Are YouTubers wrecking it for the rest of us?

[MuffinMan]

People always want to go on about their feelings and try to push governance on feelings. Congrats. AB5 was 100% feelings based and how many of them voted against their own interests because they are unable to think, only feel. I feel bad for the ones getting screwed by this. I can only laugh at the fools who got fired after voting for this.

[Mike OReilly]

I guess we're back into the mud... I think I'll move on. I've said all I need to say on this. Those of you who cannot understand that:

#1. Unless you're on a desert island, no one does anything on their own. As Newton said so elequently put it, "If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants." Those of us in developed countries are born lucky to be able to stand on very tall giants indeed. This doesn't, in any way, diminish the actions of the individual. It just places it in context.

#2. The concept of a living wage is as I stated earlier: someone working full time should at least achieve poverty-level income. Both "full time hours" and "poverty level" are well established in most civil societies. If you truly think it ok to pay people at levels below poverty, then I have no words for you. Why stop at poverty? Slavery is the next step.

Business operate under a whole range of limitations and strictures; from workplace safety to environmental requirements. Yet paying people at a level that allows them to at least be above poverty levels is a bridge too far for some? I really don't understand...

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I guess we're back into the mud... I think I'll move on. I've said all I need to say on this. Those of you who cannot understand that:

#1. Unless you're on a desert island, no one does anything on their own. As Newton said so elequently put it, "If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants." Those of us in developed countries are born lucky to be able to stand on very tall giants indeed. This doesn't, in any way, diminish the actions of the individual. It just places it in context.

#2. The concept of a living wage is as I stated earlier: someone working full time should at least achieve poverty-level income. Both "full time hours" and "poverty level" are well established in most civil societies. If you truly think it ok to pay people at levels below poverty, then I have no words for you. Why stop at poverty? Slavery is the next step.

Business operate under a whole range of limitations and strictures; from workplace safety to environmental requirements. Yet paying people at a level that allows them to at least be above poverty levels is a bridge too far for some? I really don't understand...

Business owners have a responsibility to abide by the law this includes award wages, I'm not seeing my big bad business friends doing anything less, I fail to understand your argument, personally my business created jobs that never existed before, jobs that fed and housed people, that's something I can be proud of, more than done my bit.....people have choices in first world countries like Australia, if they dont have the brains, energy or desire to take them ,so be it.

Life rewards action, I learnt that young, handouts encourage dependence, see that often....teach a man to fish thing.

[cyan]

if I've connected the right dots here...
YouTube sailing vloggers should get a living wage. They show up to the boat every day and roll video and work on editing. It's only fair.
Now then, how to pay for the ones with few subscribers, little ad revenue, and not much in the Patreon cup? Well, duh. Tax the richest country in the history of the world to pay for it. Or maybe tax boaters. 'Haven't worked out that part of the worker's paradise yet...

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by cyan

if I've connected the right dots here...
YouTube sailing vloggers should get a living wage. They show up to the boat every day and roll video and work on editing. It's only fair.
Now then, how to pay for the ones with few subscribers, little ad revenue, and not much in the Patreon cup? Well, duh. Tax the richest country in the history of the world to pay for it. Or maybe tax boaters. 'Haven't worked out that part of the worker's paradise yet...

Excellent point, subsidy for non successful bloggers.....I'm going to grab that camera now.

[cyan]

Originally Posted by daletournier

Excellent point, subsidy for non successful bloggers.....I'm going to grab that camera now.

Wait- we could solve the wealth inequality of YouTube sailing vloggers. All their revenue should go into a collective pot, and get redistributed. It's just not fair that Delos and LaVagabonde should be in the 1% of sailing vloggers while others work just as hard. Equality = fairness, no?

[jmh2002]

Here are some other bloggers to consider:

YouTube's top earners: Eight-year-old Ryan tops list with $26m

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50835222

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Sojourner

Wow, YES, it is fair to criticize that. How about hiring illegal workers? That fits right in here with this logic, no? Or cheating on taxes? I'm just trying to make a new venture, guys, let me scam and hurt people for a few years to get going, and then i'll be good i swear.

