OK, Small Snag on the New Boat . . .

[atoll]

hi been reading all your posts over the last month or so.
we ran an adventure sailing school for many years/miles taking many guests/crew a lot of whom had never sailed before or lived on a boat,98% loved it but invariably once in a while we would get someone whos expectations had led them to belive they could live on a boat,in a community,in a relatively challengeing enviroment
sadly for them they failed on every front ,the change is massive for a couch potato.

would really reccomend before you commit to the expense and commitment of buying a yacht going on a live aboard type sailing course for a week, (steve colgate type course)some people with the best will in the world are just non sailors.

may find you hate it and are better suited to having a large ruv/mobile home and touring the states that way...................

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by boatman61

As an RYA instructor I'd have thought you'd encourage a newbie learning at the least the rules of the road and navigation marks.... its not some mystic lore written in latin for the priviliged few.. its simple common sense.
As a matter of fact is that not how the RYA teach it Theory then Practical or does memory decieve me... and it can be done DIY... the quals come later.. as and when needed...

Well yes that's why I added the quip! Yes the RYA suggest the training then some experience. Then more training ( since you can't do many certificates without documented sea miles). But we live in a credentials orientated world and many newbies see training as a " fast track" to avoiding sea time. I don't belong to that school. In my experience if you're a complete sailing newbie, crew first. Don't worry about COLREGS etc. That's the skippers job. Just get a feel for it lots of newbies can find that actually " going to sea" on a sailing boat isn't for them.

PS I've sailed some of the ICW, it ain't like Norfolk at all !!

Dave

[snort]

Please take a couple of sailing classes just to know about the 'dangerous' parts of the boat, i.e., holding a hand on a line too close to the winch with only one turn around it and the sudden gust that fills the genoa and....

[Bergovoy]

i can undertand your comments and would probablyu say the same thing.. it is huge to going fro couch potato to sailing...

but, and I also believe thta in the worst case scensario like boatman stated, I could be a boat potato(e), [sic]

I certainly hope and believe that that wont be the case.... and you are correct, even though i indicated i connected sailing to 'my being anti social', I am sure there is a boating community there and everywhere...

I will participate there pretty much as i am here...

And I will eventually have the ability to sail off and park it somewhere reomote if needed/wanted...

I will look up the schools you suggested and see what they have to offer...

Ideally, I would love to meet someone has room for me and take me onboard for a week or so and go out with me.. I would be willing to pay a little bit, hopefully enough to make it worth while...

but, that is asking for a lot.. I am not sure i would do that for someone like me, with the info I have posted... and or believing they are busy with their own lives...

anyways... when i am there, I am sure I will meet folks... and things will just happen...I am not really expecting anything except from myself.. the question then become whether or not I am am able or willing to follow thru...

Originally Posted by atoll

hi been reading all your posts over the last month or so.
we ran an adventure sailing school for many years/miles taking many guests/crew a lot of whom had never sailed before or lived on a boat,98% loved it but invariably once in a while we would get someone whos expectations had led them to belive they could live on a boat,in a community,in a relatively challengeing enviroment
sadly for them they failed on every front ,the change is massive for a couch potato.

would really reccomend before you commit to the expense and commitment of buying a yacht going on a live aboard type sailing course for a week, (steve colgate type course)some people with the best will in the world are just non sailors.

may find you hate it and are better suited to having a large ruv/mobile home and touring the states that way...................

[goboatingnow]

One of the common concerns for newbies is the belief that because they know nothing they will find it hard to find crew positions.

One answer : club racing. These guys are always short of crew and you can start there. As for longer cruising sails if you can cook or play an instrument hey your onboard. I can teach a person the basics of sailing in about 4 hours. I don't need highly competent crew just enthusiastic ones willing to learn

Don't be worry the basic requirement for crew : a heart beat. LOL

Dave

[atoll]

see www.crewseekers.co.uk
lots of easy oppertunities for every skill level to go sailing or just hang out on boats,your are not the first and definitely not the last,the biggest challenge is the learning curve...................

[boatman61]

Well personally I think you've a damn good chance of doing OK....
When you first appeared on the scene I thought... Uhoh.... here we go... we've got a weird one here... troll.. bored surfer..?
But I've got to admit the way you've stuck to your guns and plodded on despite the crap thats been thrown to try and deter you has altered my thinking and started a grudging respect for your stubbornness and determination... a valuable thing in survival on the sea... and the flashes of self deprecating humour are great
There's often no help out there just ones own grim stubbornness to survive against the odds..
I wish you well and look forward to reading about your progress... and I'm pretty sure that CF will continue to throw advice your way as and when you need it...
Even if its stuff you sometimes rather not hear....

