earned it. Antivax misinformation has killed people.

Do better.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

Do better.

So you're just here to troll. Ah, that's OK then. As long as you're "nice".

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

So you're just here to troll. Ah, that's OK then. As long as you're "nice".

Now you're projecting.