C'mon. Pay a living wage like every other business, add it to your costs, and pass them along to the customers. If you feel some employees would prefer the uncertainty of tipped life (altho don't forget not everyone cleans up 200 bucks a night, not all days are weekends and not all restaurants are in affluent places), then give those workers the choice of tipped or salaried at minimum wage (which is still too low).

If society cannot afford to pay all people a living wage at minimum (don't even get me started on universal health care like every other decent country in the world)--if the very people who live there do not support the weakest or most at risk among them--then the very foundations of it are f-ed up, and nothing at all to be proud of.

With respect it seems you've never owned a business that employs people, it tends to change your views from idealist to realistic. Btw, I dont know businesses that are hiring illegals , I'm not seeing anyone here suggesting business owners break the law, why are you viewing it that way?

You ,like I are living the dream, maybe in order to be fair we should sell our boats and in the name of equality distribute the proceeds?

[Pelagic]

Originally Posted by jmh2002

Here are some other bloggers to consider:

YouTube's top earners: Eight-year-old Ryan tops list with $26m

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50835222

Those income numbers are AMAZING!... I had no idea of the extremes which underlies the issue of talking about "fairness" in any social transaction.

You really need to define and agree exactly where the lines are between :
Slavery
Poverty
Poor
Working class
Middle class
Affluent
Wealthy

Slavery and starvation poverty is abhorrent yet still prevalent in many regions due to wars/famine/dictatorships/natural disasters and genocide......the rest of the world looks on in horror yet does little to keep those cycles from repeating.

The rest:
Poor
Working class
Middle class
Affluent
Wealthy.....
Is where discussions get muddy and confused over moral decisions.

If a young woman sells her body on the street rather than get a job at McDonalds, because it pays more, would the best solution be to raise the pay rate at McDo?.

If new sailing blogs trend towards. 'Porn on a Boat'....content, is that ok, if it makes them affluent?

We are all poor in some things and wealthy in others.....
Where does Freedom, self reliance, health, passion factor into those who want to "Equalize" humanity.

All these troubling thoughts were the reason I chose NOT to have children.

Would protecting my child inadvertently endanger others?

My point is that these discussions do not simply have a yes or no solution and Mike is right to file it away under the frustration column

[MuffinMan]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

#2. The concept of a living wage is as I stated earlier: someone working full time should at least achieve poverty-level income. Both "full time hours" and "poverty level" are well established in most civil societies. If you truly think it ok to pay people at levels below poverty, then I have no words for you. Why stop at poverty? Slavery is the next step.

Business operate under a whole range of limitations and strictures; from workplace safety to environmental requirements. Yet paying people at a level that allows them to at least be above poverty levels is a bridge too far for some? I really don't understand...

I agree with you Mike. But I ask you whos line? If you make more than 32k a year you are the 1% of the world. If you dont live on less than 2 dollars a day you are not below the poverty line in the world. Do you only mean in Western countries?

If your saying that we need to prop up the countries that are still in the 3rd world of poverty with children dieing of diseases we cured long ago.... well I can agree with the sentiment but I'd have a lot of questions about how we went about that, also we are already doing that.

I see homeless living in shanty shacks sure, but none not getting medical care when they go to an ER and none looking bloated and emaciated from hunger. Plenty have money for booze, drugs, cellphones. Many do it by choice. Some are victims of circumstance. Those few do not absolve the rest who could have taken it into their own hand to not be in the position they are in. Being a begger in the West is so lucrative some people do it as a job.

In western countries even our poorest people have better access to resources than these other countries. Even if your peniless the amount of food shelters, health services, welfare and everything you get to have already comes out of our pockets. I am ok with (most) of those taxes as we cant abondon our struggling class. However at no point does compassion absolve responsibility. Even if you have nothing, that means you have no where to go but up and the western world is the easiest place there has ever been in the history of the world to do it.


https://www.investopedia.com/article...cent-world.asp

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/futur...ction-in-2019/

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-part-of-the-1