[CarlF]

You've mentioned several times that the current owner is willing to help out. This is wonderful - and not that unusual.

While cynics can find plenty of horror stories, most sailboat owners are very proud of their boat and really want the next owner to enjoy it as much as they did. I've bought eight boats. In each case the owner went above and beyond. One guy spent two days crawling through the boat explaining everything. Another showed up six months after the sale with a car load of spares and stuff he'd forgotten about in his garage - it hadn't been on the listing form but he wouldn't take any money for it.

I've returned the favor to the folks who have bought my boats and have stayed in regular touch with most. Several are good friends.

Maybe I've been unusually lucky, but I've also tried to make each transaction a "win-win". I show up with donuts (or beer if after noon). That sort of stuff.

The previous owner knows that boat better than anyone. I'd get her as involved as you can in this adventure.

Carl

[Seahunter]

Newbies can't learn how to boat from a book or the internet. They'll never feel the way to feather the throttle while docking before hitting the pilings, or how to sail into their slip without smashing their boom across their neighbor's freshly varnished toe-rail, or know when their anchors slipping and hopefully heading out to sea, or god forbid know where to find the brakes on their boat while coming in full throttle to the fuel dock or even find their way from A to B but can't find "B" on the chart, if they had one. But the biggest surprise self taught novices get comes when they find their teacher didn't know a thing, especially about the important things.
Take a course (USCG Approved are best), learn the rules, meet some people, share your boat, learn to sail, learn to navigate, and most important, become intimate with your boat. They're not called "She" for nothing. Get your hands dirty, suffer a nick or two ('cause "She" likes to bite), clean your bilge, learn the sound your bilge pump makes, replace a few holding tank fittings or maybe a head, run your batteries dry the first time out (doing it more than two times might require taking on something less demanding), then drink some warm beer because you thought the ice box was a fridge. Most of all get some experience; it's best teacher.

[Bergovoy]

oh, i agree completely... I have been on boats and see how they feather and anticipate and coast and maneuver and wouldnt think i could 'just do that.. I am guessing there is a way to learn how to learn the 'feel' out in the open... or some areas where you can play around and get used to things...

I am sure whomever teaches me will now how to enlighten me...

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Well yes that's why I added the quip! Yes the RYA suggest the training then some experience. Then more training ( since you can't do many certificates without documented sea miles). But we live in a credentials orientated world and many newbies see training as a " fast track" to avoiding sea time. I don't belong to that school. In my experience if you're a complete sailing newbie, crew first. Don't worry about COLREGS etc. That's the skippers job. Just get a feel for it lots of newbies can find that actually " going to sea" on a sailing boat isn't for them.

PS I've sailed some of the ICW, it ain't like Norfolk at all !!

Dave

G'Day DAve,

Mate, I think that you have really hit it on the head! The idea that one can substitute lessons/training/certificates for actual experience really bothers me, and out here in the cruising world we see the results of this mind set (and it ain't pretty sometimes).

ONce one has accumulated some sea time, usually sailing OPB or on a small one of your own, then specialized training to fill in the blanks can help progress.

I applaud your candor as a YRA instructor in voicing these views.

Cheers,

Jim

[rgscpat]

"There is no one perfect boat --
except maybe the next one."

Even though you can't learn to be a complete sailor from books, videos, or classes, they are useful and can head off many mistakes and clue you in on just what are the things you don't know (yet).

Signing up on crew lists and taking basic safety classes are good things and inexpensive -- or even free.

Hanging out with sailors is great, too; even if the advice isn't always on target or useful to your particular situation, after a while you'll get enough of a feel for what's right so that you can home in on what will work for you.

Learning on a smaller, less expensive boat is always great because the feedback from the boat is more immediate and mistakes are less expensive. Crewing on different boats makes the learning go faster. And, even bad examples (of skippers or ways to do things on boats) will be useful info for you.

Volunteering to help out with sailing events, or help a fellow boat owner work on a boat can also be useful for meeting people and watching how things are done.

[savoir]

Just a few comments on gear :

- you will never need electric winches anywhere on any 29 footer
- the only self tailers necessary on any 29 are the primaries (there will be one each side of the cockpit)
- I'm guessing that the primaries on the boat will be 20s (that's a size). You only need two and they should cost about $700 each. You will be dead and buried before they break.
- while you are practising just use the small jib, put a couple of wraps of rope on the winch and pull it on by hand.

As for the rest of the stuff, I turned 52 only a few days ago. Scary !



Now for that small snag.

[Bergovoy]

yea, i think i understand that electric winches arent reasonable/feasible...

the boat i am looking at a boat that has non self tailing, so i will learn on that, like many others have before me...

then if i want and figure out the difference, i may upgrade, or not...