Photos of Anchors Setting

[bazzer]

I'm certainly not saying that the CQR is great anchor, I have 45lb as my secondary, but how the hell you could bend the shaft is beyond me. Mine is a genuine "I" beam articulated shaft and the only way I could see it bending is if it were jammed in between rocks. If it sets it's a great anchor and with the correct scope it ploughs deep, just as it was designed to do. My main anchor is a genuine Bugel Stainless Steel and it works great, except on solid rock and of course I would not attempt to anchor over this kind of bottom.
But my view of any anchor that bends it's shaft remains the same, a piece of crap. Will Mantus replace your boat if it sinks as a result of the shaft bending! I don't think so.

But you are missing the real point, it doesn't matter how good or bad the anchor is, if it's not set correctly then it's just not going to work. The photos that nolex has kindly shown us is that most are not set at all.


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[Jim Cate]

But my view of any anchor that bends it's shaft remains the same, a piece of crap. Will Mantus replace your boat if it sinks as a result of the shaft bending! I don't think so.

Bazzer, you continue to belabor this point, conveniently ignoring the fact that Nolex's Mantus HAS a bent shank and yet continues to perform quite well. You also ignore that Mantus has upgraded the steel on current production, and has offered to replace the older ones if requested.

Oh, BTW, I too have seen more than one bent genuine CQR. Their forged shanks are very strong, but somewhat malleable. I don't know what situation bent any of the ones that I have seen, but bent they surely are.

I'm not a Mantus owner, but were I to need to replace my Supreme I would certainly be considering one as a candidate.

Jim

[bazzer]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Bazzer, you continue to belabor this point, conveniently ignoring the fact that Nolex's Mantus HAS a bent shank and yet continues to perform quite well. You also ignore that Mantus has upgraded the steel on current production, and has offered to replace the older ones if requested.

Oh, BTW, I too have seen more than one bent genuine CQR. Their forged shanks are very strong, but somewhat malleable. I don't know what situation bent any of the ones that I have seen, but bent they surely are.

I'm not a Mantus owner, but were I to need to replace my Supreme I would certainly be considering one as a candidate.

Jim

I'm. Labor ing no than nolex is labor ing how great the Mantus is. You yourself says it's performing quite well, is that the anchor you have?
Let's see the photos of these CQR's with the bent shanks. I'd bet they are the Chinese copies. Which is why we have the new generation of anchors. Quite a few years ago they stopped making Bruce and CQR's and the Chinese stamped out a lot of sub standard copies. Some smart people looked at the market and saw there was a real need for anchors and thus started the new generation. Maybe I'm wrong, but isn't forging very strong?
As I already said, let's see some photos of a a well set anchor of any maker instead of Mantus, Mantus. Etc.
the Mantus is a good design, but not well made, I certainly would not have a bolt together anchor, you can't beat a good seam weld, well at least Nasa thinks so. My guess is that it's much cheaper to ship a flat pack bolt together than a pre assembled one.


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[Coops]

Noelex puts photo's of the Mantus because that is what he is testing. He cannot show anchors that he does not have unless somebody anchors near him, and he has done that when it has occurred.

Coops.

[Uncle Bob]

Originally Posted by bazzer

I'm. Labor ing no than nolex is labor ing how great the Mantus is. You yourself says it's performing quite well, is that the anchor you have?
Let's see the photos of these CQR's with the bent shanks. I'd bet they are the Chinese copies. Which is why we have the new generation of anchors. Quite a few years ago they stopped making Bruce and CQR's and the Chinese stamped out a lot of sub standard copies. Some smart people looked at the market and saw there was a real need for anchors and thus started the new generation. Maybe I'm wrong, but isn't forging very strong?
As I already said, let's see some photos of a a well set anchor of any maker instead of Mantus, Mantus. Etc.
the Mantus is a good design, but not well made, I certainly would not have a bolt together anchor, you can't beat a good seam weld, well at least Nasa thinks so. My guess is that it's much cheaper to ship a flat pack bolt together than a pre assembled one.


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Bazzer, fair enough, we all have our opinions.
I was extremely cynical when Nolex started this thread but his show all pics, warts and all, have shown to one and all how different anchors perform in similar circumstances, some even with a bent shank and for this I have to offer thanks to Nolex and said mermaid.
All the best and thanks.
Oh and Bazzer I look forward to your photographic offerings.

[bazzer]

Originally Posted by Coops

Noelex puts photo's of the Mantus because that is what he is testing. He cannot show anchors that he does not have unless somebody anchors near him, and he has done that when it has occurred.



Coops.

Actually not true, if you look through his galley of pictures he has shown plenty of photo's of other anchors and he his self has a CQR on board. The common factor in all the others is they appear to have been badly set.
The best anchor? One that is the right size for the boat, the right size chain, correct amount of scope and setting correctly.
There are exceptions to the above , for example large ships depend on a very large anchor and heavy chain. Tugs in the Bay Area don't often bother with a anchor, just a few shots of their heavy towing chain and that's in the swift currents of the Carquines Straits .
I've just walked around my dock here in San Diego and the most popular anchor is the CQR. A few Bruce's around and the rest are Rocna's and Delta's.
All good anchors IMHO.


