Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 06-02-2017, 15:49   #16
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK/Portugal
Posts: 20,121
Images: 2
Send a message via Skype™ to boatman61
pirate Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

SSR is not a proof of ownership.. and all you need to do is send it to the SSR office address printed on it and it will be de-registered.
Part 1 is proof of ownership and will list any part owners/mortgage etc.. protocol/forms for de-registration can be found on line..


https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ister-msf-4744
__________________


"Your not drunk if you can lay on the floor without holding on..."
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 16:05   #17
Long Range Cruiser
 
MarkJ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,828
Images: 25
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

The old owner de-flags it. Presents you with the original Builders Certificate. He provides proof of USA importation.
You pay and receive bill of sale

If no importation has been paid its only 2% into the USA and maybe a state tax. Still its not much but u need to fact it it in.

None of it is hugely difficult.

You are wise to have a documentation company do it.

Do not pay nuffin till you see a builders certificate
__________________

__________________
MarkJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 16:12   #18
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK/Portugal
Posts: 20,121
Images: 2
Send a message via Skype™ to boatman61
pirate Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

Mark.. I've owned 15 boats to date and not yet seen a builders certificate.. not even when I bought a 5yr old boat from Moorings with just the 1 owner..
__________________


"Your not drunk if you can lay on the floor without holding on..."
boatman61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 17:25   #19
Senior Cruiser
 
Symphony's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Ct
Boat: ex-Tartan 4100
Posts: 454
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

Mark, you always have good info/ideas - but I've never seen a Builder's Cert either. I have only purchased boats built or imported to the US. Maybe that's a difference?

I might look at a UK flagged boat in the near future so I am interested
__________________
Symphony
Tartan 4100
Symphony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 17:40   #20
Long Range Cruiser
 
MarkJ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,828
Images: 25
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

Maybe some countries are different.
It slowed the purchase of my boat until they got Beneteau to issue one.

It was de-flagged France then flagged Australia.

I was under the impression that any boat built in another country needed one.

Anyway the op needs an expert to advise him so he knows the costs.

__________________
MarkJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 17:48   #21
Senior Cruiser
 
Vasco's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Toronto
Boat: CS36Merlin, "La Belle Aurore" Ben393 "Breathless"
Posts: 7,107
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

I've had three boats and a builder's certificate for each one. If I remember right documentation (registration) at least in Canada requires one. Without one how is one to know where the boat was built?
__________________
Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beneteau393/
Vasco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 17:55   #22
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 19
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

thank you so much for all the input and the references.

it is an old boat a Pearson Vanguard. current owner says it doesnt matter but i am just not that confident. i dont think there is a problem with him or his intent but just too open ended for me .... the problem / challenge is that although it is a nice specimen for its age ...
.
i am concerned about getting in too deep vs the value .... and as a 30 year veteran of entrepreneurship in the US and items like sales tax audits and excise tax audits and city an county bureocratic bs about signage and dumpster location etc etc etc. it matters to me.

i dont want to own this boat for a few years and then some agency shows up and tells me i owe them a fee for importing my own boat into my own country-- that i dont think has actually ever left other than maybe a few trips to the Bahamas

i really do appreciate the input -i have a decision to make .... thanks for the help
__________________
drakes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 19:28   #23
Registered User
 
matauwhi's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Bay of Islands, New Zealand
Boat: Mason 53
Posts: 652
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

G'day, Mate. Just an FYI for the readers on the subject here in New Zealand. NZ does not require boats to be registered if you are not sailing into international waters. I fully imported (all duty and taxes paid) my Mason 53 into New Zealand back in 2001 and left it US flagged and documented.

The importation would allow ANY future buyer to leave and return the vessel to New Zealand, as often as they liked, and for as long as they liked, without any further taxes or duty.

Maintaining the US flag allowed the boat to be taken in and out of the country without going through the Cat 1 inspection program which is required for yachts carrying a N.Z.

Any potential buyer could search against the U.S. documentation for any lien issues (which there are none).

All the best. Cheers.
__________________
matauwhi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 19:38   #24
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 410
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

I'm sure UK law is like the US. You can't have a US documented boat owned by a company (LLC, corp. etc.) that is controled by foreigners.
__________________
jmschmidt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 20:14   #25
Long Range Cruiser
 
MarkJ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,828
Images: 25
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by drakes View Post

it is an old boat a Pearson Vanguard.
Oh FFS! Its an American built boat!

