450: Lagoon 450 Modifications

[boom23]

Roetter, the bimini looks great! Like you, I always try to avoid opening new holes on a boat. Great job!

[Hammer]

What an amazing job Roetter. I like how you used existing points to mount it. The whole thing looks like a bought one.

[DavefromNZ]

Superb Roetter. Bimini looks great and well thought out. Dave

[DavefromNZ]

I finally managed to bolt on some handrails to the stern step area. Each one was a standard 600mm x 19mm stainless tube. The holes I drilled for the bolts were 9mm dia. Each handrail cost about NZD70.

Feeling bit safer now on the steps.

Cheers
Dave

[Steve_C]

Roetter, I was very sorry to hear about the loss of your vessel. I wish you the very best in your efforts to replace it. I cannot imagine how difficult that was.

I would be very interested to know if you plan to go with the 450 again, and what you would do the same, and also what differently next time.

Thanks Roetter

[videorov]

Originally Posted by ClearHorizons

Another modification we did on our Lagoon 450 was the addition of a front step from the front deck to the cabin top. I am quite short and my little legs could not reach up so we inserted a step and rail for me to hold on to.

We had a step inserted between the two front hatches. Then a rail on the mast. The first photo shows the step and the next two are the rail on the mast. The last three photos are the demonstration of me climbing up on the step while using the rail. It works just as well when you descend.

Please see the photos below.

Very nice idea with the step and grab bar.

[roetter]

Originally Posted by Steve_C

Roetter, I was very sorry to hear about the loss of your vessel. I wish you the very best in your efforts to replace it. I cannot imagine how difficult that was.

I would be very interested to know if you plan to go with the 450 again, and what you would do the same, and also what differently next time.

Thanks Roetter

Steve
I have already ordered the same boat with the same options again. I am planning to do the same Bimini. For the solar I am planning to increase the total installed power from 950 to 1440W. The panels were totally unobtrusive as an extension to the cockpit roof so larger will be ok. Also, an increased sun shade and even more rain protection is also a welcomed improvement. We found ourselves lowering our sun screens quite often in the early morning and late afternoon. I also need to have an even number of panels to be able to stay with one Outback. The total power is more than it can handle, but I never had full output from the panels anyway, probably due to temperature related performance degrading. But six panels in series would be over the maximum voltage the charger could handle. Working in series was working great though. So now I will go 3S2P for the panels.

For the solar I am still pondering a simple and fool prof way to lower and raise the panels. In the morning and afternoon, when the sun is low, I could get more power out of them and also get more shade to keep the heat down in the cockpit.

[Steve_C]

Thanks Again Roetter, I am a few years behind you but I want the 450 also. I am glad to hear you will go with it again. I also totally agree with your strategy on the Bimini, and the Solar panels. It works so much better than having them on top of the davits right in your view. I have been thinking a lot about how to build in some type of tilt to the type of panel mounting you used.

Please keep us up to date on the progress.

[Seaqul]

Roetter,
First, sorry to hear about your loss. Must be hard. Second, if you are back to another 450, it must have met your expectations +. I have followed your solar mod with interest and had some serious concerns about the wing effect of such a broad expanse of panels (if you add even more) aft, especially if you were to encounter winds edging toward hurricane, or while hiding out at anchor. Also was concerned with the bow down push effect as your stern lifts while running down a large swell, especially on a cat lighter than a 450. What was your experience. Do you have a plan for those circumstances? I know ARC was quite windy on your crossing but you kept it downwind. Any comments or recommendations?

[roetter]

Originally Posted by Seaqul

Roetter,
First, sorry to hear about your loss. Must be hard. Second, if you are back to another 450, it must have met your expectations +. I have followed your solar mod with interest and had some serious concerns about the wing effect of such a broad expanse of panels (if you add even more) aft, especially if you were to encounter winds edging toward hurricane, or while hiding out at anchor. Also was concerned with the bow down push effect as your stern lifts while running down a large swell, especially on a cat lighter than a 450. What was your experience. Do you have a plan for those circumstances? I know ARC was quite windy on your crossing but you kept it downwind. Any comments or recommendations?

