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Old 25-03-2018, 17:15   #46
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Yarroweyah, Victoria. Australia
Boat: "Arapaho"
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Re: Isotherm CR165 Compressor Fridge

Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdEh Marine View Post
Pete .

Do you use Danfoss compressors or controllers in your systems ?

Regards John
No John, as you know we stopped using Danfoss compressors in 2010 when Danfoss sold their compressor manufacturing business to Secop who manufacture in China.
The compressors that you and others call Danfoss are actually Secop compressors made in China by Secop and as I have said before, in my opinion a better product than before specially if they are now using soft start Motor Driver Modules as suspected. Soft Start Motor Driver Modules will greatly reduce Motor Driver Module failures.
BTW have you had a chance to check the 650 Module you now have? I suspect (hope) it is a soft start module also.

Cheers, OzePete Ozefridge | 12 Volt Refrigeration Systems
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Old 25-03-2018, 17:40   #47
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Re: Isotherm CR165 Compressor Fridge

Quote:
Originally Posted by john61ct View Post
Sorry John 61, I didn't properly address your questions previously:
So is the above simply an evolved feature of compressor/kit manufacturers improving what's included, Yes, to the best of my knowledge the Motor Driver Modules are manufactured by others, not the compressor maker. These Modules have been notorious for failure in the past and now with more DC compressor makers in the field, compressor makers appear to be finally addressing the issue.

The issue is simple. You have a very limited and often messy power supply converted then trying to start an electric motor driving a compressor. In the past there was little option but to switch on the power DOL and hope the thing starts albeit putting all involved under extreme stress.

But these days technology has advanced and there are better ways and the best way is to start these copressors is slowly so as to eliminate the massive in rush current... SOFT START and fortunately most makers appear to be heading in this direction. Soft start Motor Driver Modules are now available with some compressors


or available with third-party add-ons?
We have been using soft start modules for many years and appreciate the difference in performance and reliability. Now that's fine for current production but there are thousands of earlier systems with doubtful Motor Driver Modules and therefore we are trialling our current Module in various older systems in the hope of being able to offer these as an after market replacement. This process will take time but will advise the outcome, either way, here

Could you give a similarly detailed rundown on Hard Start, and how either relates to the use of "capacitors", maybe other styles?Please see previous reply
Cheers OzePete Ozefridge | 12 Volt Refrigeration Systems
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Old 25-03-2018, 18:03   #48
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Re: Isotherm CR165 Compressor Fridge

Thanks Pete
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Old 26-03-2018, 06:38   #49
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Re: Isotherm CR165 Compressor Fridge

Hi Pete , sorry but I am a little confused . If you are not using Danfoss compressors in your systems , who manufactures your compressors and controllers.? And why are you introducing a soft start add on for a Danfoss compressor .

This is directly from Danfoss.



D a n f o s s C o m p r e s s o r s
4
Compressors
Starting current
Adjustment of
capacity
Direct solar opperated system.
The starting current of the compressor is important to
know as it is important for selection and sizing of the
solar panel.
Danfoss offers a dedicated solar electronic with a built
in soft start function that reduces the starting current
not to be bigger than the operating current. See curve
below.
This means that the selection / sizing of the panel have
to be done based on the cooling demand. However
Danfoss is recommending a 120 W solar panel. The
power consumption of the compressor can be found in
the datasheet. The code no for this dedicated electronic
unit is 101N0400.
Battery assisted system
In a battery assisted system a standard elecronic unit
101N0210 or 101N0300 should be used as the starting
current is not an important issue.

I also can confirm that the new controllers from Danfoss do not have a soft start function . I have tested our new 650 controllers and have found them to be very good . Very RF quiet , much less standby power usage, very smooth DC and 3 phase conversions.

We have never had a module failure due to HST the compressors are built for that .
https://www.secop.com/fileadmin/user...esi101e402.pdf

Regards John.
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Old 26-03-2018, 15:58   #50
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Re: Isotherm CR165 Compressor Fridge

John, I agree when module is wired correctly to boatís main two power busses and installed so air can pass through condenser only once module failures rarely will occur. When system design allows compressor high temperatures and high liquid pressures not only is module at risk but complete system is at risk.

If I were still in the refrigeration business I would follow compressor manufacturerís advice of using the standard option modules on complete systems sold. The after market only 101N212 and 101N0650 modules can create increased reliability concerns. If you are designing for larger than average capacity boat iceboxes then recommending a Danfossís AEO module to improve power consumption is correct. Refrigeration systems work best if their designs are kept simple and unnecessary complexity is avoided. Equipment in boat icebox conversion refrigeration units in most cases must be operated and maintained by the boats caption. With a choice between the Rube Goldberg or KISS principles which one will Captain or troubleshooting person prefer?

As I understand the 101N212 and 101N650 electronic control module design wonder how a technician remote from manufacturer can troubleshoot this module unless he has the interface tool 4 cool electronic adapter, and a laptop computer. Any suggestion to return unit to manufacturer is not practical. I do not see any default setting control to remove automatic functions like Negative Temperature Coefficient (NTC) or a way to remove or change personalized schedule keeping control over box temperature ECO.
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Old 27-03-2018, 14:46   #51
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Re: Isotherm CR165 Compressor Fridge

Hi Richard.

Yes simple is always better . We stay well within Danfoss spec as you can see below . These new controllers are the replacement for the old 210 and are supplied to us from Danfoss. Iím impressed. I havenít played the the laptop interface as yet , I may never . The factory settings are working just fine on our test machine .
Ambient temperature was 70F for these pictures

Regards John


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