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[bazzer]

Originally Posted by Uncle Bob

Bazzer, fair enough, we all have our opinions.
I was extremely cynical when Nolex started this thread but his show all pics, warts and all, have shown to one and all how different anchors perform in similar circumstances, some even with a bent shank and for this I have to offer thanks to Nolex and said mermaid.
All the best and thanks.
Oh and Bazzer I look forward to your photographic offerings.

I'm in the process of changing boats, but I've just qualified as a OW PADI diver, so watch this space, and yours?


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[Coops]

Which part of what I said is not true Bazzer? You seem to be agreeing with me about the photos of other anchors.

Coops.

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by bazzer

As I already said, let's see some photos of a a well set anchor of any maker instead of Mantus, Mantus. Etc.

I have not been selective in choosing the anchors I have shown in this thread. I have posted at least one photo of every anchor I (or my mermaid) have seen underwater since I bought the camera.

So far I have managed to include almost every boat that has shared the same anchorage with me. The only exceptions have been boats that have arrived late and left early, or boats anchored so far away it is not practical to snorkel over to their anchor.

There are a lot of photos of the Mantus because that is on my bow. Once again I have posted photographs of its performance at every single anchorage and following any significant change due to wind etc.

I agree more photos from other people would be wonderful. There has been very little previously shown of how anchors behave in the real world.

[kas_1611]

Originally Posted by bazzer

you can't beat a good seam weld, well at least Nasa thinks so.

Seam welds fail. Often catastrophically and without any warning. I suggest you look up the Alexander Kielland oil rig disaster where a poor profile on a 6mm fillet weld and cold cracks in butt welds contributed to the sudden loss of rig stability, a rapid capsize and the loss of 123 men.

There are many different ways to join 2 pieces of metal; welding, brazing, bolting, riveting and even gluing (as Lotus do for the chassis of the Elise and Exige sportscar). Each has strengths and weaknesses so you can not definitively say that any one joint is better than another. Nasa also thought O-rings were a good idea didn't they.

One thing with the Mantus' bolts is you can replace the shaft in the event of damage, such as the bend Noelex's now has, instead of having to scrap the entire anchor, which has to be seen as an advantage for those without bottomless wallets.

So can we all agree that we all have our personal favourites and our own opinions of what makes a good anchor or not and leave them at the door so this thread can concentrate on what it was originally started for which is to show how anchors set or not as the case maybe. Noelex can not show us photos of any other anchor except his Mantus unless other vessels anchor nearby. I'd like to be able to share photos of my Delta in action but I do not have a waterproof camera nor can I dive to 5 or 10m due to ear problems.

Thanks

Keiron

[Fuss]

Originally Posted by bazzer

Yes indeed SS is weaker than some other steels. But my point is that a properly designed anchor should not bend in the first place. The Bugel shaft is pretty big and on my 35kg job I can't see it bending at all. Both the Rocna and the Mantus both have had shaft issues. I also jab a CQR hanging off the bowsprit and I think I'm right in saying the shaft on it is forged and it's very strong. Old design which has been around for
Many years and it just plain works once it is set.
I also question a bolt together anchor, I'd rather see a good solid weld

I have bent a 35 kg Bugel shank. It was not made of stainless steel.
If it had been, I am sure it would have bent as well.

The Bugel 35 kg has a long shank and it is 20mm thick. 20mm is not thick enough that it does not bend in marginal conditions. It is however alot thicker than some others.

I then just bent it back. If it had been your anchor Bazzer, you would have been shocked how easy I could bend it back to straight in an engineering workshop.

As I said in the thread about anchor shanks...They all are capable of bending.
They should not be solely judged on this.
Some bend more easily than would be desired. Others are more difficult.

[Maine Sail]

Originally Posted by bazzer

Let's see the photos of these CQR's with the bent shanks. I

Why limit it to just shanks? This CQR failed to give good sets after this bend..


S/V Celebration


Four bolts on the Manson have more cross section than the single hinge pin on the CQR..



And what about all the boats out there using one of these:

[colemj]

Holy Crap! We have arrived to a marina in Panama to leave the boat while we visit family. I just walked down our dock to look at anchors. There are 15 boats pulled in bow first so that I can see their anchors.

Seven of the fifteen have bent anchors! Several of them are genuine CQR's, as stamped into the forged shank. The rest make up a variety of types including FOB, Buegel, and Delta.

There were no bent Rocna's, although most of those looked rather new. There were no bent Spades, but there were only a couple of those. The only Bruce's were stainless ones on boats that looked like they had never left the marina to anchor.

Quite frankly, I am dumbfounded. It is difficult to believe that this is representative of anchors on boats in general, yet it is equally difficult to believe that an abnormally large number of boats with bent anchors just happen to be in this particular marina.

I'm off to walk more docks and maybe take some pics!

Mark

[Fuss]

it's also scary when you look at the shackles and swivels with splayed forks.


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[bazzer]

Originally Posted by Maine Sail

Why limit it to just shanks? This CQR failed to give good sets after this bend..


S/V Celebration


Four bolts on the Manson have more cross section than the single hinge pin on the CQR..



And what about all the boats out there using one of these:

Nice to see you take a interest on this thread. I'm not CSI but the CQR you show looks like it was past it's useful life. Was it a real CQR or a copy? What make of anchor swivel was that and why did it break? Or rather bend? Wrong size chain or wrong pin?
Anything can break if too much force is applied to it above what is designed to do. Once again "Use the right tool for the Job".
Yes, bad welds will break, but a good one joins too pieces of metal as if they were one.

Keep it coming guys!


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