I was concerned about the wind effect as well. That is why I 'only' used the 5 190W panels on Next Life. However, I never experienced height loads on the panels. Crossing the Atlantic we had 45 knots from the aft, which is the highest load direction. For a real storm I would probably angle the panels 25 degrees downwards. In a storm you would usually run with the wind.

From all other directions the panels do not pose a problem. Kazaio, another L450, has the identical setup and they are extremely happy with them. I just helped them locate a bad connection from the charger to the batteries on long distance diagnostics, and they reported back 71A max with 350Ah+ every day last week around the Turks and Caicos. Not bad for a time when days are still less than 12 hours long.

My next design will have 6 240W panels.

[careka]

My next design will have 6 - 240W panels.
--------
Will it be 1 Outback, or 2. ?

[D&D]

Greetings all,

We just noticed a few of the comments about solar panels above the davits being in the way and blocking the view. So we thought we should point out that it's not necessarily so...







Those are high efficiency panels with 654W rated output. Under reasonably clear skies they handle our power requirements both underway and at anchor almost completely, apart from hot water or a high-wattage toaster. Even with the sun low in the sky or with light overcast, they continue to pump amps into the batteries. The panels were a slightly larger investment than other alternatives, but we reckon they were excellent value...and we are very much enjoying the absence of listening to engines!

Rather than block the view, we reckon our panels improve it. There is now a shaded/sheltered area above and around the dinghy, still with plenty of headroom across the duckboard, and the panels appear very consistent with the boat's overall appearance. We receive many compliments on how nice the panels look.

As for putting panels above the bimini, or just the question of whether to have a hard bimini, we considered that too and we were very tempted, but we're now glad we didn't go that way. The bimini is great when the weather's not so good, but when it's fine we love being able to look up (and even lie on our backs doing so!) from the flybridge area. Especially on fine nights when the sky is full of stars it's a glorious way to spend a night watch...or just be up there with a drink on anchor...

Check out our website for other cruising-in-comfort ideas...

[roetter]

I guess the post about "solar panels above the davits will be shaded often" meant a mounting directly above the davits, not 2 meters up.

I thought i had posted my solar design here, but just saw that it is only in the "Purchasing and commissioning" thread. So here it goes:

We installed two identical systems on L450 hulls #130 and #132 while commissioning in Les Sables. We managed to get a pallet of 10 Kyocera KD190 for 200 Euro each.

Each installation consists of:
5 KD190 190W (total 950W) solar panels $1400
1 solar cables, connectors, fuse about $100
1 Outback FlexMax80 $700 each.
2 aluminum profiles 50mm by 90mm $180.
2 stainless tubes 25mm $50
4 stainless end-caps $25
2 attachment plates for on top of posts $250
1 cables, connectors, fuse $50
Total = less than $3k

2 holes to drill in the cockpit roof for the middle hinge for the forward profile.
1 hole to drill in the aft of the boat for the solar cables to pass in.

All major attachment points use existing structure. No extra holes to drill, no welding to be done. All can and has been done with simple hand tools.

Real world performance data
- Max 71A
- 450+Ah in summer in the Med
- 350+Ah in March in Turks and Caicos

The total weight of all support structure is about 30kg.
5 KD 190 are 80Kg together, charger is about 6kg
The total weight is about 116kg
The windage is minimal. We crossed the Atlantic with 45 knots from the aft without any high loads on them.

The panels provided additional functions.
- Rain protection - without them the back rest of the seat in the cockpit gets wet even with no wind. With the solar panels extending almost 1m aft of the cockpit roof, it needs some wind to drive the rain into the cockpit.
- Sun protection - great when it gets too hot. Lower them for even more shade early morning and late afternoon.
- Extra spot to put a cloth line
- Attachment point for a 6-times purchase to pull overboard person out of the water.
- Attachment point to hoist dinghy motor.

[D&D]

Originally Posted by roetter

I guess the post about "solar panels above the davits will be shaded often" meant a mounting directly above the davits, not 2 meters up.

I thought i had posted my solar design here, but just saw that it is only in the "Purchasing and commissioning" thread. So here it goes:

The attached pics didn't come through so well, but it looks like a nice installation roetter. .

You certainly beat us on budget! We only needed one hole drilled, but the welding cost us as much as the panels. The Admiral here would not accept any visible connectors, bolts, etc so for us it had to be welded.

[roetter]

Sorry about the pictures. Here they are again.