It doesn't need to be imported.

It would have been nice to mention that in your first post. I don't spose you saw the relevance.

Not to worry.

Old owner de-flags. Then you pay. Then you re-flag if you want to.
__________________
MarkJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 21:13   #26
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 410
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

You can document a US or foreign built vessel for "Recreation" use without a builder's certificate if you have no intention of ever changing documentation to one of the commercial classifications. It's good to have though for the resale value.
__________________
jmschmidt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 23:38   #27
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Boat in Turkey, Beach cat in Israel
Boat: Lagoon 400 & Nacra 6.0 beach cat
Posts: 620
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by daugs View Post
are there not 3 things here, (1) clear title, no liens etc. (2) flagging and transferring from UK to US register, and (3) tax / VAT as maybe tax issues bringing into US or is that covered by Florida registration (I'm a brit so ???). If he purchased in Europe he may have decided to keep on British Flag as would be tax paid ? and therefore not had to deal with US tax issues given his dual citizenship, so while the registration bit maybe equivalent there maybe other issues.

Of course I maybe talking nonsense as I am not a tax expert but have been looking at something the other way round, a US flagged vessel, more out of curiosity, as will be in the market in a few years and so wanted to start to get my head around this type of stuff. There must be someone on here who has imported into US and registered. Sadly it all sounds like professional advice and legal / tax fees is needed. One thought is that another thread mentioned a buyers broker, if the guy selling has a broker then maybe a broker can help ?

If you work it out it would be good to post the answer here so others can use if they face similar issues.
Tax (VAT) in EC has nothing to do with vessels flag.
Only criteria are time related: age of boat, time spent in EC and such.
That means the owner could change flag without loosing 'paid VAT' status.
__________________
Mark, S/Y Bat-Yam
meirriba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2017, 23:43   #28
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Boat in Turkey, Beach cat in Israel
Boat: Lagoon 400 & Nacra 6.0 beach cat
Posts: 620
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
Mark.. I've owned 15 boats to date and not yet seen a builders certificate.. not even when I bought a 5yr old boat from Moorings with just the 1 owner..
I have surveyed about 12 boats last year (all in Europe, all European built) and have demanded and received a copy of builders cert. for each and every vessel.
Manufacturers e.g.: Bavaria, Beneteau, Swan, etc)
Sorry, one USA built Hunter as well.
__________________
Mark, S/Y Bat-Yam
meirriba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2017, 01:08   #29
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: London, UK
Posts: 15
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by meirriba View Post
Tax (VAT) in EC has nothing to do with vessels flag.
Only criteria are time related: age of boat, time spent in EC and such.
That means the owner could change flag without loosing 'paid VAT' status.
mmm

authorities want to see tax paid, US flagged boat owned by an American, visiting and not exeeded 18, no problem

EU flagged boat owned by EU citizen, boat been in Europe 1 yr and owner says I will leave (despite obvious ties to EU) seems open to challenge, depending on where as very different attitudes across EU states, but say nothing to do with it ignores the point that the authorities will look at differently.

Its like duty free shopping, your passport makes a difference and the flag is a vessels passport.

Agree that changing flag may not cause loss of tax paid status, if tax has been paid, but may do subsequently if vessel is outside some jurisdictions for several years
__________________
daugs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2017, 03:46   #30
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 31
Re: Foriegn flagged vessel?

Sorry about hijacking the thread but I am considering buying a US boat built and currently flagged in the US but will register it as a British flagged boat. What I am interested in is there a sales tax to be paid on a brokered sale and if there is can it be reclaimed on permanent export, is there a time limitation on how long you can keep a British flagged boat in the US.

Thanks
__________________

__________________
Vancouver Pete is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Australia Boat Ownership of Foreign Flagged Vessel millhouse_44 Destinations 2 18-07-2014 22:33
USA-Flagged VAT-Paid Vessel in Med ? bud-usa Europe & Mediterranean 17 25-04-2011 14:10
Import Duties on a US Flagged Vessel ocean.jedi Dollars & Cents 0 11-04-2011 12:58
UK flagged vessel with US owner caribcraig Rules of the Road, Regulations & Red Tape 6 16-12-2008 01:54
How long can a USA Flagged vessel stay capcook Rules of the Road, Regulations & Red Tape 8 22-07-2008 14:01



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 16:17.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.